I disagree with Bartledan actually. It's very easy to see what gun feels good in your hand, and points naturally, IF someone is willing to show you how to hold the gun properly and all that. Don't just buy a guy you like the look of, or based on anyone elses opinion. Buy the gun that fits you. You can tell pretty quickly if it's for you or not.
First Gun for IPSC
- Thread starter flip1
- Start date
fallnerock2 said:
You're probably looking into getting into Production Division. Here is a list of allowable pistols for the Division. http://www.ipsc.org/proddiv.php Very few modifications allowed so 'out of the box' is fine.
Where are you in Alberta?
Slavex said:
You've got grandmasteritis. You've been too good, for too long.
You've forgotten what it's like to be new at this."Pointing naturally" and "holding the gun properly" are things it takes some serious shooting to develop an educated opinion on, even with instruction, pointers, etc. When one is getting started one thinks these concepts mean a certain thing, and only later does one discover they were not 100% right.
You're a top-notch shooter, and I bet a buck you can pick up any gun, and make it sing. I bet you could whip the everliving snot out of me with my own gun, without a practise shot. This tends to de-emphasize the importance of "fit" and "pointability", I think.
It's like buying a tennis racket or fishing rod: Until you've made a few thousand casts, you have no idea what you like or hate in a fishing rod. So your first fishing rod should be cheap and cheerful... but reliable.
I'm a big believer in the big four of pistols: Beretta Glock, HK and Sig. Of those, Glock is the cheapest. The only production gun I'd be inclined to shoot besides my glock would be an Elite 2. HK is distributed by the excerable R Nicholls, and Sig seems to think their poops come out gilded, the prices they charge.
So, my reply to the original poster remains: Get a glock. It's an easy, reliable, durable, inexpensive gun with excellent resale value, even well used.
A Beretta, Sig, Or HK is also an excellent choice.
Funny I don't think its grandmasteritis... I've only been shooting pistols for about 3 years and the one that fit/pointed best for me was a 1911 with an arched backstrap. I knew that within about 2 minutes of handling one.
Nothing else came close. It was two and a half years ago the first time I handled one and its still true now that I have a few 10s of thousands of rounds down range.
If it suits you, it suits you. If it doesn't then a good shooter can make do better than a inexperienced one.
You don't have to run 20 miles a day to know when a running shoe fits and when it doesn't, why should fitting a pistol be much different?
FWIW I think GLOCKs are a terrible first pistol choice... The reason is the trigger pull length makes it that much harder for a newbie to shoot well. I see it all the time at my range with newbies trying shoot their "recommended" glocks accurately and pulling all their shots low and left. Not that they can't learn to correct this, but its just one problem they can avoid by using a different gun. Once they're good with other guns then, they can get a Glock and work on the one additional skill required to shoot it well.
A decent target .22 should be everyone's first pistol IMO.
Nothing else came close. It was two and a half years ago the first time I handled one and its still true now that I have a few 10s of thousands of rounds down range.
If it suits you, it suits you. If it doesn't then a good shooter can make do better than a inexperienced one.
You don't have to run 20 miles a day to know when a running shoe fits and when it doesn't, why should fitting a pistol be much different?
FWIW I think GLOCKs are a terrible first pistol choice... The reason is the trigger pull length makes it that much harder for a newbie to shoot well. I see it all the time at my range with newbies trying shoot their "recommended" glocks accurately and pulling all their shots low and left. Not that they can't learn to correct this, but its just one problem they can avoid by using a different gun. Once they're good with other guns then, they can get a Glock and work on the one additional skill required to shoot it well.
A decent target .22 should be everyone's first pistol IMO.
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I agree with Slavex, some times it's not worth chewing thru th...
oops, i mean about the gun, ya buy that after handling it, it just feels right for your hand & feels right when you shoot it.
you did mention you've been shooting for a long time, but mostly wheel guns, so you know the general rules.
all the rest you can make fit to whatever division you best fit for with the gun of your choice.
to answer one of your questions, the 1911 guns are the most versatile to future modifications & w/ many option to boot for reasonable prices.
if 1911 does suit you fine , then a plain jane version to start (like mine)
the Colt 1991A1, than build from that. this one is a single stack, you may want to look for a double stack if the right gun fits you well.
any gun you choose will be fine, I recommend it be of reputable quality.
oh yah, I always finish with, if you're a real man, it'll be a .45
oops, i mean about the gun, ya buy that after handling it, it just feels right for your hand & feels right when you shoot it.
you did mention you've been shooting for a long time, but mostly wheel guns, so you know the general rules.
all the rest you can make fit to whatever division you best fit for with the gun of your choice.
to answer one of your questions, the 1911 guns are the most versatile to future modifications & w/ many option to boot for reasonable prices.
if 1911 does suit you fine , then a plain jane version to start (like mine)
the Colt 1991A1, than build from that. this one is a single stack, you may want to look for a double stack if the right gun fits you well.
any gun you choose will be fine, I recommend it be of reputable quality.
oh yah, I always finish with, if you're a real man, it'll be a .45
Use whatever gun feels good.. For some a 1911 works (start with something cheap like a Norinco and not an STI or SVI) or a glock (22,17 or 19) whatever turns your crank.. CZ's are also quite popular...
As for caliber 9mm, 40, 45 and since their is a wheel gun category 38 special...
Have fun with it...
As for caliber 9mm, 40, 45 and since their is a wheel gun category 38 special...
Have fun with it...
Hey guys, thanks for all of your input. I have a question though ...
Any thoughts on the Browning HP for IPSC???
That was my sidearm in the military (umpteen years ago) so I have some basic knowledge of it. Furthermore, I know of 2 for sale in the $300-350 range as part of an estate. Knew the deceased owner, and they are in very good conditon, but don't know the exact age.
Any feedback?
Any thoughts on the Browning HP for IPSC???
That was my sidearm in the military (umpteen years ago) so I have some basic knowledge of it. Furthermore, I know of 2 for sale in the $300-350 range as part of an estate. Knew the deceased owner, and they are in very good conditon, but don't know the exact age.
Any feedback?
A Browning HP is OK but it has it's disadvantages. You'd be in Standard Division competing against guns in the $3000 to $4000 range. Furthermore, if it's a 9mm you'd be shooting 'Minor'. That being said, I'm a firm believer in 'shoot what ya got'.
flip1, I'm on the Board of Directors of IPSC Alberta and a Black Badge instructor. If you're serious about getting into IPSC, PM me your e-mail address and I can help you get into the sport.
Check out www.ipscalberta.com
flip1, I'm on the Board of Directors of IPSC Alberta and a Black Badge instructor. If you're serious about getting into IPSC, PM me your e-mail address and I can help you get into the sport.
Check out www.ipscalberta.com
Grandmasteritis? that's a good one BD! But I have to disagree again (sorry). When I bought my first gun I went into the shop and tried them all out, eyes closed, pick it up, point at back wall (target on wall) and open eyes. the only guns that pointed naturally for me (and I didn't know jack ####) were the Beretta and the Sig. I liked the feel of the Beretta better, and it had a much nicer trigger as well. So I bought the Beretta. If you'd seen my pistol skills and knowledge back then you'd crucify me now. Trust me I was more than green.
Flip1, it's hard to win with a Browning. Fun guns to shoot, but they are not the 'winningest gun'. Single action puts them into standard or open divisions, where you will compete against high end double stack 1911s. The 1911s will be in .40 or .45 so you will be handicaped due to the 'major' & 'minor' powerfactor scoring difference. Basically the 9mm will score less unless you can hit the centre of the target every time. In addition, 'go faster' parts, such as extended safetys, mag funnels, tungsten guide rods, etc, are either not available or hard to come by. If it's cheap and you like it, go ahead and buy it, just be aware that you'll probably buy another gun as you get caught in the monetary black hole that is IPSC.
I'll agree with Slavex, gun point is a natural act. If you can pick the gun up, eyes closed, point it at the target and open your eyes to find the sights aligned, that's the one for you. Berettas, Bul M5s and S&W K frames all do it for me. The Glock dosn't, and it took me 10s of thousands of rounds to become proficient with it as a result. The others are all pretty much point and shoot.
Ken
I'll agree with Slavex, gun point is a natural act. If you can pick the gun up, eyes closed, point it at the target and open your eyes to find the sights aligned, that's the one for you. Berettas, Bul M5s and S&W K frames all do it for me. The Glock dosn't, and it took me 10s of thousands of rounds to become proficient with it as a result. The others are all pretty much point and shoot.
Ken
Nobody agrees with me.... This thread is making me very sad... Seriously, there are tears in my big, beautiful brown eyes.
Wait... My eyes are kind of mushy gray, and remarkably un-beautiful. Sort of dog ugly...
Original poster: Buy a Beretta, Glock, or Sig. 1911s are nice, but you have about a 30% chance of getting a gunsmith's dream... that is, buying his wife a fur coat, trying to run down all the problems. Who needs the hassle. Beretta, Glock, or Sig, you're in business, right out of the box. Fun to plink with, adequate for all the gun games. What's not to love?
Oh, and on the issue of pointability: If there were more toy Glocks out there, and more toy guns with glockish grip geometry, I bet people would find real glocks more pointable, when it comes to the pepsi challenge
Glocks are legendary for reliability and durability. Of course, that's just a bull#### legend, but they are quite reliable, and quite durable.
Whatever you buy, get it from a retailer who will support what they sell. Wolverine Supply comes to mind. TSE is prob'ly (and reputedly) great, and I've had good experiences with Wild West.
Slavex said:
<pick on Slavex mode= on>
I try not to shoot with my eyes closed
(pick on Slavex mode = off/>
...that's also a good method to see if your stance is correct...
Back to the topic
In my humble opinion...you can learn to point just about anything...as long as you can get a comfortable grip on it ...for example...I can't shoot a USP...not because of the trigger...or the mag release...or the grip angle...I just find the grip too short and it feels like it's digging in to my hand.
I much prefer the Glock over the USP...and everyone told me that becuase I was shooting an SVI...I would hate the glock becuase of the grip angle...
I think the only reasonable answer is...buy one of everything
(and two Glocks)
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it's Ok Bartledan we'll do a big group hug later on (and it won't be me grabbing your ass, I'd watch Tritium for that move).
Seriously to the original poster, get out there and beg, borrow, or steal (well yeah don't steal) other peoples guns and try them out. We are all like drug pushers here and usually the first time is free. It's just once you're hooked that we want money for ammo and such.
Seriously to the original poster, get out there and beg, borrow, or steal (well yeah don't steal) other peoples guns and try them out. We are all like drug pushers here and usually the first time is free. It's just once you're hooked that we want money for ammo and such.
