legi0n, thanks for those pics. That and Homer's chrono data shows that the 'New stuff' isn't the same quality as the 'Old'. The Old was 'hotter' per the Garmin and that correspond with my experience with it. Back 4-5 years ago it was 'good enuf' in my Marlin 60 and Sav-64. Prob really good as a hunting round under 25-30 yds. since it's HP, tho nothing much around here in E. NB to hunt.