Daniel Defense AR vs Norinco

Ganderite

Ganderite

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A friend of mine bought a new Daniel Defense M4. I supplied him the ammo to shoot in the CQB match.

The rifle would not digest about 1 in10 of my rounds. The bolt would not close and had to be pounded open. At the range I assumed it was some crap in the chamber, since the same ammo worked just fine in another fellow's SGW AR15.

This is the ammo I make for my Norc M4gery.

The brass is full length sized.

I have just cleaned the barrel and chamber of the Daniel Defense and tried to run some of my ammo through the rifle. Same problem. Some rounds will not chamber. Judging by the scuff marks, the brass is too fat in the half inch near the case head.

The rounds that chamber are about 0.375" at the web. The cases that won't chamber are 0.396" to 0.378"

I took some of the rounds that would not chamber in the DD and ran them through my Norc. No problem at all.

I am wondering if DD is using a SAAMI minimum match chamber? But even that should accept a full length sized case. No?

I have looked at chamber reamer specs. They run about 0.3795 to 0.380", so my ammo looks like it should fit.
 
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WEll I was at that CQB match and we all thought the AR was a Norinco or something the way it was jamming all the time.

But to find out it was a new DD, it was shocking and we all chocked it up to ammo.

Regarding the problem, I have no idea.

Nice rifle though.
 
Soooo....


The DD wouldn't eat ammo you make for you're norc?


Next time just tell him to run factory ammo, since IIRC specs are .355 and 223 wylde are .372


Can't wait to see how the rest of this thread goes
 
Farmboy said:
Soooo....


The DD wouldn't eat ammo you make for you're norc?


Next time just tell him to run factory ammo, since IIRC specs are .355 and 223 wylde are .372


Can't wait to see how the rest of this thread goes
Click to expand...

:rolleyes:

if it works in a #### ass norinco it should work in a "ubersuperdeetastic" name brand AR.
That was his point. loaded ammo is usually much better than factory.
 
That was his point. loaded ammo is usually much better than factory.
Click to expand...


I had a buddy that reloaded for his Ruger .223. Those same rounds wouldn't fit in my Savage .223.

Bullets weren't seated deep enough.
 
jdman said:
:rolleyes:

if it works in a s**t ass norinco it should work in a "ubersuperdeetastic" name brand AR.
That was his point. loaded ammo is usually much better than factory.
Click to expand...

I disagree... The Norc's tolerances are way looser that the DD. Because of this, ammo flops around in the chamber but will allow out of tolerance ammo to feed where the "ubersuperdeetastic" gun is fussier about wide tolerance ranges in diameter... makes perfect sense to me.:p
 
I've got a Savage 25 and a Norc M4, the Savage absolutely won't take a .377" (if I recall) at the shoulders, and the Norc gets pretty fussy just a tad bigger. Out of about 500 rounds I had, for some reason about 20 were oversided, and had to be pulled, powder emtpied, and full sized (without the decapper pin), then reassembled. All rounds are now as full-resized, nothing else.

On both, the symptoms were that the bolts would *almost* close, just an eighth of an inch short. Both very hard to eject. The Norc was a butt-slam into the ground a couple times while holding the cocking handle. The Savage was a careful hammering on the bolt handle while pulling back (som many things could have broken!). Now I'm super careful.

I had read that if you're trying to get some precision/predictability out of a bolt action, just neck-size the brass that came out of it. So I was marking Saveg-fired from Norc. Nuh-uh, that's off my list for good. All brass goes through the full resize - I don't care if it's extra wear or affects accuracy. Seeing the Savage bolt seized like that was distressing. (Again, the Norc is a low enough price point that I have no problems abusing it).
 
http://www.6mmbr.com/223rem.html

Always get a chuckle when shooters get "religious" about a brand of AR. They are a man made product held to a varying degree of dimensions.

If A doesn't fit in B, don't use it. Simple.

The Norc has a larger chamber which makes it easier to keep running with a wide range of ammo. That is neither good nor bad but likely what a 556 NATO chamber is supposed to be.

If the headspace was over length or under length, then that becomes a safety issue. Beyond that, chambers vary....

If the DD has an undersized chamber, start with new brass and don't shoot other ammo. Or take off the barrel, stick in a lathe and polish it to whatever base diameter you want.

Not sure what the debate would be????
Jerry

PS Try a LEE FL sizer. These tend to be right on min spec SAAMI. Other brands may favour a larger spec. Fired brass may have a hardened case head so even FL sizing can't size it to min spec - too much spring back, not enough press leverage. Here a small base sizer will get the job done
 
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