enfield mk111
- Thread starter gordonlbyrne
- Start date
- Location
- Winnipeg,Man.
the letters "DP" means the gun was used for "drill purpose" usually a gun that was unfit to be recycled into active service.
I have owned a couple that shot very well indeed.
DP meant Drill Purposes, no doubt.
But a rifle could be DP'd for a lot of reasons. It does not always mean that the rifle is toast or unsafe to fire.
A lot of the wire-wrapped SMLEs were DP'd just on general principle, even though Gawd alone knows how much pressure they took while lobbing Mills Bombs across No Man's Land.
The stamp that would make me worry would be the EY stamp: Emergency use onlY.
But sometimes a rifle would be DP'd just because it needed work or a part. When the part was installed or the repairs made, the stamp remained even though the rifle was fine.
DP meant Drill Purposes, no doubt.
But a rifle could be DP'd for a lot of reasons. It does not always mean that the rifle is toast or unsafe to fire.
A lot of the wire-wrapped SMLEs were DP'd just on general principle, even though Gawd alone knows how much pressure they took while lobbing Mills Bombs across No Man's Land.
The stamp that would make me worry would be the EY stamp: Emergency use onlY.
But sometimes a rifle would be DP'd just because it needed work or a part. When the part was installed or the repairs made, the stamp remained even though the rifle was fine.
thanks guys for the info ,the rifle appeares to be in good shape i have not fired it yet i have dismantled it ,cleaned it,and put it back together there is one thing the serial no is stamped over with a large no 14 . Dose anyone have any toughts on this
Hmmm, not wanting to be a scare monger. But would you jump out of a plane using a training purpose chute, rappel from a tall building using ground training kit, or chamber and fire a ball round through a drill purpose rifle at the shoulder?
I would err on the side of caution and answer no to all three questions. All might look to be in good condition, but who knows?
'It does not always mean that the rifle is toast or unsafe to fire'. Oh yes it does!!! Until it has passed inspection by somebody qualified to do so with the correct guages. I doubt any professional weapons tech would reverse a DP status.
There is a good account from a Brit armourer that posts on another web forum about an instance of a building burning down and a sizeable quantity of No.4 barreled receivers being recovered from the ashes. Before the fire they were serviceable rifles, afterwards the receivers were toast.. They were cleaned up, painted, restocked, made into drill rifles and marked DP. They looked good but the metal had lost its heat treated properties.
Before you pull the trigger, think about what event is about to happen four inches in front of your face at 18.5 tons per square inch pressure. The term 'catastrophic instantaneous dissassembly' comes to my mind. A bit of a gamble, but go ahead if everything passes an armourer's inspection, including receiver hardness. Some DP rifles were made from perfectly good but obscolete models of rifles. But forgive me if I don't stand near`you when you shoot it.
I would err on the side of caution and answer no to all three questions. All might look to be in good condition, but who knows?
'It does not always mean that the rifle is toast or unsafe to fire'. Oh yes it does!!! Until it has passed inspection by somebody qualified to do so with the correct guages. I doubt any professional weapons tech would reverse a DP status.
There is a good account from a Brit armourer that posts on another web forum about an instance of a building burning down and a sizeable quantity of No.4 barreled receivers being recovered from the ashes. Before the fire they were serviceable rifles, afterwards the receivers were toast.. They were cleaned up, painted, restocked, made into drill rifles and marked DP. They looked good but the metal had lost its heat treated properties.
Before you pull the trigger, think about what event is about to happen four inches in front of your face at 18.5 tons per square inch pressure. The term 'catastrophic instantaneous dissassembly' comes to my mind. A bit of a gamble, but go ahead if everything passes an armourer's inspection, including receiver hardness. Some DP rifles were made from perfectly good but obscolete models of rifles. But forgive me if I don't stand near`you when you shoot it.
Last edited:
only the front bayo lug or nose peice and the front hand garde are marked dp,the are no other dp markes on the gun.it dose have a screw right trough the stock ,im thinking ishpore screw could have made it to india that would explain the dp parts since they didnt throw away anything useful,there are no indian markings that i am aware of the gun was made by bsa co 1918
- Location
- Tucson, Arizona
If it came out of India, keep in mind that they NEVER threw anything away. usable parts were recycled, so the DP nosecap could have come from a rifle salvaged for parts.
If it was marked DP on the reciever, that's another story.
If it was marked DP on the reciever, that's another story.
I was just about to say the same, thanks John.
I rebuilt a few Enfields with DP-marked parts - handguards, nose caps, etc. The receiver / barrel being stamped "DP" on the top side, that's a different story.
Lou
I rebuilt a few Enfields with DP-marked parts - handguards, nose caps, etc. The receiver / barrel being stamped "DP" on the top side, that's a different story.
Lou
And then there are the ones that weren't fixed properly because the parts no longer were available.
My Enfield 1907 Mark I* upgraded to * * upgraded to * * * Navy rifle is DP on the front receiver ring. So far, I have been shooting it, off and on, since I rebuilt it in 1965 and it still hasn't disassembled ME catastrophically.
If in doubt, one can always do the old pre/postfiring case measurement and, if still in doubt a mild "re-proofing" well could be in order.
You can duplicate the old Proof loads with a max charge for a 174 bullet.... with a 215 seated. Old spare tire and a string are recommended, of course. Made up a sort-of-a-Proof round once for a P-14 which had been sportered and scoped, the holes for the scope base extending down into the chamber (fortunately at the web, so not tremendously hazardous). Plugged the holes with plug-screws jambed together, cleaned up where the bottom one extended slightly into the chamber, made up the Proof round with 1 grain over MAX for a 150, seated a 180 Sierra. pop. Not "BANG!!!", just 'pop'. Still have the rifle today; it makes teeny-tiny little groups all day long.
And that one wasn't even a DP!
Think there could be room around here for careful inspection and reconstruction.
My Enfield 1907 Mark I* upgraded to * * upgraded to * * * Navy rifle is DP on the front receiver ring. So far, I have been shooting it, off and on, since I rebuilt it in 1965 and it still hasn't disassembled ME catastrophically.
If in doubt, one can always do the old pre/postfiring case measurement and, if still in doubt a mild "re-proofing" well could be in order.
You can duplicate the old Proof loads with a max charge for a 174 bullet.... with a 215 seated. Old spare tire and a string are recommended, of course. Made up a sort-of-a-Proof round once for a P-14 which had been sportered and scoped, the holes for the scope base extending down into the chamber (fortunately at the web, so not tremendously hazardous). Plugged the holes with plug-screws jambed together, cleaned up where the bottom one extended slightly into the chamber, made up the Proof round with 1 grain over MAX for a 150, seated a 180 Sierra. pop. Not "BANG!!!", just 'pop'. Still have the rifle today; it makes teeny-tiny little groups all day long.
And that one wasn't even a DP!
Think there could be room around here for careful inspection and reconstruction.
The thread below started out as a simple question for Peter Laidler about the definition of the "ZF" marking that appears on Enfield rifles. It turned into a wide ranging multi-page discussion about this marking, as well as "DP" markings, with Peter and other Enfield experts elaborating and explaining in detail the variations and meaning of these markings, plus additional feedback about Canadian Long Branch rifles.
"ZF" marking on Enfields? (click here)http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=18070
Although not specifically about the "DP" marking, Peter also wrote a very interesting article for inclusion in the Knowledge Library under the section Technical Articles for Milsurp Collectors and Re-loaders (click here)http://www.milsurps.com/forumdisplay.php?f=25.
L59A1 DP Rifle (by Peter Laidler) (click here)http://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=18957
Regards,
Badger
