that C\C Mk I* is really ###y, how much they go for, if any are available at all?
Enfields
- Thread starter Nats
- Start date
WOW I think I've got 3-4 boxes...makes me richer..them I think..lol..I heard it was going up..but like $45-50 a box..$90.00...getting up there with 50 cal!
In South Africa the LE Cavalry Carbines are rather uncommon. At an auction I would expect the hammer price for one in good shape to be a bit north of the equivalent of 1000 of your dollars. However, I don't think that international prices can be compared.
ahhh, didn't notice you were SA
These were made on equipment purchased from Britain, they're the only No4 Mk 2 made outside of the UK. The equipment came from ROF Fazakerly. They're nicely made rifles. Yours was made in 1961 making it a very late Lee Enfield.
Once upon a time, I had a huge Lee Enfield collection. Maybe 10 years ago I sold them all, made a tidy profit at the time, and it paid for a big renovation of my house back then (new windows, roof and furnace).
My interests had moved on, or so I thought. Recently over the last year or so, I've gotten back into collecting milsurps, including Enfields. These prices now though!! lol.
I always liked the SMLE much more than the No.4/5 series rifles, they are more elegant arms with generally better finishes, curved surfaces, etc. and I always found them a little better ergonomically. Of course, I think a properly fited No.4 will outshoot the average SMLE - they have more effective sights and heavier barrels - but a well fitted SMLE is still no slouch, and they just look better (there - I said it!).
Here are the last 3 SMLE's I've purchased - all within the last few weeks.
From top to bottom:
- 1913 BSA MkIII, Australian issued, marked to 2MD. (I also have a nice 1917 dated 2MD marked Lithgow P1907 bayonet for it). This ia cool rifle with cutoff, volleys, etc.
- RFI 1960 conversion of what was originally a WW1 era BSA MkIII* (scrubbed receiver cypher, but some of the original manufacturing proofs are still there, including a matching EFD 1936 FTR barrel that had beautiful rifling before the Indians demilled it).
- RFI re-manufacture of a WW1 RSAF Enfield MkIII (with cutoff slot below woodline). I got this unissued in the cosmolene from an estate sale, it's not a recent import.
Receiver on the bottom rifle is a pre-1915 RSAF Enfield (based on manufacturing proofs) with a scrubbed original cypher, re-marked below the safety as a 1945 Ishapore MkIII*. It's a good example of how Ishapore used serviceable parts off older unserviceable rifles during new production in WW2. This one must have been made at the very end of the war and never ended up being re-issued.
As an aside, I didn't buy the DP rifle to steal the wood - I thought it would be cool to have a repsentative DP MkIII* in the collection - most everyone is tearing these down to de-sporterize other rifles, they may one day actually be rare for that reason. I chose this one (Switzers) as what I thought was the nicest of a half dozen they just auctioned off, and spent an ungodly amount of time cleaning all the cosmolene off it so it could be handled and displayed. It's kind of weird to me guys are robbing Indian stocks made of sheesham rosewood or luan mahogany, often with post-war strap re-enforcements, and putting them on WW1 British SMLE's then calling them "restored". To me all those guns look wrong.
Interestingly, the DP rifle it had an old Springfield Sporters aluminum inventory tag on it - no idea if all the ones currently at retailers also have these aluminum inventory tags or not, but Springfield Sporters shut down its retail operation a good many years ago - their heyday was from the 1960's up through the very early 2000's. Century Arms bought the brand and all their left over inventory in 2019 - which I think is where all of these have recently come from. Springfield used to use these (they had thousands of these DP rifles) to strip and sell SMLE parts, but they would also sell you the whole DP rifle. They also had what seems like a near inexhaustible supply of live (but usually dirty) Indian-issued SMLEs and No.4's. Makes me wonder if SS is also where all the recent Indian-issued SMLEs and No.4's have been coming from (???).
My interests had moved on, or so I thought. Recently over the last year or so, I've gotten back into collecting milsurps, including Enfields. These prices now though!! lol.
I always liked the SMLE much more than the No.4/5 series rifles, they are more elegant arms with generally better finishes, curved surfaces, etc. and I always found them a little better ergonomically. Of course, I think a properly fited No.4 will outshoot the average SMLE - they have more effective sights and heavier barrels - but a well fitted SMLE is still no slouch, and they just look better (there - I said it!).
Here are the last 3 SMLE's I've purchased - all within the last few weeks.
From top to bottom:
- 1913 BSA MkIII, Australian issued, marked to 2MD. (I also have a nice 1917 dated 2MD marked Lithgow P1907 bayonet for it). This ia cool rifle with cutoff, volleys, etc.
- RFI 1960 conversion of what was originally a WW1 era BSA MkIII* (scrubbed receiver cypher, but some of the original manufacturing proofs are still there, including a matching EFD 1936 FTR barrel that had beautiful rifling before the Indians demilled it).
- RFI re-manufacture of a WW1 RSAF Enfield MkIII (with cutoff slot below woodline). I got this unissued in the cosmolene from an estate sale, it's not a recent import.
Receiver on the bottom rifle is a pre-1915 RSAF Enfield (based on manufacturing proofs) with a scrubbed original cypher, re-marked below the safety as a 1945 Ishapore MkIII*. It's a good example of how Ishapore used serviceable parts off older unserviceable rifles during new production in WW2. This one must have been made at the very end of the war and never ended up being re-issued.
As an aside, I didn't buy the DP rifle to steal the wood - I thought it would be cool to have a repsentative DP MkIII* in the collection - most everyone is tearing these down to de-sporterize other rifles, they may one day actually be rare for that reason. I chose this one (Switzers) as what I thought was the nicest of a half dozen they just auctioned off, and spent an ungodly amount of time cleaning all the cosmolene off it so it could be handled and displayed. It's kind of weird to me guys are robbing Indian stocks made of sheesham rosewood or luan mahogany, often with post-war strap re-enforcements, and putting them on WW1 British SMLE's then calling them "restored". To me all those guns look wrong.
Interestingly, the DP rifle it had an old Springfield Sporters aluminum inventory tag on it - no idea if all the ones currently at retailers also have these aluminum inventory tags or not, but Springfield Sporters shut down its retail operation a good many years ago - their heyday was from the 1960's up through the very early 2000's. Century Arms bought the brand and all their left over inventory in 2019 - which I think is where all of these have recently come from. Springfield used to use these (they had thousands of these DP rifles) to strip and sell SMLE parts, but they would also sell you the whole DP rifle. They also had what seems like a near inexhaustible supply of live (but usually dirty) Indian-issued SMLEs and No.4's. Makes me wonder if SS is also where all the recent Indian-issued SMLEs and No.4's have been coming from (???).
Indeed. I think a lot of people also don’t realize the dp wood has been cut away either side of the front receiver ring to weld in the demil plug.
Unless you are splicing in patches there, they look terrible on de-sporterized rifles, tie strap or not.
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Just picked up this nice matching non-refurb Australian No.1MkIII*. Receiver is MA Lithgow 1942, and all the metal is 1942, but the wood is a mix of 1942 and 1943 (all numbered matching in the same font). I suspect January 1943 production, which would jive with the blackened brass stock band and rear swivel base.
Nicely fitted draw plates too...
Nicely fitted draw plates too...
Right on! I have both a M1 and a Mk2. In one article I read it stated something to the effect that there was a rumour that Mk2 POF's actually exist. Well, you and it, at least, have one. Lots of milsurp people scoff at the idea that No.4 rifles were made in Pakistan.
I had a late production POF No4 and the fit & finish was much better than many other No4's in my possession. A superb rifle and very accurate too. Regret selling that one..
What model?
The last 1907’s were made in 1945 in Australia. India made a shortened version with a squared off pommel into the 1960’s.
Indeed. I have also owned one, so can confirm they exist.
Yes. The 1907 pattern bayonet.
Are 1945 Aussie bayonets hard to find
Are 1945 Aussie bayonets hard to find?
I would say yes. Up to 43 is easy to find. 44 and 45 are harder.
P&S has a couple 44’s on their website, no 45’s currently.
Very nice Long Branch 22, I look forward to hearing how she shoots on the range 
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I am in the process of restoring two C broad arrow marked SMLEs, one from 1916 and the other from 1918, that both got a 1942 dated Long Branch barrel installed at some point during their service. I wonder if they were refurbished at SAL or if only the barrels were made there and they were refurbished elsewhere. Given the size of SAL, I would like to believe the work was done there. Does anyone have any more information on SMLEs in Canadian service post WW1 ? Skennerton's's book didn't seem to go into great detail (perhaps there isn't much information to begin with ?), and I was hoping to find out more.
Either way, I am looking forward to getting the two of them out to the range very soon.
.I am in the process of restoring two C broad arrow marked SMLEs, one from 1916 and the other from 1918, that both got a 1942 dated Long Branch barrel installed at some point during their service. I wonder if they were refurbished at SAL or if only the barrels were made there and they were refurbished elsewhere. Given the size of SAL, I would like to believe the work was done there. Does anyone have any more information on SMLEs in Canadian service post WW1 ? Skennerton's's book didn't seem to go into great detail (perhaps there isn't much information to begin with ?), and I was hoping to find out more.
Either way, I am looking forward to getting the two of them out to the range very soon.
Lonbranch began No.4 production in late 1941, and there would be it have been enough No.4 rifles to fully replace the SMLE in front line service until some time in 1943, so it’s very possible no.1 rifles were officially re-barrelled in Canada in 1942.
SMLEs would have served in secondary roles in Canada and abroad through to the end of hostilities, I would think.
SMLEs would have served in secondary roles in Canada and abroad through to the end of hostilities, I would think.
