Does anyone have these stock markings on a WWII Winchester M97 Trench Gun?
- Thread starter drm3m
- Start date
It took me several hours to find the literature about that mark, I knew I've seen it somewhere before on a US weapon.
Finally I found what I was looking for, the GHD is an inspector's mark found on colt 1911's.
The mark stands for "Guy H Drewry" who was an inspector of firearms. I'm guessing he also was an inspector for M97's as well?
Very nice piece you have there. I have a wannabe cut down 1901 riot gun here. Its the only shotgun here that is on display in the milsurp rack instead of hidden away in the safe.
I'm jealous, I wish I had one as nice as that!!
Steve
Finally I found what I was looking for, the GHD is an inspector's mark found on colt 1911's.
The mark stands for "Guy H Drewry" who was an inspector of firearms. I'm guessing he also was an inspector for M97's as well?
Very nice piece you have there. I have a wannabe cut down 1901 riot gun here. Its the only shotgun here that is on display in the milsurp rack instead of hidden away in the safe.
I'm jealous, I wish I had one as nice as that!!
Steve
Early (1942) Ordnance final inspection mark on a Winchester Model 1897 Trench Gun consisting of "W.B." in a rectangle above the small Ordnance Escutcheon on the left side of the stock. (NOT MINE)
W.B. Waldemar S. Broberg, Colonel
Hartford/ Springfield Ordnance District
Army Inspector of Ordnance.
July 1 1941-June 16, 1942.
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Most WWII production Winchester M1897 Trench Guns were fitted with the later production, four-hole, hand guard/bayonet lug. These Trench Guns had the later style markings which consisted of "US" and the Ordnance "Shell and Flame' insignia on the left side of the receiver and "G.H.D" final inspection above the larger Ordnance
Escutcheon on the left side of the stock.
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I guess I am trying to get a sense of how many of these WWII U.S. marked Winchester Model 1897 Trench Guns exist in Canada that have either the W.B. or G.H.D. stock markings.
David
If you do could you please post photos.
David
Other U.S. markings found on these guns.
At this point I am more curious about the stock markings.
David
I know nothing about the stamps that can help you but it looks like people that do have answered your query well.
I am just commenting to express my admiration for the 97. Martially marked and in very goo or better condition. Great find.
bearhunter,
I very much appreciate all the responses to this thread.
I guess my question should have been--- how many of these W.B. or G.H.D. marked Trench Guns exist in Canada?
This question is directed to CGN members that have one of these U.S. Trench Guns.
David
A comment that Bruce Canfield said back when I was thinking about purchasing this M97 Trench Gun.
This says it all.
"The presence or absence of stock inspection stamps on WWII U.S.military shotguns is dependent on the type of gun. The Winchester Model 97 and Model 12 shotguns made under government contract were stamped on the left side of the stock with the ordnance "crossed cannons" escutcheon and either "WB" (Waldemar Broberg) or "GHD" (Guy H. Drewry) depending on the vintage of the gun. The Remington Model 11 and Sportsman government contract shotguns were marked on the left side of the stock with the crossed cannons and "FJA" (Frank J.Atwood). Other than a few early Remington Model 31s (which had a small crossed cannons only), no other types of WWII military shotguns left the factory with inspection stamps on the stock. The absence of such markings on a WWII Winchester military contract shotgun indicates that the stock was either replaced or refinished, thus obscuring the markings".
I very much appreciate all the responses to this thread.
I guess my question should have been--- how many of these W.B. or G.H.D. marked Trench Guns exist in Canada?
This question is directed to CGN members that have one of these U.S. Trench Guns.
David
A comment that Bruce Canfield said back when I was thinking about purchasing this M97 Trench Gun.
This says it all.
"The presence or absence of stock inspection stamps on WWII U.S.military shotguns is dependent on the type of gun. The Winchester Model 97 and Model 12 shotguns made under government contract were stamped on the left side of the stock with the ordnance "crossed cannons" escutcheon and either "WB" (Waldemar Broberg) or "GHD" (Guy H. Drewry) depending on the vintage of the gun. The Remington Model 11 and Sportsman government contract shotguns were marked on the left side of the stock with the crossed cannons and "FJA" (Frank J.Atwood). Other than a few early Remington Model 31s (which had a small crossed cannons only), no other types of WWII military shotguns left the factory with inspection stamps on the stock. The absence of such markings on a WWII Winchester military contract shotgun indicates that the stock was either replaced or refinished, thus obscuring the markings".
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ghostntheshell
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- GTA ONTARIO
Want
live4therut
CGN frequent flyer
There were slightly over 25,000 made from 1941-45. Unlike the WWI 97's the WWII were built from the ground up under military contract instead of being modified from commercial 97's. As with the WWI military shotguns, there are no known offical records of the serial numbers of the WWII guns. Based on observation of existing samples, a very rough serial number range for WWII Winchester Model 1897 military shotguns would be from approximately E910000 to E960000. The 'WB' stock cartouche would be expected on WWII guns below serial number E930000 and the 'GHD' on the guns above this number. Again, it must be stressed that these serial number ranges are only estimates based on the observation of a limited number of examples. In any case they are rare below and south of the border, out of 25,000 who know how many survived. I would love to add one of these to the collection. Maybe someday I'll be at the right place at the right time.
Cheers
Cheers
I've got one as well that has been confirmed by Bruce Canfield in the US to be from 1943. Been there done that gun with a replaced butt stock (no cartouche) and post WWII parkerized heat shield/bayo lug. He thinks that it may have been in Korea or Vietnam.
They are amazing shotguns!
Cheers,
Ian
They are amazing shotguns!
Cheers,
Ian
Thanks for your observations live4therut.
The story of the WW1 and WWII M97 Trench Guns is interesting.
Thanks Smitsauce for posting the nice photos of your gun-- she is a 'been there done that lady' that lived through WWII and much later adventures.
David
The story of the WW1 and WWII M97 Trench Guns is interesting.
Thanks Smitsauce for posting the nice photos of your gun-- she is a 'been there done that lady' that lived through WWII and much later adventures.
David
I only owned Joe Poyer's book back when I bought this M97 Trench Gun----Bruce Canfield has since written another
book about these guns....new info I am sure has been uncovered.
BACKGROUND.
PRODUCTION FIGURES.
INSPECTOR'S MARKINGS.
I do not own Bruce Canfield's more recent book.
But I communicated with him before I bought the M97 shown above.
A comment that Bruce made back then which says it all.
The presence or absence of stock inspection stamps on WWII U.S.military shotguns is dependent on the type of gun. The Winchester Model 97 and Model 12 shotguns made under government contract were stamped on the left side of the stock with the ordnance "crossed cannons" escutcheon and either "WB" (Waldemar Broberg) or "GHD" (Guy H. Drewry) depending on the vintage of the gun. The Remington Model 11 and Sportsman government contract shotguns were marked on the left side of the stock with the crossed cannons and "FJA" (Frank J.Atwood). Other than a few early Remington Model 31s (which had a small crossed cannons only), no other types of WWII military shotguns left the factory with inspection stamps on the stock.
*The absence of such markings on a WWII Winchester military contract shotgun indicates that the stock was either replaced or refinished, thus obscuring the markings.
David
book about these guns....new info I am sure has been uncovered.
BACKGROUND.
PRODUCTION FIGURES.
INSPECTOR'S MARKINGS.
I do not own Bruce Canfield's more recent book.
But I communicated with him before I bought the M97 shown above.
A comment that Bruce made back then which says it all.
The presence or absence of stock inspection stamps on WWII U.S.military shotguns is dependent on the type of gun. The Winchester Model 97 and Model 12 shotguns made under government contract were stamped on the left side of the stock with the ordnance "crossed cannons" escutcheon and either "WB" (Waldemar Broberg) or "GHD" (Guy H. Drewry) depending on the vintage of the gun. The Remington Model 11 and Sportsman government contract shotguns were marked on the left side of the stock with the crossed cannons and "FJA" (Frank J.Atwood). Other than a few early Remington Model 31s (which had a small crossed cannons only), no other types of WWII military shotguns left the factory with inspection stamps on the stock.
*The absence of such markings on a WWII Winchester military contract shotgun indicates that the stock was either replaced or refinished, thus obscuring the markings.
David
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Rusty Joots
CGN Regular
- Location
- Spruce Grove, Ab
If I was rich I would buy that then slam fire it at water mellons
Congratulations J.P. on finding a WB accepted Trench Gun.
You send me a pm question regarding taking the gun apart.
This is from Joe Poyer's Book.
Good luck and have fun.
David
This is the page that relates to the Trench Gun.
You send me a pm question regarding taking the gun apart.
This is from Joe Poyer's Book.
Good luck and have fun.
David
This is the page that relates to the Trench Gun.
