Dirty Purchase - A Rant.

summerside sniper

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So I purchased an M1D last month from a fellow CGN'r and finally got it out to the range yesterday for an interesting 16 rounds.

The first 8 were shot, but after every round, I had to reset the firing pin so the next round would be shot (the round loaded but didn't fire because the trigger was in the fire position, and I had to pull back on the op rod, exposing about a 1/2" - 1" of round to reset the firing pin, then releasing to reseat the round). I thought this extremely odd as having never experienced this before. My second 8 wasn't much different. I had to reset the firing pin after every 2 or 3 rounds.

Now, I did do an pre and just before writing this, a post fire cleaning of the rifle. My pre was what one would expect of a pre-fire. Wipe clean and oil moving parts, barrel, etc. noting any damage and places that need extra work. This was done in a reasonable amount of time. I wished to have these "extra places" cleaning conducted later during the post fire because these weren't an issue to the shooting of the gun like extra oil/dirt in the front iron site. The only thing I noticed was that the trigger guard is so loose that it takes nothing to move it from its locked position.

So afterwards, I conducted my post fire cleaning....what a chore. I spent more than an hour cleaning what I think was every nook and cranny going over everything, and the pile of used swabs is amazing. I've shot my other M1 for 16 rounds and had less than half the time spent doing a post fire. In one instance, I removed a piece of carbon so thick you could actually measure it. Where this came from I have no idea as it showed up on my cleaning mat and I didn't watch it fall. I went over the op rod, chamber, action, and gas cylinder for over 15 min each inside and out as they kept coming up dirty. I still think I need to go back over this rifle again and re-clean it later on cause I'm still not happy.

Now I know that I could have just been a clean Nazi over my rifle (this is supposed to be the queen bee of my collection afterall) but I'm of the opinion that a clean rifle works best. I didn't expect to be using this rifle any time soon so a good cleaning prior to storing seemed reasonable to me. I'm also thinking that now that I've had my post clean, I should go back out and refire it to see if the cleanliness of the rifle was the issue I had (during the breakdown for post fire cleaning I noted that the gas plug was loose...).

So now I ask, is it unreasonable for me to assume that the rifle I am purchasing is cleaned prior to shipping? Can the cause of my shooting issue be contributed to the loose gas plug and/or cleanliness of the rifle? And finally, how do I change out the chamber brush on my tool, and replace the trigger guard and adjustment cover on my M1D?
 
I never expect a used firearm to be spotless. As long as it's not full of crap or obviously neglected, it's fine with me.

Next time ask for detail photos.
 
It would be nice to have complicated devices such as firearms (and other mechanical devices) cleaned before sold. Doesnt have to be spotless, but functioning properly should be standard (unless stated otherwise prior to completed sale).

I mean, last thing you want is to have the gun your selling be so clogged that the buyer cannot even get it to function properly. That is just out right embarrassing, and whoever sold it should be ashamed as a firearms owner! Thats just my opinion, maybe i am unreasonably harsh? Just i see it this way... Sell your gun in the condition you would expect to receive a gun in.
 
Yahhh - If I've shot it, I've cleaned it. But if I bought it, didn't like the look of it and couldn't find anything alarming (lots of gunk or damage) on inspection I might not completely strip it down before shipping. I tend to mothball a gun when I put it up for sale so that I don't accidentally mess it up before or during a deal.
 
Personaly I don't care if it's dirty. Infact it's kind of enjoyable if it's dirty. I always tare down my new guns to clean them. Post some pics of this beauty!
 
If you got a good deal when you bought it, then the condition probably reflects the fact that the previous owner got tired of this particular gun. If it was a good deal; then spend a morning cleaning it up and congrat's on the good deal, but the money you saved takes away the right to complain about the dirt.
If you paid a premium price for it you have every right to complain.
Not everyone has to same requirements on cleanliness. I like my stuff clean, but everyone is different on their needs.
IMO.
Stay safe.
 
Just my experience, but it seems that a lot of times I have gone to look at a used firearm and its been dirty. I usually bring along some wipes and a pull through just in case but you shouldn't have to do a detailed stripping and cleaning when you are looking over a gun. Some people just don't get the fact that a quick wipe down can help their cause when trying to sell.
 
The only thing I expect is that the condition be as stated.

When it arrives with a dirty bore, it makes it difficult to understand how it could be advertized as having "strong rifling, and a bright bore", but so far I'm doing ok. On the other hand, I do not want it to have been "cleaned", as often as not that means that original finish has been damaged.
 
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You shouldn't assume anything when you buy used, I guess. I'm amazed at the number of guys selling guns, even at gunshows who don't even bother to give the bores a good scrubbing. I've picked up a few that went from a 4-5 to a 8-9 in bore condition just from a thorough cleaning.
 
Dirty Garand

If I read your post right, you bought the rifle, cleaned it before going to the range, had problems on the range, and cleaned the rifle when you got home. Also, I don't quite understand about "resetting the firing pin".

If you cleaned the rifle, you had it apart and disassembled. You note that the rifle was very dirty after firing, and had a loose gas plug.

The M1 Garand operates using gas pressure, bled off from a port near the barrel. A loose gas plug could cause gas to escape, thus not providing enough pressure to fully cycle the action. If you had the rifle apart to clean it, removing the gas plug is something you would do. If the gas plug was not tightened up enough when it was put back together, then that might be one of your problems.

Because the Garand is sensitive to gas pressures, it has to be loaded with proper ammo. Did you use factory ammo, or reloads? Using reloads that develop insufficient gas pressure can result in short recoil. Too much gas pressure can bend the operating rod. Also, a worn gas piston on the end of the operating rod will let too much gas escape, resulting in short recoil. If reloads, some powders are dirtier than others. Most of the 30-06 ammo used during WW2 was loade with 150 grain bullets and IMR-4895 powder as a standard load for the M1 Garand.

When you say "reset the firing pin", do you mean you had to recock the hammer?

Your trigger group should have some resistance about 3/8 to 1/2 inch at the end of the trigger guard from fully seating. It can be shimmed by attaching wood strips in the proper places.

I would start with looking at the following:

1. Loose gas plug that was not properly tightened upon reassembly
2. Gas piston worn or undersized
3. Use proper ammunition

.
 
If the trigger housing is that loose, you have bedding problems. As suggested, this can be remedied. Whether you would want to epoxy bed the rifle is an open question. It would not help the value of an original M-1D to alter it in any way. A replacement stock, properly bedded, might be an idea for shooting purposes.
 
The generality of milsuap I have collected sported hardened cosmoline or grease around the screws and deep crevices, a few still had dirt, sand and other wear under the wood. As to chamber and barrel these where taken care off by the previous owners.

I clean my rifles after every shoot, a habit I took from firing military surplus rounds that are notoriously corrosive.
 
If i bought a gun from a CGN'er and when it arrived it didn;t cycle, I'd be irate if it had not been disclosed.

If it still doesn't work after your thorough cleaning, time to contact the seller for a rrefund.

Dirty doesn't matter as much if it's as advertised.
 
i bought an sks off a buddy that he bought off another guy. i took it home and feildstripped it and oh my god this rifle has never been cleaned. i am also of teh opinion that it is filled with it's origional packing grease. The guy i bought it off of never fired it and the guy he bought it from never did either. i havent' cleaned it yet... will do this weekend.. if anyone is interested let me know and i'll take pics of before after and during... if not interested i won't bother.
 
Before selling any firearms, i always field strip them,clean the bore and everything and after oil all metal part and bore. I also include a notice to the buyer that the gun must be wiped to remove the oil. Doing that way insure the potential buyer that he will receive a well preserved firearm that will not rust during shipping or whatever.:)
 
Before selling any firearms, i always field strip them,clean the bore and everything and after oil all metal part and bore. I also include a notice to the buyer that the gun must be wiped to remove the oil. Doing that way insure the potential buyer that he will receive a well preserved firearm that will not rust during shipping or whatever.:)

Sounds good...very few people do this unfortunately, the majority I've bought come with dirty bores, sad to say.
 
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