Explain the CZ-75/Shadow/Shadow 2 to me
- Thread starter rkm456
- Start date
1riot1ranger
CGN Regular
- Location
- Calgary, AB
Executive Summary: Low cost, out-of-the-box awesomeness.
For (depending on the source) $800, it's hard to find a better "entry" pistol. When you buy a Shadow, you are getting the same gun used by the top guys in the country/world.
decent price point
excellent accuracy
good trigger
good sights
excellent balance/recoil vector
great reliability
availability of parts
availability of accessories
For (depending on the source) $800, it's hard to find a better "entry" pistol. When you buy a Shadow, you are getting the same gun used by the top guys in the country/world.
decent price point
excellent accuracy
good trigger
good sights
excellent balance/recoil vector
great reliability
availability of parts
availability of accessories
^^
Plus a grip size that seems to fit a wide range of people. It's difficult to find a pistol at this price-point that is as controllable under rapid fire. This isn't a major issue for most uses but in a speed game like IPSC tenths of a second count.
Plus a grip size that seems to fit a wide range of people. It's difficult to find a pistol at this price-point that is as controllable under rapid fire. This isn't a major issue for most uses but in a speed game like IPSC tenths of a second count.
I have the shadow and just received the shadow 2 today. Yippeee! Anyway, the shadow and shadow 2 takes advantage of the current ipsc production rules. You can tune the trigger using cz factory parts to 3lbs or less. The heavy weight helps control muzzle flip. The shadow 2 fixed a couple of deficiencies from the shadow. In my opinion, 1) the extended mag release is easier to reach and easier to press 2) the slim safety allows my strong hand thumb to release the slide stop 3) the added grip serrations are fairly aggressive (better than my tanfoglio i have to say), and the blue side grips are more aggressive than the standard aluminum thin grips.
I certainly do feel that any polymer striker fired pistol is at a disadvantage....and i love my glocks.
The grip, and the way that the gun feels in your hands is enough for me. But there is also all the other points that people have mentioned above, great accuracy, excellent recoil control, and above all, 100% reliability. I own 5 CZ's, and I have never had any failure to feeds, and it literally always ate what ever I put in it. I was a 1911 shooter prior, and now that I have gone CZ, I am never turning back!
For ipsc production? Absolutely the cz is better. However, the p226 platform is too thick for my hands. So that's a very big factor for me.
Cost and the availability of IPSC production legal parts.
BTW just in case anyone is interested.
IPSC world shoot 2011 Production division: 1st Glock 17, 2nd Beretta 92, 3rd CZ shadow, 4th Sig 226
IPSC world shoot 2014 Production division: 1st Tanfogilo, 2nd Tanfogilo, 3rd Tanfogilo, 4th Cz shadow
PS: Not sure about 2014 but in 2011 10 of the top 20 were Shadows
BTW just in case anyone is interested.
IPSC world shoot 2011 Production division: 1st Glock 17, 2nd Beretta 92, 3rd CZ shadow, 4th Sig 226
IPSC world shoot 2014 Production division: 1st Tanfogilo, 2nd Tanfogilo, 3rd Tanfogilo, 4th Cz shadow
PS: Not sure about 2014 but in 2011 10 of the top 20 were Shadows
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I had a P226 Extreme that I shot well. Its ergonomics were well suited to me. Then I got a CZ75 SP01 Shadow. Even though I shot the Sig well, I shot the CZ just a little bit better. I found the ergos on the CZ fit me just a little better than the Sig. There was no single "deal breaker", but I found that when I went to the range, I tended to take the CZ and the Sig stayed in the safe. After a while, I came to realize that the P226 was an amazing gun, and it deserved better than to be left in the safe, and I sold it. There was nothing wrong with the Sig, the CZ was (for me) just a little better in a few different areas.
Among the things that I like on the CZ:
Low bore axis results in minimal muzzle flip and a low perceived recoil.
Fantastic Trigger
It is very accurate
It has a fiber-optic front sight
The ergos (Mag release button, slide lock/release, safety, general balance & feel) feel like they were custom made for me
I shoot IDPA, and although using the safety puts me into ESP (the P226 was SSP), I prefer it to the first shot being DA (With the P226, the first shot was DA and then the rest (after the gun cycled) were SA so you had two different trigger pulls.)
Both the P226 and the CZ SP01 Shadow are great guns. For me, the CZ was slightly better in enough small ways that it became the one I chose.
(The P226 Extreme had one thing that I really liked though and those were the Hogue G10 grips and so I ordered a set and put them on my CZ.)
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I have collected the cz75/85 series since they first came here. I have old European limited editions from the 80s. factory made some and then stopped.
fun guns to shoot, not sig 210s, but took some of the ideas in designing 75. I still like my 210s,
fun guns to shoot, not sig 210s, but took some of the ideas in designing 75. I still like my 210s,
Northaways
Regular
- Location
- Northaways
x2!!!
Northaways
Regular
- Location
- Northaways
Have the Shadow and Shadow 2 as well as the P226 TacOps. Love the Sig, but love the CZ's WAY more! For all the reasons posters have mentioned. IMHO no contest btwn the two.
hatman1793
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
It appears that almost every "quality" 1911, or Sig, and now some Glocks, are C$1000.00.....to start! So lumping all the candidates in about the same price-point, the Shadow2 @ C$1299.00 is the winner, has superior features, and a proven track record.
1. Minimal low profile slide keeps the axis bore low.
2. Longer barrel than the Sig, Glock or 1911.
3. CZ barrel bushing system has a much shallower angle creating a better lockup than the 1911's. S2 bushing is just tighter. Glocks, Sigs have no bushing lockup.
4. 9mm is outdistancing the 45acp cartridge. 9mm is cheaper to buy, cheaper to reload, more available than 45acp.
5. S2 in 9mm is fast to reload, 10 round mags, less recoil than 40 S&W & 45acp..
6. S2 is an out of the box superior pistol. Plus easily customizable, costing less than most 1911 improvements.
1. Minimal low profile slide keeps the axis bore low.
2. Longer barrel than the Sig, Glock or 1911.
3. CZ barrel bushing system has a much shallower angle creating a better lockup than the 1911's. S2 bushing is just tighter. Glocks, Sigs have no bushing lockup.
4. 9mm is outdistancing the 45acp cartridge. 9mm is cheaper to buy, cheaper to reload, more available than 45acp.
5. S2 in 9mm is fast to reload, 10 round mags, less recoil than 40 S&W & 45acp..
6. S2 is an out of the box superior pistol. Plus easily customizable, costing less than most 1911 improvements.
I picked up a Shadow this fall used with less than 100 rds down the pipe. IMHO the trigger it has, if it is representative of the Shadows being sold today, is something south of good. Not bad but nothing like the stock Shadow I had six or seven years ago. In fact the Shadow I have now has a trigger on par with a regular 75B and the latter has a firing pin block and sell for less. Now I know the trigger pull can be improved and certainly will improve with use but compared to the Shadowline, I have the regular Shadow trigger is not even close. The Shadowline comes with a trigger more like the old Shadow I had.
The new Shadow2 looks like the gun to get for IPSC Production. The downside is your performance is going to be on you the shooter. :>) not the gun. As if it ever was otherwise. For most, I am not sure it makes any difference what you buy, The Shadow or Shadow2. The only real difference is about $500. give or take and who has the $500 in their pocket.
I would not describe the regular Shadow an "Entry Level" gun. Hell it has won more IPSC Production titles than any other gun on the planet I suspect. An entry level CZ might be a 75B but even then, with a decent trigger job I doubt most B &C shooters I have shot with would notice the difference in scoring. The CZ's are that good. The Shadow2 has yet to prove itself. It should do well and will be in the hands of the CZ Production shooting team for obvious reasons. Time will tell if the bar has been moved significantly.
Take Care
Bob
The new Shadow2 looks like the gun to get for IPSC Production. The downside is your performance is going to be on you the shooter. :>) not the gun. As if it ever was otherwise. For most, I am not sure it makes any difference what you buy, The Shadow or Shadow2. The only real difference is about $500. give or take and who has the $500 in their pocket.
I would not describe the regular Shadow an "Entry Level" gun. Hell it has won more IPSC Production titles than any other gun on the planet I suspect. An entry level CZ might be a 75B but even then, with a decent trigger job I doubt most B &C shooters I have shot with would notice the difference in scoring. The CZ's are that good. The Shadow2 has yet to prove itself. It should do well and will be in the hands of the CZ Production shooting team for obvious reasons. Time will tell if the bar has been moved significantly.
Take Care
Bob
Other than the reputation it has as a competitive gun it's just plain good to hold and shoot.
I was lucky enough to have DVC just down the road from me when I got interested in shooting. I tried out ALL the 9's they had. And that was roughly a dozen different guns from Glock, Beretta, IWI, S&W, Steyr, STI and a couple of others I don't recall at the moment. I did this over 8 to 10 visits. In the end the short list was down to the IWI Jericho (branded as Baby Eagle at the time) and the Beretta. Then someone let me try their CZ Shadow. For me it was simply Love from the very first magazine. It felt good in the hands and I loved the trigger. A Shadow became my first gun purchase as a result.
I'd already figured out that my preference was and still is for all metal guns with hammer fired actions from previous visits where I rotated through all the nines in their inventory. I just liked them better than the feel and balance of the polymer frame guns and striker triggers. And for me, and many others it seems, the CZ is the cream of the crop. Enough so that when I came across a medium well used pre B 75 it did not take much thinking to say "I'll take it". The two CZ's are the core for my 9mm "fleet". And they sure ain't going anywhere without me any time soon.
I was lucky enough to have DVC just down the road from me when I got interested in shooting. I tried out ALL the 9's they had. And that was roughly a dozen different guns from Glock, Beretta, IWI, S&W, Steyr, STI and a couple of others I don't recall at the moment. I did this over 8 to 10 visits. In the end the short list was down to the IWI Jericho (branded as Baby Eagle at the time) and the Beretta. Then someone let me try their CZ Shadow. For me it was simply Love from the very first magazine. It felt good in the hands and I loved the trigger. A Shadow became my first gun purchase as a result.
I'd already figured out that my preference was and still is for all metal guns with hammer fired actions from previous visits where I rotated through all the nines in their inventory. I just liked them better than the feel and balance of the polymer frame guns and striker triggers. And for me, and many others it seems, the CZ is the cream of the crop. Enough so that when I came across a medium well used pre B 75 it did not take much thinking to say "I'll take it". The two CZ's are the core for my 9mm "fleet". And they sure ain't going anywhere without me any time soon.
All of the references here to the Shadow...are they short hand for SP-01 Shadow, or the actual Shadow itself? I find their naming convention confusing.
I have the SP-01 Shadow because it's pretty well all I could find in stores the week I decided I needed to own a pistol. Is it mostly on par with the Shadow in terms of how it'll suit someone new to IPSC?
I have the SP-01 Shadow because it's pretty well all I could find in stores the week I decided I needed to own a pistol. Is it mostly on par with the Shadow in terms of how it'll suit someone new to IPSC?
heavenIsAlie
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Abbotsford
it's the best fix of cost and performance. It isn't perfect but I haven't seen anything that beats it for a similar cost with the base shadow and the shadow 2. Keep in mind with a stock shadow there is $100-$200 worth of parts you will want to add to it right off the bat, but still a good price. The only thing that has challenged it recently was the GP x-cal when it was cheaper, now its price put it just a bit worse.
