CZ 600 Trail Bolt Action Rifle in Canada 1200.00 USD
- Thread starter IRUNGUNS
- Start date
Or the domestic guns do the job we want. Although I see what you mean. Not terribly envious. If anyone wanted those features theres aftermarket support. Not really planning on a ccaliber change, but then again I've bought two Americans for about the price of the Trail. The length aint a prob.
so if its reliable and accurate and compact enough for what it will be doing, cool!
If everyone likes their CZs, also cool. They look great.
I would not know what to do with a rifle in 300 Blackout. Easier to reload but we have so much surplus and cheap ammo for 7.62x39 available, so why? We also do not have AR15 anymore, so why again? That's why the Americans like it but for us here, nope.
I chose it cause I like handloading it and I already have tons of 223 brass. 20 grains of H110 gets a 110gr monometal going 2400 fps from a 16" barrel. Plethora of .308 cal bullets to choose from.
7.62x39 is a much more straightforward choice for cheap shooting but I'm weird lol
7.62x39 is a much more straightforward choice for cheap shooting but I'm weird lol
Maybe nope for you, but not necessarily for the rest of us. Bulk 7.62x39mm isn't all that inexpensive anymore in case you hadn't noticed, particularly if you (like me) prefer to run non-corrosive ammo through your precious firearms. The price of .300 Blackout ammo is not terribly far removed from other factory offerings at approximately $1.50 per round. I also prefer not to deal with the funky/wonky 7.62x39mm "STANAG-style" magazines which are known to have feeding issues. I'd much rather run true STANAG mags which function 100% with (you guessed it), .300 Blackout. Furthermore, the American cartridge is fully stabilized and is optimized for full powder burn when fired from a 9" Barrel. I'm not sure about the requirements of 7.62 Russian, however I suspect that equally compact Barrels are not on the menu. Nor is the accuracy potential of both cartridges comparable, with .300 Blackout easily besting any 7.62x39mm ammo that I am familar with in terms of measured group sizes. My Bushmaster ACR and Troy PAR both sport .300 Blk Barrels, so the cartridge is far from the exclusive domain of the AR15 as you mistakenly believe. Reliability is top-notch and I get very good results from both rifles in the accuracy department. With the forthcoming addition of my CZ 600 Trail, I will soon have 3 non-AR15 rifles chambered in .300 Blk. I find it to be a very fun and versatile cartridge, even without the added ability to go suppressed, so that is all the reasoning I need to stick with the .300 Blackout!
I am sure that I could come up with additional reasons to prefer the .300 Blackout over the 7.6x39mm Russian round if I sat here and put a great deal of thought into it. That said, even my superficial reasoning above offers plenty of reason to select the .300 over the 7.62mm round. At the end of the day, the .300 Blackout possesses desireable characteristics and capabilities that the 7.62x39mm Russian round does not share. Simple, at least from my admittedly biased perspective.
Perhaps it is possible that some of us are just a ways ahead of you on the experiential curve when it comes to the newer cartridge. So maybe you will come around in time. Or not. Either way, I'm good...
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^ The 300 AAC cartridge provides 'slightly' better accuracy due the wider selection of bullets available which is not really an issue for the recreational shooter since other factors have to be eliminated first. I get the points which do not contradict from mine, except that you can get none corrosive ammo for 50 cents/round and there is still lost of surplus available - which will not dry up I believe since it will not be used in war zones. Those are my main points.
The 300AAC is an excellent choice of round for the black rifle crowd. I see that you mostly own high end rifles, most of which were restricted even before the ban and are now off the table. BCL for example tends to agree with you and I would not be surprised if they will offer the Siberian in 300AAC which they do for the bolt action rifles - but I guess the market in Canada is still too small for that round.
I have to be honest, I never owned an AR15 due to it's restricted status BS. I did not feel the need since the CZ 58 was my gun of choice as 'black rifle'. Sadly both are now prohibited.
The 300AAC is an excellent choice of round for the black rifle crowd. I see that you mostly own high end rifles, most of which were restricted even before the ban and are now off the table. BCL for example tends to agree with you and I would not be surprised if they will offer the Siberian in 300AAC which they do for the bolt action rifles - but I guess the market in Canada is still too small for that round.
I have to be honest, I never owned an AR15 due to it's restricted status BS. I did not feel the need since the CZ 58 was my gun of choice as 'black rifle'. Sadly both are now prohibited.
PPU 7.62x39 was near MOA in my Ranch. It's about 1.50 a pull. I wonder what the RUAG fmj that was sold in cans of 900 for $600 or so shot like in a good accurate rifle.
The Hornady offerings shoot, too. Used to be cheaper but that's just the way
The Hornady offerings shoot, too. Used to be cheaper but that's just the way
Exactly - .300 Blk is the ideal means of launching .30 cal projectiles from the AR15 Platform. I was, and remain an "all in" member of the "black Rifle" genre, so my affinity for the .300 Blk is perhaps understandable in that context. I have never found $.50 per round non-corrosive 7.62x39mm ammo and still have a few rifles chambered in that "classic" calibre so would appreciate a solid lead. I'll wait....
I think that is the fundamental problem with this discussion.- you are missing essential context having never owned and fully experienced the absolute superiority of the AR15 platforrm. From its unbeatable ergonomics to its incredibly soft recoil, there is very good reason that the AR15 has become "America's Rifle". That you missed out on AR15 ownership explains a great deal about your affinity for the Russian cartridge, whose greatest claim to frame is its cheap cost. It also explains the "odd man out" disdain that you seem to hold for "black rifles" in general. It can all be summed up by your lack of experience with the AR15. To bad you never took the opportunity to own and/or fire one. You would then understand what the rest of us already intuitively know.
The ability to fire .30 cal pills out of my ARs with an effective range of 400m is what appeals to me about the .300 Blk. Can 7.62x39mm Russian do the same? Yes, BUT not with a simple barrel-swap, and not with the same Bolt-face, and not with a standard STANAG magazine. Those features of the .300 Blk, along with the much more forceful impacts on steel targets, are what keep me coming back for more!
^ You can buy the Norinco red box non corrosive at Cabelas or Tenda for 50 cents/round. Quite accurate ammo.
I did say that I never owned an AR15 but I shot a few. I understand the concept of modularity and I would have owned one or 2 or 3 if they would not have been restricted. This is by no means a negativity against the AR platform. I really like the 556/223 cartridge, I own a few rifles in that caliber, the VZ 58 came in both 7.62x39 and 223. I even owned a 11.8 VZ 58 in 223 but sold it due to the classification. Maybe it does not bother you but it is and was big turn off for me. I did not even own handguns for years but got hyped up due to the recent 'ban'.
I did say that I never owned an AR15 but I shot a few. I understand the concept of modularity and I would have owned one or 2 or 3 if they would not have been restricted. This is by no means a negativity against the AR platform. I really like the 556/223 cartridge, I own a few rifles in that caliber, the VZ 58 came in both 7.62x39 and 223. I even owned a 11.8 VZ 58 in 223 but sold it due to the classification. Maybe it does not bother you but it is and was big turn off for me. I did not even own handguns for years but got hyped up due to the recent 'ban'.
The AR recoil and ergonomics are *that* much better than any other similiar modern service rifle as to own one makes one instantly recognize it?
Musta never measured down to the hundreth of a second lol.
Not a big fan of restricteds either and I've had a few. Including ARs. Love em. Woulda still had one if they were NR. Comes down more to having to pay money to be a member of a club to use my own property, not being able to hunt with em, etc etc.
Can def see why a competition shooter in the elite levels would care about what may or may not be better ergos, a few percent less recoil, etc.
There seems to be quite a bit of romanticizing of a rifle and its cartridges going on here. The Venn diagram overlap of any service rifle and cartridge including 5.56mm and 7.62x39mm is way bigger than the areas where they don't. Demanding one instead of the other seems, to me at least, an almost entirely "between your ears" sort of thing and one to wax poetic about if it makes you feel good.
Rubber meeting road, not so much. One will do just about all what the other will do, the large majoriy of the time...which makes claiming one to be inherently superior and that someone would instantly have that road to Damascus revelation by merely touching or using one, pretty amusing.
Just this peanut up in the gallery lol
Musta never measured down to the hundreth of a second lol.
Not a big fan of restricteds either and I've had a few. Including ARs. Love em. Woulda still had one if they were NR. Comes down more to having to pay money to be a member of a club to use my own property, not being able to hunt with em, etc etc.
Can def see why a competition shooter in the elite levels would care about what may or may not be better ergos, a few percent less recoil, etc.
There seems to be quite a bit of romanticizing of a rifle and its cartridges going on here. The Venn diagram overlap of any service rifle and cartridge including 5.56mm and 7.62x39mm is way bigger than the areas where they don't. Demanding one instead of the other seems, to me at least, an almost entirely "between your ears" sort of thing and one to wax poetic about if it makes you feel good.
Rubber meeting road, not so much. One will do just about all what the other will do, the large majoriy of the time...which makes claiming one to be inherently superior and that someone would instantly have that road to Damascus revelation by merely touching or using one, pretty amusing.
Just this peanut up in the gallery lol
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Cabelas is where I'd been getting it too. I wouldn't wait too long on that one lol.
3 MOA from my Ranch. Heck, considering I'm shooting it from offhand and field positions most of the time as practice for hunting and my bigger rifles? Misses are on me lol
