First pistol recommendations

Grantmac

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I've got a pretty concrete idea of what I want in a pistol, but I thought I'd run it by you folks and see what your input is.
I'm not going to get really competitive with IPSC or anything, but I might get my Blackbadge and shoot occasionally as a means of improving my skill. Not looking to compete, just be competent when there is some pressure on.
With that in mind I'm sure I can shoot anything if it's just for fun.
Anything I get would have to be in 9mm and have a .22lr conversion slide available (and bought at the same time). The conversion would have to function as the normal slide (ie: hold open). Most of my shooting would be with the .22 slide with the occasional 50rnds of centerfire thown in. The point would be to get accurate and build muscle memory with the cheap stuff then get my control down with the real ammunition.

I've handled CZs, although they fit well I find them heavy and the slide release seems to be a hell of a reach.
I've shot a Glock 22 and Sig 225. Both seemed to have good controls (better than the CZ). But the Sig didn't seem to be very accurate for me, especially that first DA pull (which I know I can get used to). Also the Sig seemed to have slower recovery even though it was 9mm Vs. the .40 Glock.
I'd like to keep this to double-stacked pistols as the mag changes seem much smoother, unless thats just something I need to work on.

So thats the situation. I'm not opposed to any particular brand (even Norinco is fine) so long as it meets my requirements and buying used is a huge plus. I appriciate any input. Most likely this will get bought in 7 months when I'm back from being deployed.
Thanks,
Grant
 
I've got a pretty concrete idea of what I want in a pistol, but I thought I'd run it by you folks and see what your input is.
I'm not going to get really competitive with IPSC or anything, but I might get my Blackbadge and shoot occasionally as a means of improving my skill. Not looking to compete, just be competent when there is some pressure on.
With that in mind I'm sure I can shoot anything if it's just for fun.
Anything I get would have to be in 9mm and have a .22lr conversion slide available (and bought at the same time). The conversion would have to function as the normal slide (ie: hold open). Most of my shooting would be with the .22 slide with the occasional 50rnds of centerfire thown in. The point would be to get accurate and build muscle memory with the cheap stuff then get my control down with the real ammunition.

I've handled CZs, although they fit well I find them heavy and the slide release seems to be a hell of a reach.
I've shot a Glock 22 and Sig 225. Both seemed to have good controls (better than the CZ). But the Sig didn't seem to be very accurate for me, especially that first DA pull (which I know I can get used to). Also the Sig seemed to have slower recovery even though it was 9mm Vs. the .40 Glock.
I'd like to keep this to double-stacked pistols as the mag changes seem much smoother, unless thats just something I need to work on.

So thats the situation. I'm not opposed to any particular brand (even Norinco is fine) so long as it meets my requirements and buying used is a huge plus. I appriciate any input. Most likely this will get bought in 7 months when I'm back from being deployed.
Thanks,
Grant

back from being deployed??? get yourself a para-ordinance special''canadian force'' tribute....beautifull 1911.
 
Budget=Low!
What can I say, I'm just a plinker that wants to try sending a lot of .22lr down range with something restricted.
If I could find an older G17 and a conversion I'd be pretty pleased.
 
This is the advice I received when I first started looking for a pistol. Enjoy!

Yah, I think this approach is the way to do it. Buying a particular name brand because someone told you they were good, or they like shooting them, or someone told you that _____________ (fill in blank) uses this gun, and they know what they are talking about, etc., etc., is pretty much a pointless exercise which will cause you to buy and sell guns quite a few times.

I would suggest going through it like this:

Price - What are you prepared to spend on a gun? This could potentially be a huge factor in figuring out what to get. A Wilson Combat 1911 would be a fantastic gun, but very few people will spend that kind of money on a gun until they know exactly what they are and aren't looking for in a pistol.

New or used - I would recommend new for a first gun. Used guns can have problems that need to be worked out, and that can be really frustrating if you don't have another gun to shoot and haven't made friends with a competent local gunsmith yet.

Pistol or Revolver - What gets your motor runnin'? Sounds like you want a pistol, but there are lots of people on this board that dream about revolvers at night. Everybody is different.

Calibre - Go with 9mm (or .38 Special in revolver) for a first gun unless you really have some good reason to go with another calibre... i.e., a reason other than "my friend told me..", "my local police force uses..", "my favorite character in a movie uses..." Ammo is really expensive, and getting worse all the time. Way more expensive than guns, whether you reload or not. Very few people understand this when they start shooting handguns (that you will spend way more on ammo than guns if you do any serious volume of shooting). You should also think about something you can convert to .22LR is possible as well.... or split your available funds between a 9mm/.38 and a cheap .22LR pistol.

Polymer or metal frame - A lot of people, like myself, think that there are good examples of both types. I generally prefer the heavier feel of an alloy or steel frame gun, but some of the poly guns are superb. You really should try at least one of each to get an idea what the difference is. I think alloy frame guns tend to be softer shooting, even in a 9mm, but some people absolutely swear by poly guns. Try a Beretta 92, CZ 75/85 or SIG 229/226 if you can, and then pick up a GLOCK/XD/M&P-type gun and shoot it right after. You should get a definite sense of which one you prefer pretty much right off the bat.

Hammer fired or striker fired - This one is harder to get a sense of what you prefer when you are a new shooter. It took me a couple of years to figure out that I was basically a hammer-fired guy. The main difference is in how the trigger feels... which leads me to...

SA/DA, SAO, DAO or something in-between (GLOCK-type partially pre-compressed striker triggers, HK's LEM, SIG's DAK, Para's LDA, etc.) - My own view on this is... if you want to save yourself a lot of frustration and see your shooting get better faster... get something with a single action trigger to start. It is so much easier for everyone - especially new shooters - to shoot well in SA. I can shoot the DA on my SIG's and HK's about as well as I can shoot them in SA... but that is after a buzzilion rounds downrange. I can shoot GLOCKs better now than when I started shooting pistols... but I still think you do yourself (and your ego) a big favour in the beginning by getting a gun that will fire in SA. It is more challenging to learn to use an SA/DA gun with a holster than it is to shoot a GLOCK with a holster, but for learning to actually get within a few inches of what you are aiming at, SA is the way to go.

Parts/accessories availability - The more popular the gun, the easier it will be to get parts, holsters, mags, etc. The GLOCK is the king in this area, but some of the other big names are not much further behind (1911's, SIG, Beretta, etc.). More obscure guns like Steyr, Taurus, etc. take more work to find stuff for.

"Compact vs. full-size" - Most people start out with the full size guns, but many of us (I am very guilty in this area) eventually learn that we like to shoot, and can shoot better, with the compacts. This is something that you will have to try in order to figure out for yourself. After shooting a GLOCK 19, I've never had the slightest inclination to want a full-size GLOCK (I actually sold my G17 awhile ago... no interest in it). But that is just me. Some people will be the opposite.

What is actually fun to shoot for you? - Some guns, I feel like it is almost "work" to shoot them. They snap around in your hands, they tire you out. Others will shoot like a dream for you. As an example, I didn't like shooting the Walther P99. After the honeymoon period, it didn't come to the range with me that much, and never by itself. My "moment of enlightenment", on the other hand, was shooting the SIG 229. If I had a 1,000 rounds sitting there, I have no doubt that I could bang them all of in an afternoon without any trouble.

So, try and work through this yourself, but this is what I would say:
Price - Pretty hard to beat GLOCK 17 and M&P 9. CZ-75 if you are leaning the other way (metal, hammer fired, SA).
New or used - Go new for a first gun.
Pistol or Revolver - purely a personal thing.
Calibre -9mm or .38 special to start.
Polymer or metal frame - I think metal is more pleasant (and easier) to shoot... and shoot well.
Hammer fired or striker fired / SA/DA, SAO, DAO or something in-between - strongly consider getting something with a hammer that will fire in SA.
Parts/accessories availability -don't buy an obscure gun because you want to be different... not for your first gun anyway.
"Compact vs. full-size" - Even though Canadian laws can make it tough, don't write off the compacts right away. There are some excellent compact models available in Canada.
What is actually fun to shoot for you? - There is probably a gun out there that is good match for you. Mine was the SIG 229. Took me awhile to find it, but try as many guns as you can... make friends at the range... and you can speed up the process a bit that way.

As for the "easy to field strip" thing. Don't worry about that. All modern handguns are very easy to field strip. Some are harder than others to completely disassemble and re-assemble, but you won't need to mess with that for a few years at least.

Good luck!
 
Good info Redlight35.

I'm also looking into getting my first handgun. I started by joining a gun forum, then I went to a shooting range which allows you to try out different guns. This helped TREMENDOUSLY. I originally disqualified any polymer gun as I didn't like the feel of the Glock 17 (didn't fit my hand well), but after trying the S&W M&P (adjustable palm grip!) I absolutely loved the way it felt. I also got to compare and contrast the difference between a full metal and polymer.

If you live in the Lower Mainland in B.C. check out DVC Ventures in Port Coquitlam. They have great service and will help you with your choice of handgun! I myself may pick up a S&W M&P or a Beretta 92FS (depending on how much I can get it for).
 
Thanks for the responses guys.
I'm on Vancouver Island but I think a walk over to vancouver and $100 of gun renting may be in order when I return.
I do like the idea of a SA/DA metal gun. Problem is that most don't have a decent .22 conversion available (IE:Sig), or just doesn't seem to fit me (CZ). Same goes for the M&P which I really like the feel of, but just doesn't seem to have a .22 conversion being made.
I have to admit that shooting the glock really suprised me. The trigger wasn't great (I had been shooting my Anschutz smallbore rifle, it can spoil a guy) but the gun itself seemed to have great controls and feel. Perhaps also due to the light weight the .22 slide actually had a decent amount of recoil, enough to require control for double-taps.
If the Sig conversion kit had last round hold-open I would be strongly inclined to buy one, but that is a hang-up that I just can't get over.
I'm more interested in getting good at mag changes and hitting what needs to be hit quickly inside 10m then shooting small groups at 25m (but I'll try for that eventually).

Compacts are fine, actually they may be a bonus as I don't have huge hands and I like to eventually get my wife (who has tiny hands) out to shoot.

Thanks,
Grant
 
Disclaimer: OK, bear with me here people, I'm a new gun owner myself, and have limited experience, but have done a lot of reading and had discussions with experienced shooters, so feel brave enough to share my opinion. But feel free to let me know if I'm way out in left field as I'm posting as much out of curiosity and a desire to learn as to help the OP with their question.

If you're not planning on getting into serious competition, I have to question the choice to buy one handgun that can do double duty with both 9mm and .22 LR calibers, at least for a new shooter on a budget. Most conversion kits for full size pistols like a Glock cost as much or more than a decent .22LR target pistol like a Ruger Mk III or Beretta U22. To me, having two guns instead of one for the same money has some distinct benefits:

  1. If you have to send one in to a gunsmith for service, you can still shoot.
  2. Two guns will last twice as long as one since the wear and tear is effectively halved for each gun vs. having a single gun and converting it.
  3. Convenience: at the range, you can switch back and forth between calibers at will without having to field strip and switch components out.
  4. You'll get much more accurate results with a good .22LR target pistol than you will a converted 9mm.
  5. You'll get to enjoy two different guns, with their own unique characteristics, nuances and personalities.

I recognize you want to develop the muscle memory, but probably the only benefits you're going to get you could get by dry firing your 9mm pistol and practicing with dummy rounds. My understanding is much of the skill you will acquire from shooting a .22 pistol will transfer to a larger caliber, that being stance, breathing, patience, pace, etc. But shooting .22 LR ammo through say a Glock 17 will feel almost nothing like shooting 9mm ammo, so the only way to really get good shooting a Glock 17 with 9mm ammo is to USE 9mm ammo in your Glock 17. Unless you're more interested in shooting a serious looking gun on the cheap, in which case a conversion kit is the way to go.

Does that make any sense?
 
I'm gonna have to tell you to go for the Glock 17. It's an excellent 1st pistol.
It's affordable, extremely reliable and hardy (not much maintenance required), accurate, light in weight, and fairly common. 9mm is cheap for now, and easy to acquire. Excellent for both plinking and self defense, even though we won't be worrying about the former in Canada.
 
I would suggest the G17 with an AA .22lr kit. I love my Glock setup, I use it for IPSC, IDPA, 3gun, and just plain fun!

I doubt you will ever break or need to do anything for the conversion or G17. Not really any wear and tear parts wiht the Glock, maybe a recoil spring? As for accuracy, it is more accurate than i can ever be. If you're lazy like me you can buy a separate frame...lazzzzy ass.

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Disclaimer: OK, bear with me here people, I'm a new gun owner myself, and have limited experience, but have done a lot of reading and had discussions with experienced shooters, so feel brave enough to share my opinion. But feel free to let me know if I'm way out in left field as I'm posting as much out of curiosity and a desire to learn as to help the OP with their question.

If you're not planning on getting into serious competition, I have to question the choice to buy one handgun that can do double duty with both 9mm and .22 LR calibers, at least for a new shooter on a budget. Most conversion kits for full size pistols like a Glock cost as much or more than a decent .22LR target pistol like a Ruger Mk III or Beretta U22. To me, having two guns instead of one for the same money has some distinct benefits:

  1. If you have to send one in to a gunsmith for service, you can still shoot.
  2. Two guns will last twice as long as one since the wear and tear is effectively halved for each gun vs. having a single gun and converting it.
  3. Convenience: at the range, you can switch back and forth between calibers at will without having to field strip and switch components out.
  4. You'll get much more accurate results with a good .22LR target pistol than you will a converted 9mm.
  5. You'll get to enjoy two different guns, with their own unique characteristics, nuances and personalities.

I recognize you want to develop the muscle memory, but probably the only benefits you're going to get you could get by dry firing your 9mm pistol and practicing with dummy rounds. My understanding is much of the skill you will acquire from shooting a .22 pistol will transfer to a larger caliber, that being stance, breathing, patience, pace, etc. But shooting .22 LR ammo through say a Glock 17 will feel almost nothing like shooting 9mm ammo, so the only way to really get good shooting a Glock 17 with 9mm ammo is to USE 9mm ammo in your Glock 17. Unless you're more interested in shooting a serious looking gun on the cheap, in which case a conversion kit is the way to go.

Does that make any sense?
 
You're going to get a suggestion for just about every make, model and caliber here, as everyone has their own favorite and thinks it should be yours as well.

The fact is that you really cant know what you like and what works for you until you try em.
 
I definitely agree with strykrpal. Conversion kits that I was looking at were $400+ where as you can pick up a .22/45 MKIII Ruger for ~$325. I was originally going to go with a .22lr pistol but was advised that though you will develop good habits, you won't develop something important which is recoil control.
 
Thanks for the responses guys.
I'm on Vancouver Island but I think a walk over to vancouver and $100 of gun renting may be in order when I return.
I do like the idea of a SA/DA metal gun. Problem is that most don't have a decent .22 conversion available (IE:Sig), or just doesn't seem to fit me (CZ). Same goes for the M&P which I really like the feel of, but just doesn't seem to have a .22 conversion being made.
I have to admit that shooting the glock really suprised me. The trigger wasn't great (I had been shooting my Anschutz smallbore rifle, it can spoil a guy) but the gun itself seemed to have great controls and feel. Perhaps also due to the light weight the .22 slide actually had a decent amount of recoil, enough to require control for double-taps.
If the Sig conversion kit had last round hold-open I would be strongly inclined to buy one, but that is a hang-up that I just can't get over.
I'm more interested in getting good at mag changes and hitting what needs to be hit quickly inside 10m then shooting small groups at 25m (but I'll try for that eventually).

Compacts are fine, actually they may be a bonus as I don't have huge hands and I like to eventually get my wife (who has tiny hands) out to shoot.

Thanks,
Grant

I too like DA/SA pistol, don't really care about metal or plastic, CZ may not fit with many people with its cheap plastic grip, but Hogue make finger grove grip for CZ or CZ factory thin rubber grip can give you outstanding control of the gun. Glock ineed has the best grip shape and grip angle out of all my gun, great control but it didn't come with SA/DA but it is a great gun for everybody. I have both CZ and G17 and the G17 shoot better for me. Don't let the .22 converson kit limited your choice. own two gun is better than one gun with two slides. One more gun also allow you to learn more about the other made.

Trigun
 
I would suggest the G17 with an AA .22lr kit. I love my Glock setup, I use it for IPSC, IDPA, 3gun, and just plain fun!

I doubt you will ever break or need to do anything for the conversion or G17. Not really any wear and tear parts wiht the Glock, maybe a recoil spring? As for accuracy, it is more accurate than i can ever be. If you're lazy like me you can buy a separate frame...lazzzzy ass.
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I'd have to say I'm most inclined to go this direction. Out of interest where does a guy get just a G17 frame? I'd be pretty interested in doing this with a AA slide to start then grabbing a 9mm slide later on.

For the record: I have no interest in a .22lr target pistol, not even a little bit at this point. Switching slides takes me less time then loading a magazine. As for ultimate accuracy, as long as it's close to the 9mm then thats all I care about.

Thanks for the suggestions,
Grant
 
I got mine on this Forum. Try doing a search or put a WTB ad in the pistol forum.

I'd suggest getting the 9mm first the 22lr as u get to use both calibres right away. It might be tough to find a deal on a 9mm top end.
 
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