Enlighten me on 25-20.

[tokguy]

Because I'm simple this way... I found that among the several dozen different reloading die sets, I didn't have a set in 25-20.
So I bought a match ( more or less) to my Marlin 27s in 32-20... got one in 25-20 coming in the mail.
Word around the campfire is these buggers are great fun... but like to split necks on the brass.
OK... I can dip the mouth of the case in molten lead to anneal them...gotcha. Or better to immerse to the shoulder in water and hit them with a torch?
Any other tricks? Neck size only? What about the Lee Enfield 'O' ring trick...think it would help?
Interweb is all over the place on the headspace issue with these.
Thanks
Tokguy

 

[fingers284]

I have never owned or loaded 25-20 but always wanted one, sort of a "bucket list" thing that aint never going to happen now...but...

I did have a buddy that loaded a lot of 25-20 and 32-20 ( I have done a pile of 32-20) and also discussed them over a few campfires....his words...if you think loading 32-20 is a fragile situation, 25-20 can be much more delicate. I load 32-20 at half the speed that i load modern brass cartridges and he claimed 25-20 was best done at 1/2 that speed "or lots of crumples will be the end result". He never mentioned annealing, but was emphatic that "slow and very easy flaring or seating" was essential.

The old boy has passed and i cant ask him for his pet loads for you...he could sure make those steel sillywets ding when he hit them but didn't have the oomff to topple them

 

[tokguy]

I have never owned or loaded 25-20 but always wanted one, sort of a "bucket list" thing that aint never going to happen now...but...

I did have a buddy that loaded a lot of 25-20 and 32-20 ( I have done a pile of 32-20) and also discussed them over a few campfires....his words...if you think loading 32-20 is a fragile situation, 25-20 can be much more delicate. I load 32-20 at half the speed that i load modern brass cartridges and he claimed 25-20 was best done at 1/2 that speed "or lots of crumples will be the end result". He never mentioned annealing, but was emphatic that "slow and very easy flaring or seating" was essential.

The old boy has passed and i cant ask him for his pet loads for you...he could sure make those steel sillywets ding when he hit them but didn't have the oomff to topple them

My 32-20 sure has a large chamber...it's hard on brass resizing them. If the 25-20 passes muster I'll likely be resizing a bunch of Starline 32-20 I'm guessing. Even annealing 25-20 seems to be tricky... I don't know that I'm that handy... gonna try though. Time to head to the Bunkhouse and pull Water's 'Pet Loads' down I suppose. Tried a google search on it and it's full of the usual BS " I've never wrecked a piece of 25-20 brass...10 reloads and counting now..."...um, yeah...sure... I believe you... noty so much.
Hard to separate the 'Wheat from the Chaff'.
Where is Terry Weiland when we need him?

 

[vagrantviking]

Annealing is probably a good idea if the chamber isn't as tight as it should be. With these older ones that's likely. Not sure how difficult it is to find a neck sizing die but one could be custom made.

Dipping into lead is great for temperature control but I always had a lot stick to the brass. I mean to try a small Lee pot with sand one of these days.

It should be possible with a torch and spin in a socket but it would require a careful touch.

 

[porpoise]

I have 3 25 20's i don't find anything special about reloading them. Like any round that needs flaring to seat cast the necks will split eventually, I have one rifle that I shoot only Hornady 60 gr. Jacketed, no flaring necessary and I get over 10 reloads easy, not sure why anyone would not believe that. In fact I think I get that many out of a lot of my cast bullet loads. I make my brass out of 32 20, and aneal with a torch and a cotton glove, not sure how well my annealing works as it is not very consistent. I also have 44 40's that people seem to angst over for no reason as far as reloading goes, the hard part of 25 20 is finding good load combinations. I use an ordinary steel full length die with no lube inside or out and never crumple cases, just like I do for the 44 40. You will lose some necking down from 32 20, at least I do, although I'm sure some people with better methods don't lose any. I use lube and lower the ram in stages while relubing and turning the bras 90 degrees each time

 

[Eagleye]

I have an older Savage Bolt action in 25-20. The chamber is not bad at all for size.
My rifle seems to prefer the heavier [86] grain bullets, and I can load spitzer type
bullets since this rifle has a detachable magazine.

I have loaded 75, 80, 85, 87 and 90 grain bullets with success. My best accuracy
comes with Reloder 7, and best velocity with Li'l Gun.

I have good case life with my rifle, often exceeding 10 reloads before splits start
to show up. All my cases are 25-20 head stamps [WW Super, R-P and Dominion]

These cases have relatively thin necks, so if you are annealing, you must be
careful not to overdo it. This is a fun chambering. Dave.

 

[tokguy]

I have 3 25 20's i don't find anything special about reloading them. Like any round that needs flaring to seat cast the necks will split eventually, I have one rifle that I shoot only Hornady 60 gr. Jacketed, no flaring necessary and I get over 10 reloads easy, not sure why anyone would not believe that.

Ah friend... I suspect that you are blessed with better hands and more patience than most.
Certain things I realise are best not attempted... not going to be cutting diamonds or making Oak cupboards soon... I am not blessed with the skills for that.
I do reload 22 Hornet successfully... most of the time. Still crumple some.
My 32-20 is problematic in that it blows the necks to oversize... the shoulder is mere suggestion. That brass is likely better resized to 25 if the 25-20 is sporting a better chamber I'm thinking.
Not that I can't reload 32-20...had a Single Shot Husky that performed marvelous. But my 27s reminds me of brass that a Ross 'E' barrel throws... just ugly.
Thanks for the input...I shall heed it as much as I can

 

[Potashminer]

I have no experience with re-sizing those, but did try my hand to make 7x61 Sharpe and Hart from 7mm Rem Mag parent brass - 3mm longer than I needed, and shoulder moved back and re-shaped significantly. Initial attempts just crumpled at the parent brass shoulder. Hit on the idea to first run the parent brass into the 7x61 S&H bullet seating die - with the seating stem removed - that did a "part way" re-shaping - so ended up not going from parent to finish in one step. Not certain it applies in your case, but might help?? Maybe a series for your blown out cases - into a 32-20 (or similar size) seating die, then into a 25-20 seating die, then into a full-length size 25-20??

At the time, just had a single leverage RCBS press, so really could not apply a lot of force - had previously bent the handle discovering that a snipe on a loading press handle - to form 243 Win from mil-surp 7.62 NATO - probably not a good idea - I suspect my current RockChucker with compound leverage would probably do the trick??

For some of my rifles, I do a "partial" size - chamber is too long, I think - so end up with a gap between sizing die and the shell holder - resulting cartridge chambers fine in the rifle of concern - won't chamber into another rifle supposedly using same cartridge. My thinking was that the bullet seating die needed no lube on the case body - should not be touching - so all the action was going to happen to the case neck only. So, would think could try final re-sizing in the FL die in stages - say two or three steps - get a bit more done each time?? Might help to remove the expander ball until the last sizing, or do like I have read and do the last step as expander ball being pushed down into an already sized neck? At the time, had read that RCBS sold a "forming" series of dies to create that 7x61 S&H brass - was just too stubborn to pay the coin that they were asking...

As far as annealing, my limited experience at that is with the salt bath annealing system - just like the instructions say - count of 5 seconds dunk for depth of neck and shoulder - then drop case into bucket of water to stop the heat spread - get discolouration about 3/16" or so down the body past the shoulder. I am certainly no expert at it, but has been working fine for me. 7.62 NATO and that previously mentioned 7x61 S&H brass. I also "annealed" a batch of previously fired 7mm Rem Mag to use that COW method to fire form into 458 Win Mag brass, but have not yet fired them off.

A picture showing progression from 7mm Rem Mag on left to usable 7x61S&H on right - using the bullet seating die, then the sizing die, then trimming. Shoulder crease marks pretty much go away on full power firing.

 

[CzyHorse]

The 3 step process I follow resizing new Starline 32-20 down to 25-20,

-1st step, very important, make sure the case mouth is round, I use a Lee Universal Expanding die and just touch case mouth. Case mouths get damaged during shipping and will fold inward if not round.
-2nd step, Redding Form & Trim Die #83218 for 25-20Win and a minicule amount of Imperial Sizing Wax.
-3rd step, 25-20Win full lenght sizing die.

In my Rock Chucker I was able to use the short Form & Trim Die without a shell holder extension. The Form & Trim Die is very short.

I anneal using the variable speed drill, heat & quench method.

 

[mbogo3]

Annealing with a variable speed drill involves a stationary torch and a drill with a deep enough socket to hold the case while allowing the neck and shoulder to protrude.The case is spun over the flame for a predetermined time and the brass is plunked into a container of H20.