Difficulty closing bolt on 22-250 with reloads

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black alder

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Hi
I have a Stevens 200 in 22-250 cal. I am having extreme difficulty when trying to close the bolt. The brass has probably only used once or twice.
If I chamber the spent brass alone the bolt closes with little resistance.
I do a full resize and trim the case, then set the bullet to give me the correct overall length. I am using two different bullets the sierra with the hollow point work fine , bolt closes easily. The other Hornady with the lead point makes it extremely difficult to close the bolt. Overall length for both is the same . The cases have been treated in exactly the same way. Both bullets are 53 grains
What am I doing wrong. Thanks
 
Correction , the Hornady are 55grain SXSP and the Sierra are 55 grain boat tail HP
I am using 4895 powder and overall length is 2.350"
Thanks
 
Maybe the ogive is different on both bullits. Try seating the Hornady a bit deeper, until the bolt closes. Just a thought , you might want to wait for more experienced reloaders to chime, I'm sure they will soon enough.
 
sounds to me that Brian hit the mark. my guess is the ojive is different and is contacting your rifling before you can close the bolt. maybe try and colour a bullet with a sharpie and look for the areas of contact. u should see the marks where the rifling is touching the bullet. thats about all i can offer other then thinking about the shoulder but if they chamber prior to the bullet being seated then that kinda rules that out unless your brass is bottoming out on your die and is rolling the shoulder back slightly... had that happen a couple times when i first started out.

hope this helps
Josh
 
You can try this, it might help. Just partially seat a bullit in a empty case without a primer, then chamber that cartridge and slowly extract. That should give you a max OAL of that particular bullit. The bullit will make contact with the rifling and push into the case , giving you your max OAL for that bullit. All bullits are different as they make contact with the ogive, not the tip.
 
I did load a freshly trimmed case and there was no problem.
If I set the Hornady bullet deeper in the case it will chamber more easily, however the overall length of the cartridge will be less than the 2.350" as set out in the book. Does this matter. I am new to reloading so I appreciate your recommendations
I will try what Brianma65 recommended - partially seating a bullet and close the bolt and let it seat in the chamber and slowly withdraw it to get the max OAL. How many thou. would you back it out from this point thanks
 
Best I can tell you is to do some Google research, but the closer to the lands the better, in some guns.Are you using a mag? If so that will limit your OAL. I've read that seating bullits deeper will increase pressure but Sammi specs are always on the safe side(10% less I think) . So seat them deeper and start at min and work up, until you find the sweet spot.You can play with the depth until you find the sweet spot. Some people have them touch the lands( no jump). Try starting about 15 thou off the lands and work accordingly. You may find more accuracy either way.
 
Hi Brianma65
I did as you recommended and used a sharpie to color the bullet. Closed the bolt when I chambered the round. It took some effort to close the bolt. Removed the cartridge and measured the OAL of it and it came to 2.444"
there was no marking on the bullet where I had colored it with the sharpie. I am using a blind magazine but no problems. The recommended OAL in the reloading manual is 2.350"
 
There is a gradual increase in pressure as a bullet is seated deeper, but that is gradual - over a a wide range of COL. Once the bullet gets close to the lands or on the lands or jammed - the pressure spikes - just a few thousandths of range of COL will take it into hammer-the-bolt-open territory - so be more concerned about too long than too short.

The supposed increase in accuracy which is gained by loading to the lands is hardly worth the effort - I stay well back from the lands so that my ammo will fit any gun that I've got. Think about it - the bullet does not have to jump to the lands - it is still well supported in the case neck as it slides out and engages the rifling.

Consider this: If you put a brick in front of your car tire, and try to climb over it - the motor will be revving ( really? two vs in a row) before it finally climbs over the brick. Now put a brick a foot ahead of the tire and drive over it with little effort. Is it any wonder that pressure must spike to get a bullet to accelerate from a dead stop when it is already up against the rifling?

You say that you did a full-length resize first - then trim - good. One thing that will surprise a guy is the case being pulled longer when the expander comes back up through an unlubed case neck. Use just a little lube or wax or something that won't catch too much powder and be consistent in lubing them because a sticky neck will hold onto the bullet longer and raise pressures and velocity spread - theoretically - I haven't actually been there to watch.
 
My buddy has 22-50 axis and is loading 55 g vmax and CFE 223 and 4064 and can print 3/4 MOA all day long. He FL sizes only. So just seat your bullit until your 15 thou off the lands, and work from there. You may find better accuracy at 20 thou or 10 thou. Regards to pressure in crease , start low and work up.
 
anchor3593 said:
There is a gradual increase in pressure as a bullet is seated deeper, but that is gradual - over a a wide range of COL. Once the bullet gets close to the lands or on the lands or jammed - the pressure spikes - just a few thousandths of range of COL will take it into hammer-the-bolt-open territory - so be more concerned about too long than too short.

The supposed increase in accuracy which is gained by loading to the lands is hardly worth the effort - I stay well back from the lands so that my ammo will fit any gun that I've got. Think about it - the bullet does not have to jump to the lands - it is still well supported in the case neck as it slides out and engages the rifling.

Consider this: If you put a brick in front of your car tire, and try to climb over it - the motor will be revving ( really? two vs in a row) before it finally climbs over the brick. Now put a brick a foot ahead of the tire and drive over it with little effort. Is it any wonder that pressure must spike to get a bullet to accelerate from a dead stop when it is already up against the rifling?

You say that you did a full-length resize first - then trim - good. One thing that will surprise a guy is the case being pulled longer when the expander comes back up through an unlubed case neck. Use just a little lube or wax or something that won't catch too much powder and be consistent in lubing them because a sticky neck will hold onto the bullet longer and raise pressures and velocity spread - theoretically - I haven't actually been there to watch.
Click to expand...

I like where your going here. I think the problem is in the reloading, are you using a crimp or very close to crimping the problem bullets? the Ogive can cause different seating depths and maybe bulge the shoulder a bit causing difficult chambering.
I usually set the bullet seater to seat without crimp and inspect every finished round for imperfections in the shoulder area of the cartridge. I also only neck size the case if it is being used in the same rifle it was originally fired out of.
 
black alder said:
I did load a freshly trimmed case and there was no problem.
If I set the Hornady bullet deeper in the case it will chamber more easily, however the overall length of the cartridge will be less than the 2.350" as set out in the book. Does this matter. I am new to reloading so I appreciate your recommendations
I will try what Brianma65 recommended - partially seating a bullet and close the bolt and let it seat in the chamber and slowly withdraw it to get the max OAL. How many thou. would you back it out from this point thanks
Click to expand...

Unless the guy that wrote the manual borrowed your rifle for his load development, his published OAL does not mean much.

First, make sure you lube the engaging surfaces of the bolt locking lugs, so you don't damage them.

If a round is hard to chamber, something is too big - either the shoulder has not been sized back far enough, or the bullet is too long and hitting the chamber throat.

After you unload the round, do you see marks on the case shoulder area or on the bullet?
 
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snoopycda said:
I like where your going here. I think the problem is in the reloading, are you using a crimp or very close to crimping the problem bullets? the Ogive can cause different seating depths and maybe bulge the shoulder a bit causing difficult chambering.
I usually set the bullet seater to seat without crimp and inspect every finished round for imperfections in the shoulder area of the cartridge. I also only neck size the case if it is being used in the same rifle it was originally fired out of.
Click to expand...

Oh - I see it now - you are right - he is crimping the bullet too much - spreading the shoulder wide for the chamber.

Check the diameter of your sized case at the shoulder and then check one of your loaded rounds - bets are that your loaded round is a little larger at the shoulder.

Back the seater die body out a half turn and then reset the seater depth and you should be good to go.
 
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You must find the optimum bullet seating depth and COL for each bullet you reload. If you are having trouble closing the bolt and ram it home you will have dangerous pressure from forcing the bullet into the rifling.
 
Ganderite said:
Unless the guy that wrote the manual borrowed your rifle for his load development, his published OAL does not mean much.

First, make sure you lube the engaging surfaces of the bolt locking lugs, so you don't damage them.

If a round is hard to chamber, something is too big - either the should has not been sized back far enough, or the bullet is too long and hitting the chamber throat.

After you unload the round, do you see marks on the case shoulder area or on the bullet?
Click to expand...
Hello Gander:) If he's using two different bullits but with the same FL brass, and only one type won't chamber. Wouldn't that be a bullit problem only? Or is it possible that he's setting his dies for the Sierra bullit and then using the same die setting for the Hornady bullits, thereby causing his problem?
 
For a rookie reloader, I would suggest:

1) Not getting too close to the lands. ( eg;keeping a 15 thou margin from round to round is difficult, and problematic if a bullet jams in the rifle in the field) Go to 30 thou and focus on other reloading parameters to optimize your loads.
2) Brianmas method of establishing to the lands OAL is prone the giving erroneous results (as you found out). There are much more reliable ways to establish max OAL.
3) Stay close to minimum load until you get more proficient, as you cant recognize overpressure events.

Suggest you back off on the OAL incrementally until the round chambers easily. If this doesn't seem to bear fruit, check to ensure that the die isn't crimping the bullet unduly and creating a ridge in the case neck.
 
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He's likely upsetting the shoulders when seating/crimping. A good inside chamfer will help with seating pressures (not sure if those specific bullets are BT or FB) and backing the whole seating die off (adjusting the seating stem accordingly to achieve OAL) just a hair might help. I used to shoot a pretty stiff 22-250 and I don't think I ever crimped the bullets...the rounds fed nicely off the mag and into the chamber so I wasn't worried about setting the bullet back when feeding.

I've liked crimping with a separate die. The Lee Factory Crimp die squeezes in around the end of the case vs. rolling over the top. I've buggered plenty of cases setting dies up just right.

And...it's worth a couple of bullets and cases to do all the setup without primers and powder.
 
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