cz858 vers keltec su16

the_klenzer said:
I'd trust my life to the VZ58/CZ858.

I'd trust YOUR life to the SU16. :)
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lol!
Never even seen an SU16 in real life to be honest, but anything new like that is going to have teething problems, especially when it isn't a mass-produced product like something with military contracts (way more samples to evaluate for design shortcomings, etc.)
I'd go with the VZ. Time will tell how the SU16 holds up. The VZ has a 50+ year head start on that.
 
VZ will run like an AK if you keep it reasonably clean, at least the chamber anyways. Accuracy is similar, both are small and lightweight. Get both and sell the one you dont like. Or keep both. Or buy one while you save for the other. VZ will outlast all the ammo you can buy for it, SU may have issues.
 
I feel that the 58-pattern guns can be taken fairly seriously and I would not hesitate to use one as a fighting gun. In fact I took one through Ken Hackathorn's advanced carbine class and it performed extremely well. There were several there; no hitches at all. Mine would feed empties as well as loaded cartridges. Doing malfunction drills was actually difficult; it was hard to make it stop running. They are not prone to the issues of the AK or the AR at all. However I have zero knowledge of the .223 versions and could not comment on whether they're worthwhile at all.


I consider Kel-tec stuff to be entertaining at times. I kind of like their ridiculous shotgun. I would never, ever trust their stuff for serious use.

I would put a good x39 VZ or 858 against any AK or AR for reliability. With a few tweaks they run very fast. The only real disadvantages, IMO, are the somewhat fragile, rock-and-lock mags, non-chrome-lined barrels on the NR ones for the most part, and varying spec on the different versions (which I suspect leads to the so-called gremlin). And I'm not a huge fan of x39, although I do have crates of the stuff on hand (hey, it's cheap).
 
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