Republic of Alberta
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- ,location, location
User is the biggest variable.
http://www.jspublications.net/records/UTHillHammered394.wmv
http://www.jspublications.net/records/UTHillHammered394.wmv
Fastest action rifle...
- Thread starter Max-4
- Start date
Yup. My buddy was set up about 100 ft to my right, hiding in a bee hut. I had a nice 5x7 come across from the left. I hit him square in the boiler with a 308. He started running, and I thought I missed him. I hammered him 3 more times before he finally stumbled and piled up.
I thought I was missing, but my buddy came up and asked why for I was putting so many holes in him. He could see blood and hair fly out the far side with every shot. When we skinned him out, he had four entry wounds in a 12" circle. His lungs and heart were liquified.
I have not bothered to read all 7 pages of this thread.
A few years ago I saw some wolves chasing deer in a cutblock. I did some fawn distress calls and two wolves came running at me. I shot the farther one (100 yqrds or so) and then turned to the closer one (40 steps) and dumped her. The first one was up and running for the forest so I got back on him and emptied my rifle as he bounded through thin brush and between planted evergreens. Till I dropped him for good.
This was kind of an unusual situation but I was using my Savafe 99 in .300 sav. and fully loaded it holds 6 shots.
There is a chance that I could have got them both with one of my more accurate bolt actions. (more accurate at the range anyway) But I was happy to have the lever gun that day.
Robin in Rocky
1 shot maybe one wolf
2 shots maybe 2 wolves
3 shots ?
4 shots ?
5 shots ?
6 shots 2 wolves in this case (the old Indian hearing me shooting must have wondered if the cavelry was on the way)
A few years ago I saw some wolves chasing deer in a cutblock. I did some fawn distress calls and two wolves came running at me. I shot the farther one (100 yqrds or so) and then turned to the closer one (40 steps) and dumped her. The first one was up and running for the forest so I got back on him and emptied my rifle as he bounded through thin brush and between planted evergreens. Till I dropped him for good.
This was kind of an unusual situation but I was using my Savafe 99 in .300 sav. and fully loaded it holds 6 shots.
There is a chance that I could have got them both with one of my more accurate bolt actions. (more accurate at the range anyway) But I was happy to have the lever gun that day.
Robin in Rocky
1 shot maybe one wolf
2 shots maybe 2 wolves
3 shots ?
4 shots ?
5 shots ?
6 shots 2 wolves in this case (the old Indian hearing me shooting must have wondered if the cavelry was on the way)
Brutus
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Duffy, situations like yours, only further the appreciation of lever guns.
Good combination of range & speedier follow up shots.
Like your Savage, and many Winchesters and Marlins too.
I know this sounds goofy, but I noticed over the years, if one wanted to speed up slightly there reloading time on a Winchester....one could overcome action resistance after the first shot is downrange, by first cocking the hammer back just before dropping the lever.
Hence less opening resistance, and one can reload a little faster.
I often wonder if cowboy action shooters do this with the Model 94 in whatever calibre?
But the 30-30s, I beleive are used in the long range event maybe?
Speedy reloading is not so important as long range hits....
Good combination of range & speedier follow up shots.
Like your Savage, and many Winchesters and Marlins too.
I know this sounds goofy, but I noticed over the years, if one wanted to speed up slightly there reloading time on a Winchester....one could overcome action resistance after the first shot is downrange, by first cocking the hammer back just before dropping the lever.
Hence less opening resistance, and one can reload a little faster.
I often wonder if cowboy action shooters do this with the Model 94 in whatever calibre?
But the 30-30s, I beleive are used in the long range event maybe?
Speedy reloading is not so important as long range hits....
I hate to repost but here is a couple of links of me unslinging/actioning the bolt/lever and shooting at a target 25 yards away.
If you look it almost looks like I am actioning the bolt faster than the lever and I am fairly proficient with both actions...
http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=G-AVr7gNmrU&feature=related
http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8F51OIw8A0
In other words it is the shooter not the action type that amounts to fast shooting.
If you look it almost looks like I am actioning the bolt faster than the lever and I am fairly proficient with both actions...
http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=G-AVr7gNmrU&feature=related
http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8F51OIw8A0
In other words it is the shooter not the action type that amounts to fast shooting.
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I viewed your links. But I was disapointed. I thought you were implying that you could fire, action, fire, action,fire action etc. a bolt as fast as a lever.
But that was not the case. I carry my rifle with the mag. loaded and one in the chamber most of the time. So actioning the rifle to get the first shot is not required. It is the speed to get off an aimed second and third shot that we are talking about in this thread I think.
I would say that putting a bullet into a charging bear must kill it instantly in order to say it is more effective than pepper spray. With pepper sprat you can "miss" to a certian extent and still cause the charge to stop.
Have a good one!
What part of the first video doesn't show me actioning and firing repeated shots and if you can't see me actioning the bolt fast in the second vid clip then what were you looking for?
For safety I did not load a round in the chamber and when I am in remote areas when conditions warrant I also carry with a round loaded which obviously would speed up my first shot time.
Have you ever been near a big bear from your comments I would say that you never have so you probably do not have any idea what the target would act like?
Tell me if you walked into a bear like this would you carry a rifle or would you pack pepper spray?
Me I'd shoot it with the hardest hitting rifle/cartridge combo and leave that little can of spray on the store shelf were it belongs but then again I can actually shot a rifle fast and accurately.
For safety I did not load a round in the chamber and when I am in remote areas when conditions warrant I also carry with a round loaded which obviously would speed up my first shot time.
Have you ever been near a big bear from your comments I would say that you never have so you probably do not have any idea what the target would act like?
Tell me if you walked into a bear like this would you carry a rifle or would you pack pepper spray?
Me I'd shoot it with the hardest hitting rifle/cartridge combo and leave that little can of spray on the store shelf were it belongs but then again I can actually shot a rifle fast and accurately.
Seems you are taking a great deal for granted with the above comment. Move the range out there a ways and a 44-40 will need a lot of help. As for pure speed my bet is on the semi auto then the pump. As I said before on this thread many shooters have pump shotguns so operation of the action is very familiar and extremely fast. The necessary motions can be used to cancel the recoil.There is no need to remove the finger from the trigger guard ,just as you claim an advantage for a Win 88, Scopes of appropriate power and field of view do save time when the game is at more than spitting distance, hold over is not an issue out to 250 plus yards.
Can those be said of a 44-40?
Camp Cook
"I thought you were implying that you could fire, action, fire, action,fire action etc. a bolt as fast as a lever."
Is what I said. Notice it refers to multiple action and shots not just one shot. And as I said I think this post is about :
"Besides Semi-Auto, what is the best action to have for quick follow up shots on big game?? Lever, Bolt, Pump?? Looking for a deer/moose gun that is dependable and quick enough to hit deer on the run."
So taking a bolt action with one bullet in the mag and actioning it to fire one well aimed shot is impressive but not answering the question about "quick follow up shots".
And the topic is also about "hitting a deer on the run". Not facing down a bear.
I still feel that no matter what size of big rifle you have or how fast you can get off a shot, you have to kill the bear outright very fast. Otherwise the little can of pepper spray may be a better option to stop a charge.
"Have you ever been near a big bear from your comments I would say that you never have so you probably do not have any idea what the target would act like?"
Not sure where you get this from but I guess it is the internet and you can assume anything you want.
I have got off multiple shots with a bolt action a lot faster than I thought I was capable of (last year I fired two shots at a buck that was running accross a pipeline. When my son came out of the bush he looked puzzled and asked "was someone else here? you could not have fired both of those shots from your bolt gun.") But I still think I can get aimed, consistant repeat shots off faster with my lever action Savage 99.
I now have a .284 win. in a Win. M 100 semi-auto. I will have to see if I can stay on target with it to get really fast aimed shots off.
Robin in Rocky
"I thought you were implying that you could fire, action, fire, action,fire action etc. a bolt as fast as a lever."
Is what I said. Notice it refers to multiple action and shots not just one shot. And as I said I think this post is about :
"Besides Semi-Auto, what is the best action to have for quick follow up shots on big game?? Lever, Bolt, Pump?? Looking for a deer/moose gun that is dependable and quick enough to hit deer on the run."
So taking a bolt action with one bullet in the mag and actioning it to fire one well aimed shot is impressive but not answering the question about "quick follow up shots".
And the topic is also about "hitting a deer on the run". Not facing down a bear.
I still feel that no matter what size of big rifle you have or how fast you can get off a shot, you have to kill the bear outright very fast. Otherwise the little can of pepper spray may be a better option to stop a charge.
"Have you ever been near a big bear from your comments I would say that you never have so you probably do not have any idea what the target would act like?"
Not sure where you get this from but I guess it is the internet and you can assume anything you want.
I have got off multiple shots with a bolt action a lot faster than I thought I was capable of (last year I fired two shots at a buck that was running accross a pipeline. When my son came out of the bush he looked puzzled and asked "was someone else here? you could not have fired both of those shots from your bolt gun.") But I still think I can get aimed, consistant repeat shots off faster with my lever action Savage 99.
I now have a .284 win. in a Win. M 100 semi-auto. I will have to see if I can stay on target with it to get really fast aimed shots off.
Robin in Rocky
We had just gotten through working cattle through the old silver King cattle killer shute,and we had a Aussie Blue healer chasing them out of the of the oil field pipe with weilded 4X4 steel fencing!
When I saw a yote eating some guts thrown on the burn barrel(from Dougs previous coon hunt) I said look and we both went to the truck and grabed our guns!
I had an enfield jerked it out and slamed in the ten round mag,he grabed his Winchester and started loading rounds!
I aimed at the yote fired 30 yards ,he kept running off I then jacked one,dust right on his ass,then two,he is side tracking and pulled off five rounds before he was 600 yards down the draw!
I missed him the first time because the 303 hit the steel fencing and curled it back,I missed him just barely cause he was on the run the other four rounds!
By the time my friend doug had loaded his rifle I had put five good rounds down target!
He said why do I even like this lever action?
The next week I took out a preg yote at 100 yards secound shot!
I think the Enfield is pretty smooth as far as actions go,My VZ-24 in 30-06 is pretty smooth also!
Bo
weird:
When I saw a yote eating some guts thrown on the burn barrel(from Dougs previous coon hunt) I said look and we both went to the truck and grabed our guns!
I had an enfield jerked it out and slamed in the ten round mag,he grabed his Winchester and started loading rounds!
I aimed at the yote fired 30 yards ,he kept running off I then jacked one,dust right on his ass,then two,he is side tracking and pulled off five rounds before he was 600 yards down the draw!
I missed him the first time because the 303 hit the steel fencing and curled it back,I missed him just barely cause he was on the run the other four rounds!
By the time my friend doug had loaded his rifle I had put five good rounds down target!
He said why do I even like this lever action?
The next week I took out a preg yote at 100 yards secound shot!
I think the Enfield is pretty smooth as far as actions go,My VZ-24 in 30-06 is pretty smooth also!
Bo
weird:A different perspective
I shot a moose through the chest broadside at about 70 yards, with a 6.5x55 ackley, with 156 gr rn bullets, at about 2700 fps muzzle velocity, and to my suprise he turned and came straight for me, the nice thing about a second shot is how easy it is to sight as the target is expanding as it approaches. I shot him again about half way to me, which seemed to me to take a long time, but to my buddies who were within earshot, they said the shots were very close together. The second shot hit him in the brisket and deflected into a shoulder. He stopped running and fell, as he should have on the first shot. I prefer a 1 shot kill also, and my hat is off to everyone who plans to have nothing else. However sometimes a shot animal does not do as we plan. This M96 Mauser does not have a scope, which to my way of thinking just gets in the way when one is trying to be quick, which is perhaps why so many are so quick with a smle.
I also have a Ross, which is very quick, it is a 7 rem mag and feeds like a machine gun. But then you have the recoil considerations, and I would not assure that I would be faster with the Ross than with the Mauser. I can say though that a charging bull moose makes you as fast as you can be.
Allen
I shot a moose through the chest broadside at about 70 yards, with a 6.5x55 ackley, with 156 gr rn bullets, at about 2700 fps muzzle velocity, and to my suprise he turned and came straight for me, the nice thing about a second shot is how easy it is to sight as the target is expanding as it approaches. I shot him again about half way to me, which seemed to me to take a long time, but to my buddies who were within earshot, they said the shots were very close together. The second shot hit him in the brisket and deflected into a shoulder. He stopped running and fell, as he should have on the first shot. I prefer a 1 shot kill also, and my hat is off to everyone who plans to have nothing else. However sometimes a shot animal does not do as we plan. This M96 Mauser does not have a scope, which to my way of thinking just gets in the way when one is trying to be quick, which is perhaps why so many are so quick with a smle.
I also have a Ross, which is very quick, it is a 7 rem mag and feeds like a machine gun. But then you have the recoil considerations, and I would not assure that I would be faster with the Ross than with the Mauser. I can say though that a charging bull moose makes you as fast as you can be.
Allen
We had just gotten through working cattle through the old silver King cattle killer shute,and we had a Aussie Blue healer chasing them out of the of the oil field pipe with weilded 4X4 steel fencing!
When I saw a yote eating some guts thrown on the burn barrel(from Dougs previous coon hunt) I said look and we both went to the truck and grabed our guns!
I had an enfield jerked it out and slamed in the ten round mag,he grabed his Winchester and started loading rounds!
I aimed at the yote fired 30 yards ,he kept running off I then jacked one,dust right on his ass,then two,he is side tracking and pulled off five rounds before he was 600 yards down the draw!
I missed him the first time because the 303 hit the steel fencing and curled it back,I missed him just barely cause he was on the run the other four rounds!
By the time my friend doug had loaded his rifle I had put five good rounds down target!
He said why do I even like this lever action?
The next week I took out a preg yote at 100 yards secound shot!
I think the Enfield is pretty smooth as far as actions go,My VZ-24 in 30-06 is pretty smooth also!
Bo
Well all that is pretty kool but if you were hunting as the original poster said, I'm sure you'd be carrying a loaded gun already!
Although I don't own a pump rifle, I believe it would be faster because your reloading with the extended arm instead of the one supporting the rifle at your shoulder? A fast reload allows more time for an aimed second shot which most of us, not being as skilled as those that never require a 2nd shot
could use on occasion 
- Location
- The Conservative part of Ontario
What has range got to do with action speed?
The 44-40 was just a low recoil example I picked to support my argument on recoil affecting speed on target.
My brother can operate his Winchester Defender at blistering speed, it sounds like one continuous shot when he does it, however, the first one is the only one with any hope of being on target.
If you took a pump gun in 44-40, they used to exist, and then a lever gun, in the same cartridge, yes, the pump would IMO win.
However, if the pump gun is in 30-06, and the lever in 44-40, it ain't gonna happen, if the two rifles must stay on the paper.
- Location
- The Conservative part of Ontario
As to a single round in an empty rifle, a top loading '94 Winchester in 30-30 is very, very hard to beat for speed. Just drop it in and close, no tilting to keep it in, or find the loading port, no jambing, works every time.
