CZ Shadow vs Tanfoglio Stock III for IPSC production

relliott said:
Cz mainsprings never get close to maximum compression so the stacking isn't apparent there. Note also that that sensation of stacking in the Tanfo can be used to your advantage, since you end up with essentially a 2-stage trigger. So on your first shot you can take-up to the stacking point on during the last few inches of your target acquisition, then once you get your visual confirmation of an acceptable sight picture you can pull the rest of the way through. Very revolver-like.
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This is what I am loving about the smooth DA I have now! Yesterday I went to test the trigger with a friend who brought his CZ Shadow and I couldn't figure the stacking out on his when dry firing. I would practice the draw and try to get the trigger in position but it seemed to stack real early and not at a definite spot. With my trigger now I can get the trigger into position as I am pushing the gun forward before target acquisition. All this without needing to have hulk like finger strength to pull the DA like it was when I got it stock. lol I am really, really loving this trigger now.
 
My cz has absolutly no stacking at all, one nice smooth trigger pull, one of them is sub 4 pounds and 100% reliable even with winchester primers. (not used in ipsc). Robert, I guess we might disagree on one thing. I thought a lot of the stacking on the tangfo was due to the shorter spring stacking but if you just bring the hammer back by hand it is very smooth and consistant with it not getting noticabley harder. I think it has more to due with the geometry of the gun. Just my thoughts.
 
Re: stacking at the rear.....it has to do with the let off of the rear part of trigger bar, vs the bottom of the sear cage and the back angled part...also the disconnector may need mild polishing top and bottom, and front edges. You also need to work in the trigger....dryfire, dryfire, dryfire. I use slide glide lite on everything. Oil wears off .
 
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Perry Wood said:
My cz has absolutly no stacking at all, one nice smooth trigger pull, one of them is sub 4 pounds and 100% reliable even with winchester primers. (not used in ipsc). Robert, I guess we might disagree on one thing. I thought a lot of the stacking on the tangfo was due to the shorter spring stacking but if you just bring the hammer back by hand it is very smooth and consistant with it not getting noticabley harder. I think it has more to due with the geometry of the gun. Just my thoughts.
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It's really the accumulated result of both. Look at it this way; if you're thumb-cocking it you won't really feel the stacking because you just have too much leverage against it. If you remove the sear cage and hold the stirrup in engagement with the interrupter while drawing the trigger back, you'll feel it stack. Now put the cage back in without the sear and you'll feel the stack getting magnified by the ramp, since it is basically wedging/deflecting the stirrup (which is loading up force on the interrupter bar) out of engagement. Prying it out, essentially. What's happening is: as the force on the mainspring increases due to compression, so does the force applied to the interrupter and thus, so does the friction increase between these components and the ramp. The parts can be smoothed considerably and if lubed with a good quality grease rather than oil, you'll get a "floating" effect, which will reduce the drag in the system quite a bit. On single action-only Tanfo's the ramp serves no purpose so on my own guns I would grind them off. I had one of those kicking around for a while and used it to "debug" the drag in the D/A guns. It was very enlightening.

If the Tanfo had a longer spring the feeling of stacking would still be there but it would be reduced.

CZ's don't stack in the D/A stroke. If anything, they do the opposite. Longer spring and different geometry.
 
relliott said:
Right. And you can't cut the mainspring either. Exactly..springs are a dime dozen. The Stock2 used to come with a 16b...the new I got came with a 15lb. You can get 14lb and 13lbs It will destroy the spring and take you out of Production...technically. Try assembling the gun with the sear removed (install the cage only) and stroke the D/A. The sear return spring accounts for very little of the total pull weight, so this will show you what you're really dealing with. Your trigger return spring will account for some of the pull and the rest of it comes from the mainspring. A 13 lb mainspring should give consistent ignition with most primers, but lighter than that and you're pushing it. If you "over-tune" the trigger return spring you will end up with a flaccid feeling reset, and you'll be constantly trigger freezing. +1,...I like the crisp reset..Note that the Tanfo Mainspring is a lot shorter than the CZ's. As such, as it gets closer to maximum compression it stacks up (increases) markedly just before the hammer is released. This sensation is exacerbated by the contact area above the the hammer hooks which drag across the underside of the sear, and by the nodes on the bottom of the cage which push the D/A interrupter bar out of engagement with the trigger stirrup to fire the gun. These areas can be polished for smoothness and the sear spring can be tweaked a little to reduce drag pressure. Grease rather than oil on these surfaces improves feel considerably.
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Thanks Rob..excellent advice. ....and trust me when I say this,...I have had my experiments with factory parts and ruined a few. OEM parts will work best, even the new sears are much better than the old ones,...hardened thru-out. Most just need polishing to smooth them...don't remove stuff.
 
maurice said:
Thanks Rob..excellent advice. ....and trust me when I say this,...I have had my experiments with factory parts and ruined a few. OEM parts will work best, even the new sears are much better than the old ones,...hardened thru-out. Most just need polishing to smooth them...don't remove stuff.
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Absolutely. The old sears were crap but the new stuff is nicely hardened. They'll hold a decent trigger job forever.
 
I am done everything I wanted to do. Trigger, sight and grips. Can't wait to try it other than club nights. First match with it will be Brant Level II next Saturday. :)

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I've been stalking this thread and this final product photo has drawn me out... pretty sweet looking piece, Mr. babes.:cool: I want more trigger time myself so I'm taking my BB next month - perhaps we'll be seeing more of each other on the shootout line. haha!
 
The Baron said:
I've been stalking this thread and this final product photo has drawn me out... pretty sweet looking piece, Mr. babes.:cool: I want more trigger time myself so I'm taking my BB next month - perhaps we'll be seeing more of each other on the shootout line. haha!
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Thanks man. Be nice to see you around at some matches. You will love the selection IPSC has for matches to shoot. Great sign up website as well for the matches.
 
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