first pistol

P22's are hit/miss from what i hear, i have one, it ejected brass in my face, so i removed the extactor spring and stretched it a bit, and it's fine. My kids and i can shoot it all day on any type of ammo, and like it alot.
Another hit/miss is the S&W 22A, i bought a dud in March that i just got back from repair a second time(FTF's, FTE), so i can't comment on how it shoots yet, but i liked the way it fit my hand, and the looks and feel are ok.
 
--Terry-- said:
Sig Mosquitto is a pretty neat starter's gun. Mine is a lot of fun to shoot, and it loves CCI Mini Mag ammo. Quite accurate, too.

Only draw-back is that the trigger travel is a little bit long.

Sig-lead2.jpg
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Who sells them here in Canada and how much do they go for new?

Thanks
 
I know you have stated you want a good .22 semi, if that is what you want then Ruger is a good choice IMO.

However, you may want to look into a center fire semi auto, maybe in 9mm or bigger as a first gun. Not everyone will agree with this, but many people, myself included, get bored of a .22 pretty quickly. Alot of new shooters like to send massive amounts of ammo downrange, in a short time while making a big bang, feeling some good recoil, and making good sized holes in the target. I started with a .45, lots of fun.

Nothing wrong with starting with a .22, you will probably want to move up to something bigger shortly anyway though.

Just food for thought.......
 
BuddyHollyDied said:
However, you may want to look into a center fire semi auto, maybe in 9mm or bigger as a first gun. Not everyone will agree with this, but many people, myself included, get bored of a .22 pretty quickly.
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Actually I agree with you. You don't feel the KICK in .22 semi-autos, and pretty soon you will start to seek the thrill of more recoil. 9mm should be a decent starter.
 
--Terry-- said:
Originally Posted by BuddyHollyDied
However, you may want to look into a center fire semi auto, maybe in 9mm or bigger as a first gun. Not everyone will agree with this, but many people, myself included, get bored of a .22 pretty quickly.
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Actually I agree with you. You don't feel the KICK in .22 semi-autos, and pretty soon you will start to seek the thrill of more recoil. 9mm should be a decent starter.
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Yeah, if you are too impatient or lazy then skip the .22 and become a mediocre shooter. :D
 
BuddyHollyDied said:
:D :D

Whats wrong with learning how to handle recoil right from the start ?
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Because you never learn trigger control, timing, sight alignment, etc. You end up anticipating the recoil. You have not yet trained your body to shoot properly. Once you throw recoil and muzzle blast into the mix it is hopeless.

If I were to say you have to learn the alphabet before you can read I bet you would say that's boring.

Odds are anyone just getting into handgun shooting will not have reloading equipment. So they will be shooting factory ammo. So how much does a box of 45 ACP cost now? With taxes about $20? How much does it cost for a box of .22LR, $3 with taxes? Even cheaper if you buy the bulk packs.

Shooting .22 first will be cheap. At $20 per box (for the 45s) you could end up paying for the 22 handgun in no time. In the end you may (if you tried) train your body to do the right things when you move up to a more powerful gun. Not only that but you end up with a 22 gun you can keep or sell off.

I recommend keeping the .22 gun so that if you bring someone new to shoot they can get used to shooting a handgun for a bit before you scare the crap out of them with a bigger gun. Also them shooting .22s will cost you less.

Remember that most loads are designed to produce the most power that can be controlled in the size of gun produced. A friend was surprised when he learned this from shooting a little Colt Mustang of mine. The gun is chambered in 380 Auto. Pip-squeak gun (I think about 18 ounces) shooting a not that powerful cartridge. He was surprised at how much recoil there was. When you consider the weight of the gun then it makes sense. If you had a more powerful cartridge in the same size gun it would be a real unpleasant experience. As it is it is not a joy to shoot.

Now guns that are chambered for the 45 ACP or 9 mm are typically heavier but the factory load for the gun generally is as much as can be handled by most people. These are not comfortable loads (deinately not for a new shooter), they are loads that are to produce the desired effect on where you intend the bullet to end up.

I bet when you learned how to drive you didn't start with a Semi did you? I sure hope not. That would be dumb. So why would you do the same for learning to shoot a gun?

If you only could buy one gun in your life then I would say go for a center fire cartridge gun and shoot only lighter loads to start. But since we can have as many guns as we like then buy a 22 first.

My first handgun was a Ruger mark I. My second was a Desert Eagle in 44 magnum. I'm sure that most people here would think this makes a lot more sense than starting with the Desert Eagle first.
 
Rudy H said:
Because you never learn trigger control, timing, sight alignment, etc. You end up anticipating the recoil. You have not yet trained your body to shoot properly. Once you throw recoil and muzzle blast into the mix it is hopeless.
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Never?? OH?

Trigger control may be easier to learn with some recoil, anyone can hold a .22 steady while pulling the trigger, things change when pulling the trigger on a say a .45. You have to learn all over again anyway.
The sight alignment is the same on my 1911 .22 as it is on my 1911 .45 - same sights, same model gun.
Timing is different from a .22 to a .45 anyway, you will have to slow down your firing as the recoil gets bigger.....so slow it down to begin with - whats the difference?? How does firing faster repeatedly teach you how to fire slowly ?

Rudy H said:
If I were to say you have to learn the alphabet before you can read I bet you would say that's boring.
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Yes it was.

Rudy H said:
Odds are anyone just getting into handgun shooting will not have reloading equipment. So they will be shooting factory ammo. So how much does a box of 45 ACP cost now? With taxes about $20? How much does it cost for a box of .22LR, $3 with taxes? Even cheaper if you buy the bulk packs.
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Not everyone here is broke....... I couldn't care less how much ammo cost me to send through 8 grand worth of guns. Economy isn't the top priority to everyone. And if you give the argument that it will cost more to learn how to shoot properly...well who cares what it costs when you are having big fun making big bangs and big holes. It is a hobby to most people, and as such most hobbies cost money while getting no return on that money other than fun.

Rudy H said:
Shooting .22 first will be cheap. At $20 per box (for the 45s) you could end up paying for the 22 handgun in no time. In the end you may (if you tried) train your body to do the right things when you move up to a more powerful gun. Not only that but you end up with a 22 gun you can keep or sell off.
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Like I said above - not everyone here is broke......and I paid for my .22 the day I bought it.

Rudy H said:
I recommend keeping the .22 gun so that if you bring someone new to shoot they can get used to shooting a handgun for a bit before you scare the crap out of them with a bigger gun. Also them shooting .22s will cost you less.
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A .22 might just turn them off of shooting with no recoil, noise or fun.....let em kick a .45 or .44 mag once and more often than not they will not run scared, they'll be telling everyone that " hey, I shot a big fkn cannon the other day, can't wait to do it again.

Rudy H said:
Remember that most loads are designed to produce the most power that can be controlled in the size of gun produced. A friend was surprised when he learned this from shooting a little Colt Mustang of mine. The gun is chambered in 380 Auto. Pip-squeak gun (I think about 18 ounces) shooting a not that powerful cartridge. He was surprised at how much recoil there was. When you consider the weight of the gun then it makes sense. If you had a more powerful cartridge in the same size gun it would be a real unpleasant experience. As it is it is not a joy to shoot..
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Put your balls back in your sac and shoot the goddamn thing...:D :D

Rudy H said:
Now guns that are chambered for the 45 ACP or 9 mm are typically heavier but the factory load for the gun generally is as much as can be handled by most people. These are not comfortable loads (deinately not for a new shooter), they are loads that are to produce the desired effect on where you intend the bullet to end up
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Again....balls/sac.......you get the picture:p

Rudy H said:
I bet when you learned how to drive you didn't start with a Semi did you? I sure hope not. That would be dumb. So why would you do the same for learning to shoot a gun?
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Well now......I was pulling b-trains through the mountains when I was 15 years old, didn't even have a class 5......and I was driving semi and operating equipment long before that - say what you will, but you know s**t about me.

Well thats about it......I respect your opinion on the .22 vs centerfire issue, and some of your points are very valid, just not for me, which is why I stated my opinion and preference to begin with, with out telling someone that they didn't do this, or didn't do that - especially when you know absolutely sweet f**k all about who you are addressing.

Check your stupid comments at the door, and next time make goddamn sure you know who you are talking about before spouting off about that person.
 
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BuddyHollyDied said:
Trigger control may be easier to learn with some recoil, anyone can hold a .22 steady while pulling the trigger, things change when pulling the trigger on a say a .45.
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I disagree with that myself. I love to get new people into the hobby (aka obsession) of shooting. The biggest problems we face are that new people are pre-disposed by movies and media. Movies in that they think that anyone can take a .45 blow off 7 rounds in 2-3 seconds and score 10's all the time. While I admit that blowing ammo that fast is a hoot, it can get expensive. Which can be a sticking point, since not all of us are rich like BHD here.

Sight pictures, trigger control, level of comfort using the firearms, repeatability. All these come with practice, whether using a .22LR or a .45ACP.

New people tend to flinch no matter what they shoot. Normally they never notice but people who watch can see it. One way to tell if you flinch is to do this.

For rimfires. Save one or two duds. You have all had them one time or another. When it doesn't go bang and you have tried the round numerous times. (Don't lie, you have all done it cause you must shoot ALL ammo you have, it's a moral imperative).

For centerfires it a little different as FTF due to faulty primers is rarer. For revolvers, you need a reloader, Semi's a snap cap will do. Using a spent cartridge, w/o removing the spent primer, crimp in a bullet tip, thereby making a dud round.

If you are allowing new people to use your guns to shoot in order to get them interested, you do the following to check thier flinching. Allow them to shoot a mag or two (cylinder for revolvers) while making sure you load them. After they have gotten "used to" the handgun's noise/recoil/muzzle blast, let them do it again, but include the dud round somewhere in the middle. When they get to it you will see how much they flinch at/anticipate the shot. Just watch the barrel motion. You'll be amazed at how much people will compensate for "percieved" reaction. My favorite amongst myself and my friends for personal testing is to load my revolver with 4-5 .38specials and the rest full load .357's and random it for 25 yard shots. It tells you how well you anticpate repeated shots.

A .22 might just turn them off of shooting with no recoil, noise or fun.....
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Or you can say the same about starting off someone with a .45ACP, with all that recoil and noise and lack of fun as it scares the tar outta them the first time. Not everyone is ready for instant BFG shooting. Give new people a chance with everything if you can. Shoot that .22 for a load or two and offer them a chance at the bigger stuff if they seem interested (or bored in BHD's case). Give them a 9mm, .38, .45. If they like those with the enhanced sensations of recoil, blast, noise, then let them play with the bigger toys again. That is a very good and successful approach (in my experience anyways) of getting new people interested in shooting.

Check your stupid comments at the door, and next time make goddamn sure you know who you are talking about before spouting off about that person.
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Tch tch. Not a very nice way to disagree, no matter what the previous poster says.
 
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Jarlath....now that is a respectfull way to disagree with someones post. Your points are well taken.

My end comment was about the previous poster who had made comments about myself without knowing anything about me, instead of just disagreeing and explaining his points. It was not my way of disagreeing with him on the issues at hand, it was in response to the way he came accross in his post.

My comment was justified in this case.

And no...I am not rich. :)
 
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I am a beginner myself. And I shot both .22 and .45 on the first day to the range. Interestingly, I shot tighter groups with the .45 than with the .22.

To me, making sure to have a good quality handgun with a good trigger is more important than the caliber of the gun. One can always pratice dry firing at home to get rid of the "flinching", and build good basics. There is a lot of good information around to teach people how to improve their shooting skills. If one pays attention and do some homework, he/she could make improvements and overcome the "flinching" no matter what caliber he/she shoots.
 
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