Does steel case ammo damage M14 type rifles?
- Thread starter big bear
- Start date
Travis Bickle
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Upper Lower Middle Alberta
lol I don't know.
If it does we're probably talking in the 1000's of rounds.
Does it really matter?
The M14 is a beast and it's dirt cheap. Just shoot it.
If it does we're probably talking in the 1000's of rounds.
Does it really matter?
The M14 is a beast and it's dirt cheap. Just shoot it.
notsorichguy
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- The city that rhymes with fun
There is currently a thread in black rifles where someone took 4 rifles, 3 types of steel case ammo and 1 type of brass cased ammo. All 223, all rifles were BNIB bushmaster m4 varient rifles. Same models etc.
Steel case ammo required extractors to be replaced after 5K. Action springs were changed as well. IMHO 5K is a pretty good run! They show close up shots of the extractors, the steel ones were obviously more worn than the extractor from the brass cased rifle.
After 10K the steel case guns were shot out but the brass case gun was still serviceable. This had nothing to do with the case material, but rather the construction of the projectiles. Steel & zinc as opposed to copper jackets. The rifling was non existent in the steel case guns, rounds were tumbling and key holing accuracy was sh*t after 6K rounds.
That IMHO is more telling that case material.
Steel case ammo required extractors to be replaced after 5K. Action springs were changed as well. IMHO 5K is a pretty good run! They show close up shots of the extractors, the steel ones were obviously more worn than the extractor from the brass cased rifle.
After 10K the steel case guns were shot out but the brass case gun was still serviceable. This had nothing to do with the case material, but rather the construction of the projectiles. Steel & zinc as opposed to copper jackets. The rifling was non existent in the steel case guns, rounds were tumbling and key holing accuracy was sh*t after 6K rounds.
That IMHO is more telling that case material.
See the link below. It is a good article and makes me wonder about the Norc and MFS surplus I've been using. Both have bi-metallic (steel/copper) jacketed bullets.
http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/brass-vs-steel-cased-ammo/
The article makes the point that the cost savings of Russian bulk ammo may still make it a fair decision for some to shoot the Russian and Chinese surplus, while expending barrels as consumables. While M305/M14 replacement barrels are much more expensive (~ $300 plus fitting, maybe a $300 USGI bolt as well) than an AR barrel (estimated in the article to be about $100) it may still make sense for some. If we say the all-in cost of re-barelling plus a new bolt is $800, you would recoup this cost once you'd bought 1,600 rounds of surplus, versus PRIVI let alone Federal or better commercial brands (ignoring the fact that in the latter case you'd also have a ton of reloadable brass). On rebarelling you would have a match-grade barrel and USGI bolt which would be a nice upgrade.
I've been thinking about this and I think I'll be investing in reloading gear. For me, it's less about the cost of ammo rather than the fact that it's getting a little dull to shoot bulk ammo for target purposes. My 305 seems to shoot 1/2 the group sizes with match-grade commercial ammo versus bulk. I can't see when I'm improving my skills when changes in technique are hidden in the "noise" of low-quality ammo. It also doesn't hurt that reloading will cut the marginal costs of shooting high-quality ammo to equal that of low grade bulk. YMMV.
http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/brass-vs-steel-cased-ammo/
The article makes the point that the cost savings of Russian bulk ammo may still make it a fair decision for some to shoot the Russian and Chinese surplus, while expending barrels as consumables. While M305/M14 replacement barrels are much more expensive (~ $300 plus fitting, maybe a $300 USGI bolt as well) than an AR barrel (estimated in the article to be about $100) it may still make sense for some. If we say the all-in cost of re-barelling plus a new bolt is $800, you would recoup this cost once you'd bought 1,600 rounds of surplus, versus PRIVI let alone Federal or better commercial brands (ignoring the fact that in the latter case you'd also have a ton of reloadable brass). On rebarelling you would have a match-grade barrel and USGI bolt which would be a nice upgrade.
I've been thinking about this and I think I'll be investing in reloading gear. For me, it's less about the cost of ammo rather than the fact that it's getting a little dull to shoot bulk ammo for target purposes. My 305 seems to shoot 1/2 the group sizes with match-grade commercial ammo versus bulk. I can't see when I'm improving my skills when changes in technique are hidden in the "noise" of low-quality ammo. It also doesn't hurt that reloading will cut the marginal costs of shooting high-quality ammo to equal that of low grade bulk. YMMV.
notsorichguy
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- The city that rhymes with fun
If a magnet sticks to the projectile then it is.
Lead is non ferrous.
Lead is non ferrous.
of course lead is non ferrous.. ferrous is just another way to say its Fe2+ Iron..
you mean to say lead is not magnetic
paperslayer
Regular
- Location
- Chilliwack
That is a good article but it must be borne in mind that they were shooting extremely hot rifles and kept shooting them. They even acknowlege this. I think the article made it sound like Federal is the stuf I'd want in a firefight, but it was not a good test of real life barrel wear or accuracy. The reliability was a very interesting point, but again... smokin' hot guns
SouthWest Guy
CGN Regular
- Location
- Leduc County ,AB
M14/M305 is designed to shoot military spec ammo. I remember most of them are copper washed steel case, berdan primer, 150g FMJ.
I shoot 500+ rounds mil surplus ammo last month, no issues at all, only 7-8 cracked cases. Since you don't reload them, no need to worry
I shoot 500+ rounds mil surplus ammo last month, no issues at all, only 7-8 cracked cases. Since you don't reload them, no need to worry
- Location
- Parksville Vancouver Island
Incorect. Some of these norks came with bang on 308 head space I would not reccomend any steel cased ammo in a 308 head space. 7.62 thats a different story. This is because of the laquer that they cover the steel ammo in. There for over time the laquer transfer on to the chamber. As for the cracked cases...
Well that is a scary thing if there is enough preasure to crack a steel case. If it was me I would get that rig checked out.
