First Gun for IPSC

flip1

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I am sure this has been discussed before, but I couldn't find anything recently.

I have shot handguns for years, and love CAS shooting, so all of my larger calibre handguns are wheelguns - mostly SA's. This weekend they are holding a BB course locally, so maybe it's time for me to get involved with IPSC.

I have a Colt King Cobra which has been tuned, and I guess it would be okay, but I am thinking of buying a semi for IPSC use. I used to own a 9mm CZ 75, and I have past experience with the Brownings in the military. However, things have evolved a lot since then.

What would be the best gun to start with based on initial price, reliability, simplicity, and upgradeable??

Thanks for your input.

JB
Thunder Bay
 
hm....i would go to the next match and see and feel which pistol fits you best...

also, decide what division you wanna shoot...
 
i am a big fan of 1911's for IPSC. I use to promote buying Norincia 45. the price is right and you will spend almost as much on mags and gear as the gun. however i have recently been looking at the Tanfoglio's 1911 45's at Freedom Venture. i haven't seen one in person yet but they do look like a good investment.
 
The first thing you should do is decide which division you want to shoot. If you decide on the Production division than there are many choices. The CZ's in 9mm would be a good choice. I planned on using a CZ, but I found a good deal on a used H&K USP Custom Sport and that is what I will be using in Production.
 
Glock 17.

Until you've been shoting for some time, it's hard to tell what does and doesn't fit your hand. It's even harder to tell whether bucket seats really matter all that much, as long as you can comfortably reach the pedals.
 
Musky Hunter said:
.....decide what division you wanna shoot...

Dragonblade said:
The first thing you should do is decide which division you want to shoot.

I would suggest that the advice above should be reversed. First decide which gun you like/can afford/etc., then shoot it in the Division that the gun belongs in....
 
Go to a match/club and introduce yourself. Find out which subset of shooters you like the most and are willing to socialise with. Then buy a gun in their division.
Here in Australia: If you are Macedonian, Croat, Italian or Greek: Open Division
A tall skinny martial artist: Open Division.
Race bikes? Open Division.
If you think patching causes cancer, and not helping shows you are cool and in control: Open Division god squad.

Drink too much beer, get on with the referees, probably a bit over weight? Production Division.

Lean, V8 driving, play Rugby as your other game? Standard.

ETC, ETC, ETC.

You'll find a sub group at any IPSC match to suit most peoples social tastes. As you could spend 24 hours on the range and seven to 8 minutes actually shooting at a big comp, it's best to be squadded with people of a like mindset so you have something to talk about.
 
Radagast said:
If you think patching causes cancer, and not helping shows you are cool and in control: Open Division god squad.

Drink too much beer, get on with the referees, probably a bit over weight? Production Division.

From the limited experience that I have in the sport I have seen this trend.

Yes I am shooting PD.

D_
 
Radagast said:
Go to a match/club and introduce yourself. Find out which subset of shooters you like the most and are willing to socialise with. Then buy a gun in their division.
Here in Australia: If you are Macedonian, Croat, Italian or Greek: Open Division
A tall skinny martial artist: Open Division.
Race bikes? Open Division.
If you think patching causes cancer, and not helping shows you are cool and in control: Open Division god squad.

Drink too much beer, get on with the referees, probably a bit over weight? Production Division.

Lean, V8 driving, play Rugby as your other game? Standard.

ETC, ETC, ETC.

You'll find a sub group at any IPSC match to suit most peoples social tastes. As you could spend 24 hours on the range and seven to 8 minutes actually shooting at a big comp, it's best to be squadded with people of a like mindset so you have something to talk about.

It might be that way in Australia....but were I shoot we put 5+ Level 2 match a year at our club and that is with 3 IPSC Shooters of which one is my wife, and yes, myself and my wife are OPEN shooters, the third guy is actually the master around here.....and Stat for the zone and MD and RM......

If you ever want to learn to shoot buy yourself a Open gun.....

If all you can do is insult people, why don't you stay home!

For the subject at hand.....buy what you can efford, then fit to what ever division it fit in like Dragoon said....
 
Radagast said:
Go to a match/club and introduce yourself. Find out which subset of shooters you like the most and are willing to socialise with. Then buy a gun in their division.
Here in Australia: If you are Macedonian, Croat, Italian or Greek: Open Division
A tall skinny martial artist: Open Division.
Race bikes? Open Division.
If you think patching causes cancer, and not helping shows you are cool and in control: Open Division god squad.

Drink too much beer, get on with the referees, probably a bit over weight? Production Division.

Lean, V8 driving, play Rugby as your other game? Standard.

ETC, ETC, ETC.

You'll find a sub group at any IPSC match to suit most peoples social tastes. As you could spend 24 hours on the range and seven to 8 minutes actually shooting at a big comp, it's best to be squadded with people of a like mindset so you have something to talk about.

hmmm...I thought it was kinda funny. We could probably expand on some of the categories.

As we've all heard numerous times IPSC stands for Irrational People Squabbling Constantly.
 
Radagast said:
Go to a match/club and introduce yourself. Find out which subset of shooters you like the most and are willing to socialise

Drink too much beer, get on with the referees, probably a bit over weight? Production Division.

ETC, ETC, ETC.

You'll find a sub group at any IPSC match to suit most peoples social tastes.

Am I really that fat:confused:
I don't know any production shooters who are a little round in the middle:p
I believe this man has hurt my feelings, and I quit IPSC--forever!!! (not really, just being dramatic:D )
I think I will stick to light beer.;)
 
Radagast said:
Go to a match/club and introduce yourself. Find out which subset of shooters you like the most and are willing to socialise with. Then buy a gun in their division.
Here in Australia: If you are Macedonian, Croat, Italian or Greek: Open Division
A tall skinny martial artist: Open Division.
Race bikes? Open Division.

ETC, ETC, ETC.

You'll find a sub group at any IPSC match to suit most peoples social tastes. As you could spend 24 hours on the range and seven to 8 minutes actually shooting at a big comp, it's best to be squadded with people of a like mindset so you have something to talk about.

Someone better tell J. Storey he is has to learn karate! and get a motorcycle,..and........he is not that tall...:p
 
Flip1, as you can see, there are several differing opinions on what gun to start with. I think ergonomics of the firearm is key. If you are not comfortable with the gun, then movement and everything required in IPSC will not work.

Other factors to consider are do you enjoy working on the firearm, exchanging parts, tuning, etc. If not, then Glocks, Springfield XD's and the like are probably better suited.

Do you have money to burn and want what is the latest and greatest. Then you may want to look into SVI/STI's.

How competitive are you? If you tend to get competitive then buying a basic gun that cannot be upgraded may not work.

Also, if you just want to have fun, and the heck with everything else, bring the wheelgun out and use that to get started since that will be your cheapest option. See what division appeals later on.

There really is no "right gun" for IPSC, only the right gun for you.

Suggested firearms to try out;

1 - Para 16-40 (good upgrade options, cheaper 1911 framed without getting into clones)
2 - CZ's (a staple and all around good firearm and relatively inexpensive)
3 - Glock 17/22 or Springfield XD (ease of use)
4 - Beretta 92/96
5 - SVI/STI (top end, but just see how the Cadillac feels)
6 - Open gun (big fun factor, more work to tune and maintain, plus you should be into reloading)
 
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I'd say you should be into reloading no matter what you choose as your gun... The number of rounds you go through shooting IPSC (match and practicing) will easily dwarf the cost of the gun otherwise.

My vote is choose the gun you like/can afford (don't be afraid to buy used) and shoot it in whatever division it puts you in. Most places the prize for first is the same as the prize for last.
 
Dansy, no insult was intended to anyone, it was an attempt at humorous generalisation to make my point. I'm an overweight PD A grader who likes an occasional drink and I'm an RO, so I fit in my own categorisation. One of my mates, Darko Mihaljevic is a race bike riding Macedonian with an Open gun. A great guy, but I don't think I've ever seen him patch at a match. He fits the stereotype. At one point we had two section co-ordinators who were into martials arts, one road an Aprilla. Both shoot Open.

The God Squad or Squad 1 (Master & Grandmaster, mainly Open) here do resist setting up, patching or picking up brass, but they seem to enjoy each others company both on and off the range.

Anyway the examples are moot, the point I was making is that there are different social subsets within shooting clubs, half the fun is the shooting ( & winning!) but the other half is the people. If I don't like the people I shoot with, I'm not likely to come back, and I'm pretty sure that holds true for most people.

To address your other points, I'm very impressed at the number of matchs you put on, the most I've ever set up were a few one day 120 round comps. On the other hand, I organised two range open days that introduced just over 2000 people to shooting and resulted in around 100 new IPSC shooters, I've ROed Level 1, 2 & 3 matchs for several years, had a large part in blocking the closure of the biggest range in my home state (600 acres in the middle of a city of 4 million), I was the state IPSC Secretary for a couple of years and I signed up two new clubs to IPSC, arranging their initial training and match set ups. I've represented IPSC at meetings with our state police and members of the state and federal governments. I'm a reasonably accurate shot, but being overweight and carrying injuries from old car crashes, I'm not that fast on the run and gun stages. I still enjoy the game though.

Having established my credentials, I'd like to apologise for the thread drift.

Back on track. Flip1, my personal prejudices are as follows:

Standard Division: STI Edge if you can afford the money, Bul M5 IPSC model if you can't. I know a lot of people like Para Ordnance, but I'm not inclined to buy another one. I've owned two Buls and I'm completely satisfied with them. Single stack guns are at a disadvantage here. The wide bodies are jsu a little faster to reload, and it can make a difference over the course of a match.

Open Division: I'm not qualified to have an opinion on these, I have noted that the STI guns in OZ seem to be a little more reliable than the SV, but this could be due to the quality of the respective gunsmiths.

Modifed Division: Huh? What's that?

Revolver: Use your Colt, if you decide to stick at it, then a S&W 625. short fat .45 ACP in a moon clip is easier to load than long .357s in a speedloader. There is also less perceived recoil with the heavy bullet 45 when loaded to major, compared to a lightweight .357.

Production: Home of the real guns, with trigger pulls that help you develop real muscles on your fingers!

Beretta 92FS fitted with a D model hammer spring to reduce the double action trigger pull by around four pounds. It's my favourite pistol.

Glock 17 with Heinie slant pro sights and a 3.5 pound connector. This is the gun I shoot the most and the only one I use in Open competions.

The CZ75 is an ideal first PD gun as well, but my experience has been that they are not as reliable as the glock and beretta. The Tanfoglio is a CZ clone and is quite popular here in OZ, I've been impressed by the quality over the last couple of years, they used to have a reputation for unreliability but that seems to be in the past.

One thing to keep in mind is that .40 cal versions of the above guns can be loaded with heavier, slower bullets for less perceived recoil than the 9mm. As Canada has a 10 round mag limit, you will not be handicapped as you would in the states by the reduced round count in a standard .40 mag. If you don't reload, ammuntion costs can be an issue with the .40.

Gun fit is a pretty individual thing. Borrow and shoot as many different guns as you can before making up your mind and forking over the dollars.
Welcome to the wide world of IPSC. Other forums where you can ask questions are the IPSC international forum http://ipsc.invisionzone.com/ and Brian Enos' Forum http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?act=idx
 
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Radagast said:
Go to a match/club and introduce yourself. Find out which subset of shooters you like the most and are willing to socialise with. Then buy a gun in their division.
Here in Australia: If you are Macedonian, Croat, Italian or Greek: Open Division
A tall skinny martial artist: Open Division.
Race bikes? Open Division.
If you think patching causes cancer, and not helping shows you are cool and in control: Open Division god squad.

Drink too much beer, get on with the referees, probably a bit over weight? Production Division.

Lean, V8 driving, play Rugby as your other game? Standard.

ETC, ETC, ETC.

You'll find a sub group at any IPSC match to suit most peoples social tastes. As you could spend 24 hours on the range and seven to 8 minutes actually shooting at a big comp, it's best to be squadded with people of a like mindset so you have something to talk about.


Too true...IPSC is IPSC the world over :)
 
Bartledan said:
Glock 17.

Until you've been shoting for some time, it's hard to tell what does and doesn't fit your hand. It's even harder to tell whether bucket seats really matter all that much, as long as you can comfortably reach the pedals.


+ 1 Bartledan the wise.
 
Is there a stock division or something to that effect? I really want to get into this but at the moment I don't have more than 1000 to drop on gear.
 
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