Dlask m4 barrels

No shop in there right mind is going to use a $100 000+ CNC mill to fit front sight bases. The only other non turning step on a standard AR barrel is the gas hole.
In a production shop this is work that would most likely be done in a jig on a drill press.

As to roll pins being a problem with rust and vibrating lose. A quick look over of my Colt LE 6920 has 13 roll pins. 2 side sling adapter, 1 gas tube, 1 dust cover detent, 2 forward assist, 1 bolt release, 2 trigger guard, 1 charging handle latch, 2 rear sight and 1 in the tele stock. And every one knows Colt makes nothing but cheap S**T.
 
well the vids I've seen of barrels being turned for Colts showed CNC turning stations with live toolheads. So everything is done on one machine, turning the profile, and doing the taper pin holes. One setup for the barrel as well.
 
spi said:
Let's think about that from the shop floor and the bottom line.

Let's say that currently these holes drilled in castings for straight pins by 2 guys working on drill presses with jigs at an average of 30 seconds per hole, with go/no go jigs for QC.

You want to use a CNC machine for this instead.

You want to go from 3 operations - drilling hole, reaming hole, spec'ing hole - to 4 operations - drilling hole, reaming hole, tapering hole, spec'ing hole - on one of the most expensive machines in the factory, staffed by the highest paid operators.
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How I think of it you rig up a fixture to hold 20 lets say (depends on the max workable table size of the machine), then you drill them all at the same time in one operation, change the tool on a automatic tool changer (so no one needs to "be" there), then the machine undersize stright reams them all at the same time, now another tool change, and it taper reams them all.

Now you have just done each hole in maybe 10 seconds each, cut out the operator (for the most part), saved over half the time, just need to pay someone to load and unload the machine and the tooling lets say you got a 10 peice changer all you need is 4 stright reamers, 4 drills, and 2 drills and have the programming cycle them so it can go a couple of days of pumping out parts before the reamers even start to show wear on them. All you need is a machinist to set up the tools in the morning and check them at the end of the shift for wear and replace them if nessisary. :dancingbanana:

I don't know to me it seems easyer on a CNC machine. :)

Dimitri
 
Slavex said:
well the vids I've seen of barrels being turned for Colts showed CNC turning stations with live toolheads. So everything is done on one machine, turning the profile, and doing the taper pin holes. One setup for the barrel as well.
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Just to be clear: I am thinking of the front sight bases themselves, not the barrels. Most of the production ones I have seen - be it Colt, Armalite, DPMS, etc... - are castings with minimal tool marks.
 
Dimitri said:
How I think of it you rig up a fixture to hold 20 lets say (depends on the max workable table size of the machine), then you drill them all at the same time in one operation, change the tool on a automatic tool changer (so no one needs to "be" there), then the machine undersize stright reams them all at the same time, now another tool change, and it taper reams them all.

Now you have just done each hole in maybe 10 seconds each, cut out the operator (for the most part), saved over half the time, just need to pay someone to load and unload the machine and the tooling lets say you got a 10 peice changer all you need is 4 stright reamers, 4 drills, and 2 drills and have the programming cycle them so it can go a couple of days of pumping out parts before the reamers even start to show wear on them. All you need is a machinist to set up the tools in the morning and check them at the end of the shift for wear and replace them if nessisary. :dancingbanana:

I don't know to me it seems easyer on a CNC machine. :)
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:shrug: Difference of perspective. I managed the CNC room of a factory for the last nine years and never used a milling center for anything as pedestrian as drilling and reaming holes. It is a pure waste of resources to do set-ups on a machine just for that purpose, unless there is a compelling reason to do so.

And likesay, it's not as easy as you seem to think.

I was going to address your post by point, but it's easier just to point out that you are looking at it from the individual (craftsman) position.

Start thinking in terms of human error. Even with a twenty piece pallet, you need an operator to load it, and operator error is the single biggest factor in tool breakage, and parts rejection in the industry. That means ongoing QC throughout the parts run. If you only have a guy checking for wear at the begining and end of a shift, you could be chucking a few hundred, or maybe even a few thousands of parts into the reject bin at the end of the day.

I could go on, but, :shrug: likesay, it just isn't all that simple.
 
I have a friend that weell how can I put it with out insulting the guy IS AN IDIOT and went bought himself a DLASK:eek: AR it has been sent back 2 times the Front Sight Base was loose and gas was leaking out and causing malfunctions and then returned again to Dlask because the rifle would only group 55gr ammo consitent with a 12 gauage shotgun at 7 m,after barrel was replaced rifle shoots great now. If you have to buy a barrel there are plenty of Dealers who support this board to buy from .BTW Dlask customer service:runaway: :runaway: is second to none :rolleyes: thats right it is non existant .LMAO
 
spi said:
I could go on, but, :shrug: likesay, it just isn't all that simple.
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Your probably right, just seems that simple to me after doing some CNC work in college (I got to admit I'm starting to love MasterCAM and programming in G-Code by hand is fun too! :dancingbanana: ), I've got no pratical experiance like yourself hense why I am thinking what I do. :)

Dimitri
 
Making rifles is such a short run item that other than uppers and lowers and barrel making, I imagine most operations are semi automatic cam and air operated machines. There was an interesting article in a cnc trade rag i get now and then showing the setup berretta uses for manufactureing the frame and slide on the m9 / 92 for the american army. Rotary fixture holding 16 frames, 4 a side. Machine 4, rotate, machine 4, ect. With operations like this you have a semi skilled worker filling the fixtures and setting tools. All the programing is done by one person. Also, the operator normally runs two or more machines, loading or unloading while the other is running. CNC does eliminate the human variable from the equation, the machine will do the same thing all day and night, the human won't. I'm a tool and die maker and have a millwright ticket as well, and I've seen the most creative screw ups......:rolleyes:. Still anytime you can have a machine do something rather than a person, if you have the through put to pay for it, it's the way to go.
 
I realize reading my post I left something out, the video I saw showed the front sight base being mounted and the barrel and the base being drilled and reamed at the same time. The machine stopped while the operator put the sight base on. Not sure how the indexing was done to line it up with the gas hole and such though. But still very very quick operation.
 
So, do Dlask barrels shoot or what? The question still hasn't been solved. I don't work for Joe anymore but the customers that we heard back from were pleased with the accuracy results. As for complaints about the products, we rarely ever heard about them first hand. This is what I've discovered and I don't mean to offend anyone, but if an American or European gets a crappy product, they return it immediately or contact the manufacturer. When Canadians get a crappy product, they #####, whine, mope and complain and then then post it on forums like this one, all without ever contacting the manufacturer. Dlask has made some top notch products and some crappy ones. You think every single Mercedes or BMW is perfect and runs for 500,000 kms without a hiccup? They sell for more than the equal equivalent car as do Joes guns, and poeple still buy Mercedes and BMW's. I've had this discussion with poeple before and the result still seems to be the same, nothing changes. You can't fix something you don't know about. The more you try to please the worse it gets. Try sending your DPMS or RRA back down south a year and a half after the warrenty runs out for free service. Joe stands by his product and bends over backwards for customers. But yeah, the barrels do generally shoot well and are subject to flaws like any other mass produced product.
 
If a rifle functions before it leaves and develops problems while in the hands of the owner then yes the quality control is in the customer. You're missing the point of my statement as do most of the poeple on here. My power brake booster failed on my car the other day. For that reason alone, I will never buy another Audi. Logical isn't it. People have ther minds made up so they can't be cunfused with facts.
 
greentips said:
BTW, it pissed me off to no end when some one said "oh, just send it back if you have a problem with it". This is NOT good serivce. This is just sugar coated bad service.

how about you inspect the frigging thing before you drop it into the box so i don't have to risk wasting yourtime, my time, your money and my money to send it back?
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Amen
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baalan said:
So, do Dlask barrels shoot or what? The question still hasn't been solved.
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In the countless Dlask threads, no actual owner who sent a barrel back has said how the new barrel shoots, if it is real M4 contours, anything. I wish I knew if buying a barrel was worth it. Friggn yes or no.....from an actual owner.
 
I can't answer all of your questions Deckard, but I do own an AR15 with a 16" Dlask barrel mounted on it. I bought the barrel used, not new. There is no FSB on it as the rifle uses optics exclusively.

Balaan built and added the compensator it currently wears when he was employed at Dlask Arms. The rifle shoots very accurately and the comp does what it is supposed to do ... make noise and reduce muzzle flip to almost nothing.
 
Gotta be sure that it's a real M-4 contour for your grenade launcher for when you go to war, fitting problems ya know! You guys crack me up.
 
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