Does Barnaul 168gr 30-06 work on Garand?

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HasegawaYamato

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My friend retired from shooting 30-06 rifle, left some Barnaul 168gr and Federal 180gr to me since he knew I got a Garand. The 180gr is definitely out, but I did bit online search I found the Barnual 168gr has a max pressure of 44,100 psi, seems within Garand's capability, but I found no pressure curve that corroborate it, and I heard some rumors about how bad those russian rounds are.

So... Should I just put them aside? :/
 
Those grain weights are well within the capability. Garand was designed around M1 Ball, which is a 173 grain projectile with a pretty solid charge of powder. Match loads are the same, even once the combat load switched to M2 ball. Now whether I would trust Barnaul is another matter, but that's up to you to decide with your own research.

There is so much debate about what is healthy for the Garand. The CMP forums have the general consensus that anything reasonable between 110 and 180 grains is fine. My favourite match loads are 168 BTHP's or 175 BTHP's over 48/46.5 grains of Varget. I am not alone in my love for loads in this range! CMP folks all seems to gravitate to this range. Hornady Garand ammo is a 168 A-Tip over 46.6 of Varget. I have ran the super cheap federal stuff between 150 and 180 with good success too, but only about 4-5 moa compared to 1.75 with my match hand loads (rifle has been accurized with the exception of bedding).

I did end up switching to an adjustable plug a few months ago, as I wanted to try some 190 grain long range loads for 1000 meter tests. They were hot so I wanted to dial the gas pressure down a bit as a precaution. Just for fun, and they worked very we
 
Hey OP,

Your mileage may vary and this is only my personal experience. I have a Danish Garand. When i shoot Barnaul it always cause the clip to eject early. Switched to Federal Garand 3006, no issues.

This stuff,

Federal American Eagle Ammunition 30-06 Springfield (M1 Garand) 150 Grain Full Metal Jacket
 
Chamber pressure isn't the issue with the Garand; gas port pressure is. That's why Garand specific ammo uses selected propellants which generate the correct port pressure to cycle the action reliably and without damage.

Stick to Garand specific ammo, like the AE and Hornady loads which are labelled for the Garand, or handload using IMR4895 or 4064 and bullets in the 150-168 gr range. People can use an adjustable gas plug if they want to stray away from the recommended baseline.
 
My understanding is that it isn't necessarily the bullet weight, but the burn rate and pressure curve of the powder used. I contacted Federal once about their American Eagle 30-06 ammo. They make 150 grain AE specifically for Garands, and another load of 150 grain as a general load. They recommended not using the normal 150 grain in my Garand, for what that's worth.

Check out InRange TV's little informal test where they used high speed cameras to measure the bolt speed on a Garand with different ammo, pretty interesting. I don't think a few rounds of the wrong ammo with make your gun suddenly implode, but it certainly ups the risk factors found in any self loader, and will wear parts faster.

Luckily when it comes to factory ammo, we have a bunch of readily available choices. Federal, Hornady, and PRVI all make a Garand specific 30-06 load.
 
Garand was designed around M1 Ball, which is a 173 grain projectile with a pretty solid charge of powder.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the info! I thought M1 was designed based on M2 ball and I was wrong! lol.
Planning on getting the adjustable plug as well, wanna try some 220 gr super-heavy :p
 
I have a Danish Garand. When i shoot Barnaul it always cause the clip to eject early.
Click to expand...
Perhaps I will try firing one clip to test these russian rounds :/
I already got some AE 3006 for my garand for the weekend shooting party, they were bit more expensive but at least safe :)
 
purple said:
Chamber pressure isn't the issue with the Garand; gas port pressure is. That's why Garand specific ammo uses selected propellants which generate the correct port pressure to cycle the action reliably and without damage.

Stick to Garand specific ammo, like the AE and Hornady loads which are labelled for the Garand, or handload using IMR4895 or 4064 and bullets in the 150-168 gr range. People can use an adjustable gas plug if they want to stray away from the recommended baseline.
Click to expand...

As what I found on the internet, people were saying the relatively weak op rod was the problem. But anyway I will run one clip of these russian rounds for testing only, already got a big box of AE 3006 for the weekend :)
 
The_Champ said:
My understanding is that it isn't necessarily the bullet weight, but the burn rate and pressure curve of the powder used. I contacted Federal once about their American Eagle 30-06 ammo. They make 150 grain AE specifically for Garands, and another load of 150 grain as a general load. They recommended not using the normal 150 grain in my Garand, for what that's worth.

Check out InRange TV's little informal test where they used high speed cameras to measure the bolt speed on a Garand with different ammo, pretty interesting. I don't think a few rounds of the wrong ammo with make your gun suddenly implode, but it certainly ups the risk factors found in any self loader, and will wear parts faster.

Luckily when it comes to factory ammo, we have a bunch of readily available choices. Federal, Hornady, and PRVI all make a Garand specific 30-06 load.
Click to expand...

I saw that video too, really scared the sh*t out of me - I was planning on shooting 220 gr super-heavy when I first got the gun, but thankfully my semi-functional brain told me to do some research so I didnt detonate my grands worthy garand lol
 
HasegawaYamato said:
Perhaps I will try firing one clip to test these russian rounds :/
I already got some AE 3006 for my garand for the weekend shooting party, they were bit more expensive but at least safe :)
Click to expand...

HasegawaYamato said:
As what I found on the internet, people were saying the relatively weak op rod was the problem. But anyway I will run one clip of these russian rounds for testing only, already got a big box of AE 3006 for the weekend :)
Click to expand...

Maybe don't? One clip's worth is unlikely to ruin the op-rod, but do you want to take the chance? You have little to gain and much to lose with this inadvisable test.
 
Yes, you can try Regular gas in your hi-compression Ferrrari. But why run the risk of damage.

It is not a bullet weight issue. It is port pressure. You don't know if they used fast (good) powder or slow(bad) powder.
 
Ganderite said:
Yes, you can try Regular gas in your hi-compression Ferrrari. But why run the risk of damage.

It is not a bullet weight issue. It is port pressure. You don't know if they used fast (good) powder or slow(bad) powder.
Click to expand...

This is very true. There is a fairly forgiving range of powder burn speeds that work well in the Garand. Roughy speaking, IMR3031 at the fast end and 4064 at the slow end, with the golden performers of Varget and IMR/H 4895 in the middle. You might be able to contact Barnaul or one of their distributors and they may be able to inform you. Honestly, over what I have heard/seen through videos and testimonials about what it does to Garands, I would play safe and not run it. Many other better performers anyways.
 
This is a very timely thread for me. I've just acquired my second M-1.
I was issued my first M-1 at US Army Basic Training in 1963! All we recruits knew about the ammo we were firing was that it was 30-06, and it was accurate enough in our Garands to be 'minute of man' at 350yards!

Last week I picked up this ex-CMP M-1, and it's sure bringing back lots of good memories I'd not thought about in...over 50 years!
Now I'm looking for the correct ammo to let this old lady bark once again.

Yesterday I read an article in the June issue of Guns & Ammo that addresses just this question.

As some members may know, Winchester is reportedly offering newly manufactured ammo called the 'Victory Series' that replicates the cartridges used by the US and some Allied nations during the Second War. Of particular interest to us in this context is what the author has to say concerning that which was used in the M-1s of the era:

"The original loading for the 30-06 adopted in 1906, was a 150-grain flat-base bullet. After a period of experimenting with a heavier 172-grain boat tail (BT) bullet, it was found that it exceeded the safety danger area of almost all US Army small-arms ranges. They went back to firing what is essentially the original 1906 loading until it was ultimately adopted in 1938 as the .30 M2 Ball.The .30 M2 Ball was a 152 grain full metal jacket flat-base projectile similar to the 1906 loading. The performance specification for the .30 M2 Ball round was 2,740 fps measured 78 feet from the muzzle, corresponding to a muzzle velocity of 2,805 fps. There have been several recent offerings of 30-06 ammunition-to-spec for use in the M-1 Garand, which includes those from American Eagle, Hornady, Prvi Partizan and Sellier & Bellot. Most of these loads use available cases and bullets, but none of them reproduced the M2 bullet.
Winchester did it right by reproducing the 150gr bullet to be identical to the original's specifications. The 'Victory' is advertised at a muzzle velocity of 2,740 fps.

"The Victory Series Ball M2 ammo was loaded with 55.8gr of Ball powder. The is a bit perplexing to me, as GI Ball M2 ammo was normally loaded with 49-50 grains of an extruded improved military rifle propellant. The period Lake City ammo I shot for the comparison to Winchester's Victory was loaded with 46.8gr of an extruding-appearing propellant. THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT because the M1 Garand was not designed to run on the heavy charges of slow propellants that modern 30-06 sporting ammo is loaded with.

"Modern loads run six to 10 gr higher with charge weights of much slower propellant, causing a much higher load on the M-1 Garand's long operating rod and risks over-driving the action.

"The Victory load is not appropriate for use in an M-1 Garand." (Dave Emary, 2019)
 
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