Fair chase "Define"

Guys - it's really not that complex.

There is a reasonable accepted definition:
“Fair chase is the ethical and lawful pursuit and taking of free ranging wild game animals in a manner that does not give the hunter an improper or unfair advantage over such animals.”
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'unfair' is usually accepted to be where the animal has less of a chance evading you than you do of taking it. The advantage should lean to the animal. And without a doubt, all methods in canada pretty much guarantee that the average deer has a much better chance of avoiding the hunter than the average hunter has of shooting that deer. We take a small percent of the heard every year. Most animals will evade us.

This concept precludes the use of tools or techniques that make it 'too easy'. We all know a 300 yard rifle is no guarantee you'll even see a deer or get a shot off if you do. You still need to hunt. A helicopter gunship on the other hand might be a bit of an unfair advantage :)

Improper is usually accepted to be anything that either leads to an unnecessary or completely avoidable higher risk of wounding or losing animals or causing them severe distress without reason, anything that may result in the animal population as a whole being impacted negatively in such a fashion that it becomes less sustainable, and anything that puts other humans at risk.

You can't get into specifics like 'baiting is not fair chase' because it depends on the animal and the local circumstances as to whether or not it's fair or proper. If baiting bears means that fewer females with cubs are shot, then that might well be the best choice. If in another place they decide not to allow it due to the dangers of habituated bears, then that's the best choice.

It's a principle, not a specific set of actions. You have to apply the principle to what YOU do in YOUR situation and ask yourself if your methods and tools honestly fit the definition. Is it 'fair chase' for me to shoot at running deer at 100 yards? No - i can't make that shot often enough to be 'proper' and 'fair' to the animal. Can others? Probably - there's likely lots of guys who practice for that and could make the shot and get a clean kill with great consistency.

All you need to know is the principle. Then just apply it to what you do. "Ethical AND legal". "fair and proper". Most of us have a pretty good idea of what that means and the ideas behind it.

Why complicate things?
 
senior said:
So you are excluding all stand hunters?

How about the handicapped, no need for them to hunt either?
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Nope. It takes sweat and effort to get that stand in there etc etc etc. As for handicap, you better be putting in the effort if you're in a chair or whatever. Hunting is not simply shooting, and my buddy puts in a lot of effort to get his moose from his chair.
 
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I read somewhere that the concept of fair chase was introduced as an early conservationist response to the damage poachers and market hunters were doing to the resource. "Sport" hunters (usually wealthy upper class types) used the notion to distinguish what they did from the guys who were bagging dozens of ducks a day with punt guns.

I can't say that I particularly like the concept; it smacks of the sort of silly elitist snobbery that holds that if you aren't hunting in tweeds, with a fine English double gun, and with dogs that have a pedigree longer than Prince Charles', you're some sort of barbaric cad and bounder.

But even if it is a silly, "ethical" social constraint on hunters committing excesses, I suppose it's useful.

I'd define it by the way, as hunting within every limit imposed by the law (no matter how silly), using the minimum of equipment and technology required to humanely kill game, never letting meat go to waste, minimizing my ecological impact, and hunting on foot if I can.

That being said, my liking for simple, casual and local hunting is a personal choice, and providing people aren't breaking the law, I'm not going to cast aspersions.
 
I define "fair chase" as any of those idiotic rules concocted by "sport hunters" to increase the degree of difficulty in their "sport" and/or to give them some reason to feel superior to their peers.

While I certainly support sport hunting on the grounds that for hunters of any stripe - if we don't support each other, hunting will someday be outlawed for all of us - but I am not a fan of killing animals for the "sport" of it, and I don't personally kill animals for sport, I kill them for food (or I might see myself to kill predators for management reasons - though I have never actually done so). As such, I would have no qualms about doing anything I can legally do to increase my chances of making a harvest or to increase my chances of making a very quick/clean kill (ie: some means to get up close and personal to the animal). Yep, I hunt around water holes, yep I hunt around food sources, and yep, I hunt mineral licks. I have never hunted "bait" that I personally placed (though, such is legal in B.C., with the exception of for bears), but as far as I'm concerned, the difference between hunting a clover patch that I didn't personally plant vs hunting a patch that I did is... it's less work to hunt the naturally occurring patch. :)

To each his own. But you asked my opinion, so there it is.
 
brotherjack said:
I define "fair chase" as any of those idiotic rules concocted by "sport hunters" to increase the degree of difficulty in their "sport" and/or to give them some reason to feel superior to their peers.

While I certainly support sport hunting on the grounds that for hunters of any stripe - if we don't support each other, hunting will someday be outlawed for all of us - but I am not a fan of killing animals for the "sport" of it, and I don't personally kill animals for sport, I kill them for food (or I might see myself to kill predators for management reasons - though I have never actually done so). As such, I would have no qualms about doing anything I can legally do to increase my chances of making a harvest or to increase my chances of making a very quick/clean kill (ie: some means to get up close and personal to the animal). Yep, I hunt around water holes, yep I hunt around food sources, and yep, I hunt mineral licks. I have never hunted "bait" that I personally placed (though, such is legal in B.C., with the exception of for bears), but as far as I'm concerned, the difference between hunting a clover patch that I didn't personally plant vs hunting a patch that I did is... it's less work to hunt the naturally occurring patch. :)

To each his own. But you asked my opinion, so there it is.
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many people make the point that they do what is LEGAL, but why are some things legal and others not? why is it illegal to pitlamp? hunting during the day adds a degree of difficulty. and if it was legal to use lights would it be OK? what about set guns? poison? i poison mice, why not use poison on a grizzly or cougar, or a deer for that matter? what about snaring game animals?

i don't shoot animals spotted from the vehicle, others do, that is their choice. (but i will make fun of people that are all camo'ed out and tell me that they put on hundreds of km's of driving and didn't see anything). i don't shoot a doe with fawns, others do, fine. i don't shoot the first 4 point muley i see, many people do, fine. i *enjoy* hunting, if it was all about getting meat in the freezer it would be a pretty short season. ever taken a day off work to go hunting? if so you might as well have gone to work and bought a side or quarter of beef with the money you made.

so having a personal code of conduct is idiotic?
 
sealhunter said:
Nope. It takes sweat and effort to get that stand in there etc etc etc. As for handicap, you better be putting in the effort if you're in a chair or whatever. Hunting is not simply shooting, and my buddy puts in a lot of effort to get his moose from his chair.
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Ok what's the definition of hunting :D
Is it being in the bush for the pleasure of killing something!
Is it "looking for" an animal to kill for meat or profit(such as fur bearing) ?

I hear what your saying but guys that won't hunt over bait will hunt over a cut corn field :confused:
 
Foxer said:
Guys - it's really not that complex.

Isn't it!

There is a reasonable accepted definition:


'unfair' is usually accepted to be where the animal has less of a chance evading you than you do of taking it. The advantage should lean to the animal. And without a doubt, all methods in canada pretty much guarantee that the average deer has a much better chance of avoiding the hunter than the average hunter has of shooting that deer. We take a small percent of the heard every year. Most animals will evade us.

This concept precludes the use of tools or techniques that make it 'too easy'.
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Ok then using any modern firearm (or un-modern:rolleyes:) is an unfair advantage!

The advantage should lean to the animal.

If the advantage was toward the animal we would NEVER be successful ;)
 
The definition of hunting, as i have found on these threads many a time, is not standard.

What I call hunting may or may not be what you do. The actual definition of hunting is much to vague for me. Persuing animals can be done on foot, horseback, by boat, in Helicopter and on ATV. While all are persuing animals, I don't consider them all hunting. But that's me.

An old debate for me.

I equate it to the sense of accomplishment you get after putting much effort into something and then being successful.

I have stopped my truck, got out and shot a deer on the cutline, had him gutted and back home all within about an hour and a half.
When I tell the story, it usually goes, "I was on my hunting but saw a nice deer on a cutline so I took it" In my eyes I wasn't hunting.
 
MiG25 said:
many people make the point that they do what is LEGAL, but why are some things legal and others not? why is it illegal to pitlamp? hunting during the day adds a degree of difficulty. and if it was legal to use lights would it be OK? what about set guns? poison? i poison mice, why not use poison on a grizzly or cougar, or a deer for that matter? what about snaring game animals?

i don't shoot animals spotted from the vehicle, others do, that is their choice. (but i will make fun of people that are all camo'ed out and tell me that they put on hundreds of km's of driving and didn't see anything). i don't shoot a doe with fawns, others do, fine. i don't shoot the first 4 point muley i see, many people do, fine. i *enjoy* hunting, if it was all about getting meat in the freezer it would be a pretty short season. ever taken a day off work to go hunting? if so you might as well have gone to work and bought a side or quarter of beef with the money you made.

so having a personal code of conduct is idiotic?
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Where did I say having a personal code of conduct is idiotic? I guess I can see where you thought that was what I was getting at - but far from it. I too, do not shoot does with fawns, I've never shot predators (other than bears, but I ate those), etc. I recognize that I spend as much money hunting as I would buying meat, but I chose hunting as how I feed myself and my family. That's doing what suits me within the constraints of the law, and that's 100% fine. I do that, you do that, everybody does that (in fact, I would go so far as to say, it's impossible for a person to avoid doing just that).

However, every time I hear the words "fair chase", it's almost universally followed by some holier than thou diatribe about what _real_ fair chase is supposed to be, or how a _real_ hunter does things, and how guys who do X, Y, or Z (all very legal methods of hunting), they don't deserve to be in the same bush with the _real_ hunters who properly support 'fair chase', and blah, blah, blah, blah. I think all of that kind of thing is pretty silly. So to me, the term "fair chase" is fairly synonymous with "holier than thou claptrap". The original poster asked how I define it, so there it is. :)
 
senior said:
Ok what's the definition of hunting :D
Is it being in the bush for the pleasure of killing something!
Is it "looking for" an animal to kill for meat or profit(such as fur bearing) ?

I hear what your saying but guys that won't hunt over bait will hunt over a cut corn field :confused:
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There is also a whole range of hunting that I am not real familiar with nor practice. One being over bait, the other being in cut fields etc.
I think a lot of it has to do with how you were raised, where you hunt, the hunting options that exist in your geographical area, etc etc.

I oce saw a guy shoot a moose, cu off the mooses genitals and run around with it like the kids in the Lord of the flies and swear on the moose and act Roman god like. It was a hard hunt, and a long day, but after that I looked at him very differently and not as a hunter.

You can see how personal oppinion gets in my way ..

I'm better to stay quiet:)
 
fair chase is what you do

slob hunting is what your neighbor/brother-in-law does

dude hunting is what guys with more money and toys than you do does
 
qd-ziggy said:
How do you define "FAIR CHASE"?
I define fair chase as
(1) pursuit of a game animal that has't been" Baited or fed to make it want to be there"Ie;grain,hay ,food plot,comercial baits and mineral baits.
(2)NOT hunting from a water source to me is not fair chase.You get thirsty you want a drink. They have to go there .I'm talking dug outs,water troughs.being the only source of water for miles. not lake or river.
(3)hunting with in a fenced area is NOT fair chase no matter how many acres the fence surrounds .A 5 acre fenced area is still a pen just like a 10000 acres with a fence is still a pen ...
(4)shooting an semi domesticated "farmed "animal Not fair chase!
(5)Chasing with a truck /atv "NOT" fair chase
(6)Driving with huge amounts of people and maybe dogs to chase past large groups of shooters .Not fair chase!


Lets hear your opinions of fair chase
I've gotten sick of watching so called hunt shows that are "fair chase".
How could you possibly miss a deer eating broad side at 50 yards ?when it has been fed there for how long???or has to come for water?
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Thanks for showing us your ##### ---------






I mean your ethics. I have no desire to see either one of those attributes you hold so dear.
 
Unless you run it down and choke it to death,there is no such thing,high fence no fence,caged or tied up,fair chase would be if the animals had guns.
I would be the first out of the woods.
Killing is killing,hunting is killing.
 
By their definition, hunting regulations exist to ensure what your provincial ministry considers "fair chase", therefore if you're hunting in a legal manner it is fair chase.

Personally I like the challenge of hunting in the bush on foot, others prefer the challenge of a clean 400yd shot on the prairies. Others put in a lot of planning and effort to attract their prey be it with calls or stands, whatever. If it's within the law and you enjoy what you do, it's fair chase.
 
CROWCA said:
Unless you run it down and choke it to death,there is no such thing,high fence no fence,caged or tied up,fair chase would be if the animals had guns.
I would be the first out of the woods.
Killing is killing,hunting is killing.
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man is the most ill-equipped animal on the planet- he is neither fleet of foot , horned, or hath claw and fang- the weapons merely put him on a EQUAL footing- better question-HOW MANY HUNTERS COME HOME SKUNKED?- it's not like we're using infared and spotters- and there's laws against being AIRBORNE
 
Fair chase is out the window when youre armed and dangerous.:D

Fair chase is a mythical ideology, when being "watched over" in a hunt in progress.;)

When you're hunting, fair chase is killing you're quarry legally.:)
 
t-star said:
i don't like to chase at all- makes the meat kind of "gamey" due to all the adrenaline and other jusices flowing at the time- as to fair, you have to remember that ALL ANIMALS SAVE MAN have all sorts of advantages over us, and we NEED tools to eat- that's how the old bulls do it- they have used their "tools" that nature provided to their best advantage and gained experience over the years to reach that ripe old age- if you look at us from a biological point of view, we're the most poorly equipped animal on the planet- it's our BIG BRAINS that have given us the advantage- so any method. as long as its legal , is "fair chase"
as to the "flushing method" i've seen wolves do exactly the same thing -
as to the fenced thing, if you go that route, you're going to give up about half the country- some farms go on for miles, and a section is 640 acres fenced- there's probably going to be some habitat in there, and most ungulates( mostly deer) have very little trouble with your average ranch or farm fence THEY DO JUMP, AND VERY WELL- most can clear about 8 feet
fences are meant for cattle
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AGREED....:shotgun:
 
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