First long range rifle, could use a few pointers

hunter-4-life

hunter-4-life

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Hey fellas, I finally talked myself into buying a long range rig. Problem is i'm torn between a few options I have. Keep in mind this is my 1st long range rifle. My range will be 0-1000 yards. I want to get good at shooting long range before I even consider hunting at long range, so for now it will be strictly steel, but i want to use same rifle to hunt at 600+ yards eventually. Heres my options:

1)HS Precision HTR in 300 win mag. Used, but in great shape. Round count is 140. Dont know much about these rifles, but I do know the FBI use them as their snipers. Not sold on the 300 win to hunt at those ranges, but I know it can and has been done.
2) Buy a savage 111 long range hunter in 338 lapua. Again, I know any savage I have shot has been a tack driver under 400 yards. But I dont know how well made this rifle is to take the punch of the lapua.
3)Remington 700 XCR tac in 338 lapua. I do you know cant beat a 700 action for accuracy, but how bout the rest of the gun? Very little reviews out there about it. Is it worth the $2300?
4) Remington 700 Sendaro in 300 RUM. Ive heard nothing but good things about the sendaro, but the 300 RUM is a dying breed out here, hard to find brass for the caliber, and factory ammo is almost non-existent.

So if you were a new long range shooter,what option would you go with? Recoil doesnt bother me to much. Besides all the rifles above will have a brake put on, if there isnt already. Yes I do handload, so that helps as well. Chances are a Nightforce NXS scope will be sitting on top if that counts for something. Thanks in advanced!
 
Is component costs a consideration for you? The 338 Lapua will be spendy monster to feed.

You could always start with the 300 Win Mag and later down the road when you're ready, have the rifle re-barreled/re-chambered to something you feel is more suitable to your long range hunting needs. You'd have many options with that magnum bolt face especially if you consider a wildcat chambering. I personally feel the 300 WM is suitable for your needs however.
 
Out of the ones mentioned the HS is by far the best option, they are basically a custom made rifle. They shoot very good as is with no modification. The rest would all need up grades of some sort or another. And the 300 win is plenty for a 1000 yards, you'll still have lots of horse power to get out further if you want.
 
hend238 said:
Is component costs a consideration for you? The 338 Lapua will be spendy monster to feed.
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Yes and no if that makes sense. If Im able to shoot quite a bit then its going to get pricey, and quick. But I cant see myself shooting more then 20 rounds a month tops.
 
If you want to get good, it takes a lot of practice. Lots of practice means lots of ammo. Choose a platform with relatively cheap ammo and practice, practice, practice. When I got into long range shooting, I just shot my rem 700 SPS .308 and worked up to 800 yards. I bought a Ruger Precision rifle in 6.5 CM last fall and have stretched it out to 1200 yards. I also have a Savage 110 FCP-HS in .338LM that I have shot at 1200 yards, but I shoot it a lot less due to the cost of ammo. It's a super fun gun to shoot, but it's very expensive. I would have never got the trigger time and built up my skills the way I have, had I only shot the .338LM.

Just my 2cents...
 
If you want to learn LR shooting, better gear up to shoot alot.

If you are going to reload, you need to be a good enough shot to tune the ammo so ... you will be shooting alot.

If you want to hunt at LR, you need to be fluent in LR shooting so .... you will be shooting alot.

Not just the cost but the ability to drive the set up well. Consider a smaller cartridge for all the positives it can teach you.

Even the 22LR is a wonderful tool when shooting it at 300m..... you need to learn the ACT of shooting, then the wind reading to make hits more certain.

20rds per month... not to be the bringer of bad news, you will not get to a level of proficiency in your life time at that rate of exposure. Just because you have a fast car, doesn't mean you can drive fast.

Jerry
 
I've been shootin my 308 at 500 yards for awhile. Can shoot 5" groups out to 500 as is. Keep in mind I don't wanna do competition shooting at all. This is a for fun, sport. Not to concerned about price of ammo right now. With work the way it is I won't be able to shoot very much until May anyway.
 
Mystic Precision said:
If you want to learn LR shooting, better gear up to shoot alot.

If you are going to reload, you need to be a good enough shot to tune the ammo so ... you will be shooting alot.

If you want to hunt at LR, you need to be fluent in LR shooting so .... you will be shooting alot.

Not just the cost but the ability to drive the set up well. Consider a smaller cartridge for all the positives it can teach you.

Even the 22LR is a wonderful tool when shooting it at 300m..... you need to learn the ACT of shooting, then the wind reading to make hits more certain.

20rds per month... not to be the bringer of bad news, you will not get to a level of proficiency in your life time at that rate of exposure. Just because you have a fast car, doesn't mean you can drive fast.

Jerry
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Lots of wise info right here from Jerry.

One thought for yourself dependant on flatness of cartridge trajectory.

Many people get the rifle/scope combo right bang on with first purchase.

Extra MOA up elevation bases are what most of us fall on our faces. Because we start fairly green to LR shooting. Our skills often develop faster then anticipated.

Soon we are junking out or initlal scope base for something like 30 MOA up, built in.
(Seems to affect 22 LR, 308 Win, and 300 Win Mag shooters the most IIRC)

just info
 
hunter-4-life said:
I've been shootin my 308 at 500 yards for awhile. Can shoot 5" groups out to 500 as is. Keep in mind I don't wanna do competition shooting at all. This is a for fun, sport. Not to concerned about price of ammo right now. With work the way it is I won't be able to shoot very much until May anyway.
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Depending on the bullet, just add another 20ish mins of elevation and send it... 1000yds DONE. If you are consistent at 500yds, you have done all the hard work. As long as the scope tracks and the bullet stays stable, distance is just more scope elevation.

There are plenty of bullets that will make the trip... just look at FTR tech to see how far the 308 has advanced.

Put the money for the new rifle into better optics and components.

With the right ammo, you can be sub MOA at 1000yds and really only use a few more mins of elevation to make the trip.

So if on a tight budget, why not put the money towards something that gets results?

When buying a new rifle, do you know it will shoot? You know what you got now.

Jerry
 
hunter-4-life said:
Yes and no if that makes sense. If Im able to shoot quite a bit then its going to get pricey, and quick. But I cant see myself shooting more then 20 rounds a month tops.
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Then you will NEVER be any good at long range. The experience necessary to produce decent results at long range requires hundreds upon possibly thousands of rounds of practice. 20 rounds a month? You need to shoot 50-100 rounds at a sitting.

Long range takes practices, lots of it.

All of the rifles you mentioned are gonna kick the crap out of you, which means you won't practice. Get a 6mm or 6.5mm or even a 308 and spend several years shooting that before you even consider moving up to a big boomer.
 
hunter-4-life said:
I've been shootin my 308 at 500 yards for awhile. Can shoot 5" groups out to 500 as is. Keep in mind I don't wanna do competition shooting at all. This is a for fun, sport. Not to concerned about price of ammo right now. With work the way it is I won't be able to shoot very much until May anyway.
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No disrespect to Jerry's answer above but IMO 500 yds is the easy stuff. Atmosphere, wind and mirage are all pretty minor effects at that kind of distance. At 1000 yds those things become much more difficult to deal with.

There is no reason your 308 can't do 1000+ yds. I shoot my 20" barrelled Savage PC further than that all the time. My longest was 1250 yds.
 
I too suggest to avoid the boomers at first. Not only due to recoil and stuff. But component cost. You MUST shoot more than 20 rounds a month if you want to get good.
I would seriously look at a 260 or a 6.5 creed or a 284 or 280AI if you want a bit more jam. You will be able to afford to shoot them a lot more often and do it a lot more comfortably.
After a bunch of practice and you can consistently (90-100%) make cold bore shots from a field position on targets the same size or a bit smaller than the vitals of the animals you are hunting then go hunting. I would have no issues shooting deer out to 5 or 600 with a 260 or 6.5 creed under good conditions.

IMO I would shoot a winmag at just about any game in NA out to 1000 if I felt I was competent enough, there is plenty of energy still.

Having said that, if reloading cost isn't an issue, get the winmag. Just try to shoot it as often as you can, take good notes and learn as best / quickly as you can.

The 338's are cool, but cost prohibitive to load for.
 
Suputin said:
No disrespect to Jerry's answer above but IMO 500 yds is the easy stuff. Atmosphere, wind and mirage are all pretty minor effects at that kind of distance. At 1000 yds those things become much more difficult to deal with.

There is no reason your 308 can't do 1000+ yds. I shoot my 20" barrelled Savage PC further than that all the time. My longest was 1250 yds.
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There is a perception that 1000yds is SOOOO far away that only some amazing gear can reach it. Not true at all.... On the days the OP can shoot MOA at 500yds, is the same conditions that will allow him to put rds on target at 1000yds.

Maybe he needs to tweak his load, maybe the wind pushes him around a bit more, maybe he needs a larger then MOA target... doesn't really matter.

The mental barrier will be broken and then he can focus on doing the tweaks to get it done.

As you have shown, the 308 can put bullets way out there. My furthest was 1450yds with a 155gr Amax way back when.... I ran out of real estate to go further.

There was a club in the US that did 2000m bench shooting with 308's... their target was circles in the desert floor... really loud lawn darts.

A bigger cartridge simply give you a faster initial start but look at the deceleration over distances and you will see, it really doesn't amount to much for the substantial increase in expense of components and wear.

The OP can run JBM on a Hrn 208gr amax going 2550fps vs 2800fps. See the difference in distance to subsonic flight... see the difference in elevation at 1000yds.

Really not a big deal.

Jerry
 
Jerry, what did you use to get a 155 AMAX out so far? At that distance it had to be well subsonic.

I've run the 208 AMAX out to 1200 yds and IIRC it goes subsonic around 1400. I looked at the 178 AMAX and think that would be a good choice for extreme range 308 work. Biggest issue for me is the short 20" bbl on my Precision Carbine makes it hard to generate much velocity.
 
I have experience with my 178 amax out to 1360m. They stay true and hold moa "ish" 15-16" with very little wind. I start mine out at 2650fps, and a 1-12 twist. Quite the arc at that range though....

To the OP, I would stick 300mag in your choices. You will shoot a lot more 300 mag than a 338LM, recoiled and cost wise. That HS is a ###y unit anyways. In saying that.. Grab a 308 or another SA choice mentioned here and start banging away, you will surprise yourself. Besides, a .308 is still effective in the deer world well past 600 doing your part too.... Just saying.
 
For trigger time...a .223 7 or 8 twist 28-30" long. You"ll know precise reloading once you've spent some time with the fast twist 223.

And for real reach...something in 7mm. 338L would be alright as well. Although it's gonna need a brake so hope you hunt with earmuffs on.

The .308 you have is good to learn on as well. Put 50-80 down range per sitting then do 20 with the boomer...should work.
 
Suputin said:
Jerry, what did you use to get a 155 AMAX out so far? At that distance it had to be well subsonic.

I've run the 208 AMAX out to 1200 yds and IIRC it goes subsonic around 1400. I looked at the 178 AMAX and think that would be a good choice for extreme range 308 work. Biggest issue for me is the short 20" bbl on my Precision Carbine makes it hard to generate much velocity.
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For many bullets, going subsonic doesn't change the ability to hit targets.

The only way to know is to shoot way out there. For the 155gr Amax I used, the load prep at shorter distances made sure the vertical was very low, accuracy as good as the barrel would provide.

Then it was just add elevation to make the trip.

If you run 208gr Amax, you have a bullet with a good history of shooting great after going subsonic. Don't be afraid of that "wall"... just work out beyond when the bullet is supposed to be subsonic (I go 200yds) and see what you got.

Odds are, there will be nothing dramatic except more elevation per 100yds then before but the accuracy should track.

Go for it...

Jerry
 
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