Czeck 7.62X39

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Readyrod

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There is a hunter on The High Road forum called Caribou who does the subsistence hunting thing in Alaska. (His pictures and stories are great) He uses a Mosin with Czech ammo. He says that the ammo is an effective hunting round because it tumbles. Does anyone know if this is the same for the Czech 7.62X39. Does it tumble when it hits it's target?
 
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yes FMJ is illigal to hunt with, mayhaps somebody is blowing smoke up this guys ass. Also I can't say I've ever seen any of my Czech surplus rounds make a keyhole on my targets.
I thought it was 5.56 nato that tumbled on impact. See a crappy ineffective round like the 5.56 needs a lil tumble to help it out with the killing, i can't see any reason why the 7.62x54r would need the same, it's got very good power. Maybe his rifleing is worn on his Nagant and doesn't spin the projectile properly.
 
He is a native hunter, I think, and says that it is legal where he is. I don't want to hunt with the stuff, I'm just curious. He does a lot of hunting so I kind of believe him on the tumbling claim. He says that the Russian and Bulgarian doesn't tumble. He also takes some long shots so I imagine his gun is in good condition.
I'm just wondering if the sks ammo tumbles.
 
I thought it was illegal to use FMJ because the bullets go right through animals without deforming, not ensuring a kill even if you hit vitals. I bet there's alot of animals running around that guys area with gunshot wounds.
 
It is unlikely that a FMJ will show a keyhole in a paper target, if the bullet was stable after leaving the barrel. But a non-expanding spitzer bullet's center of gravity is at it's base, so when the bullet impacts a live target, due to the greater than air density of that target, the base tends to pass the nose of the bullet.

As can be seen in the drawings below, when a FMJ tumbles, straight line penetration is lost, and the wound cavity remains narrow.

AK-47762x39mmjpg655234pixels.jpg


AK-74545x39jpg653345pixels.jpg


M193jpg655428pixels.jpg


A properly constructed game bullet's center of gravity moves to the nose as the bullet expands, resulting in a large wound volume and straight line penetration.

308Winchesterjpg653406pixels.jpg


Game can be taken successfully with military FMJ ammo, but this is often illegal, and clearly a proper expanding bullet performs better.
 
Rick65Cat said:
It is a nation wide law
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Each Canadian province addresses this a little differently, and in some provinces non-expanding game bullets are legal but not military FMJ, while others stipulate that big game bullets must be designed to expand. What is allowed for use in Alaska by subsistence hunters I don't know, but it is unlikely they would be bothered by officials in any case.
 
I don't by any means endorse this method, but I know an eastern european guy who used to use FMJ for hunting. He would make 2 cuts in the tip ##### crossing each other. He claimed that this would allow it to expand and he claims it worked almost as well as soft points on game. I am very skeptical that that is the case. He says that he just didn't have access to soft points back home, or he couldn't afford them.
 
evilhaze said:
I thought it was illegal to use FMJ because the bullets go right through animals without deforming, not ensuring a kill even if you hit vitals. I bet there's alot of animals running around that guys area with gunshot wounds.
Click to expand...

Depending on where/ what you are hunting, it may be legal...not necessarily the best choice, but not illegal in Ont.

CannonFodder41 said:
Thanks, I thought it was a nationwide law.
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NO...as you know hunting laws are set by the Provinces...there are no "nationwide" hunting laws, except for migratory birds.
And the OP said Alaska, so I have no idea what is/isn't allowed.

Rick65Cat said:
It is a nation wide law
Click to expand...

Ummm.....NO! ;)
 
beefman said:
Depending on where/ what you are hunting, it may be legal...not necessarily the best choice, but not illegal in Ont.



NO...as you know hunting laws are set by the Provinces...there are no "nationwide" hunting laws, except for migratory birds.
And the OP said Alaska, so I have no idea what is/isn't allowed.



Ummm.....NO! ;)
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Not necessarily true. Seals for example fall under Federal game regulations. It is illegal to hunt seals with fmj bullets. Therefore it is illegal to hunt with fmj bullets all across Canada (for seals anyways) However I highly doubt your gonna kill to many seals in Saskatchewan...
 
davemccarthy707 said:
Not necessarily true. Seals for example fall under Federal game regulations. It is illegal to hunt seals with fmj bullets. Therefore it is illegal to hunt with fmj bullets all across Canada (for seals anyways) However I highly doubt your gonna kill to many seals in Saskatchewan...
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Somebody better tell the Inuit who hunt seals with their Ranger rifles and issue ammo, although soft poiints have been issued over the last 15 years or so. I doubt that you will see many COs checking northern natives to ensure they are using the approved ammo, and the only laws that count are those that are enforced atleast enforceable.
 
oneskilledshooter said:
I don't by any means endorse this method, but I know an eastern european guy who used to use FMJ for hunting. He would make 2 cuts in the tip ##### crossing each other. He claimed that this would allow it to expand and he claims it worked almost as well as soft points on game. I am very skeptical that that is the case. He says that he just didn't have access to soft points back home, or he couldn't afford them.
Click to expand...

My Dad said that was common practice when hunting game in Germany with .303 ball during the early post-war period. Good for morale and their food left a bit to be desired. Although the term was inaccurate, he said they called them Dum Dums.
 
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