fully supported chamber versus not so fully.

M

manboy

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after i had that aluminum round blow out i figured i'd take a few pictures so that people can see the difference in the various chambers of some plastic guns.

left to right:

glock19 9mm bar-sto, glock22 factory, M&P40 factory

chamber002.jpg


you can see that the glock barrels are "less supported" on the underside where the feedramp is. thus the reputation for eating any kind of ammo. less precise tolerance means it'll eat rusty old junk and crappy reloads at your own peril. you can see that the M&P barrel is much tighter at the bottom, ie: less space between the feedramp and chamber. i have only fired new factory ammo or my own handloads with proper crimps in these guns, so i can't really claim to have tried every possible ammo to see just how much the difference in chamber support/ feedramp tolerance really makes. these pictures are simply a comparison for you see what the hell all the fuss is about with glock 22 chambers.

below: M&P left, Glock22 right

chamber004.jpg
 
That M&P is ridiculous... looks like a .357SIG chamber.
On the other end, that Barsto chamber looks much more ...umm... "open" than I'd have imagined.

Your G22 barrel looks more generous as well compared to my old G22 barrel:
G22Chamber.jpg


I'd like to see other pics of barrels with rounds chambered for comparison (Sig, HK, etc.)
 
I think that is really poor design on Glocks part. If they have to cut that much out of the chamber to get the gun to feed reliably they should go back to the drawing board.
 
Hitzy said:
I think that is really poor design on Glocks part. If they have to cut that much out of the chamber to get the gun to feed reliably they should go back to the drawing board.
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maybe. but if that is what makes it shoot when full of sand in Afghanistan, or full of moisture and grime in New Orleans during Katrina, when many other guns are FUBAR, then you have to wonder if your opinion is worth #### all. most of us aren't engineers or gunsmiths, we just have opinions that aren't worth billions of dollars.
 
Rest assured the M&P is the oddball here... I think most other pistols chambered for the .40S&W look like the Glock. I've seen .357SIG chambers (reputed to be the most "supported") and they appear to have a little less material in the 6'oclock spot than that M&P chamber in the pic above :)
 
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Well, I've been shooting the same Glock 22 .40 S&W since 1995... it has in excess of 25,000 rounds thru it... never had a fail to feed, fire, extract or eject. And no "ka-booms"...

Maybe I'm just using the wrong ammo... :rolleyes:
 
manboy said:
maybe. but if that is what makes it shoot when full of sand in Afghanistan, or full of moisture and grime in New Orleans during Katrina, when many other guns are FUBAR, then you have to wonder if your opinion is worth f**k all. most of us aren't engineers or gunsmiths, we just have opinions that aren't worth billions of dollars.
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yeah, glocks are the only piece that work under adverse conditions....:rolleyes:
Who's using them in Afghanistan? Taliban?:rolleyes:
 
Glocks where designed to digest service ammunition without a hic-up or complaint. They do this very well. They were not built with reloads or aluminum budget ammo in mind. Glock builds for cops and soldiers, the rest is a bit market for them. Feed the gun what it was built for and you'll never have a kaboom. I accept this and I really dislike glocks, but I do admire what their engineers and marketeers have acomplished.
 
manboy said:
maybe. but if that is what makes it shoot when full of sand in Afghanistan, or full of moisture and grime in New Orleans during Katrina, when many other guns are FUBAR, then you have to wonder if your opinion is worth f**k all. most of us aren't engineers or gunsmiths, we just have opinions that aren't worth billions of dollars.
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See preceeding post. That being said. Hitzy has a point from the civilian side of things. If glock wants to sell handguns on the civillian market, they should chamber them for expected conditions. At the point that some idiot overloads his glock and blows it up doing damage to himself, he will have very good grounds to sue in the states, as this is a known issue with the design, that has not been corrected in several updates. And saying in the manual, we don't recomend reloads dosen't cut much ice in court.
 
Thank you for this post. When you posted with the pictures of the blown out casing I did not have a clue as to what you were talking about. My next gun will be a G22 and I was concerned with your original post, now that I understand what you were talking about my concerns are gone. Again thanks for the pictures and the explaination.
 
After reading many websites that talked about the kB! factor and 40cal Glocks, I ended up buying a case gauge from Dillion. Now I check all rounds after firing and after re-loading to ensure they meet spec. Any case that fails the gauge, goes into a "requires case-sizing" bin.
 
exarmysig said:
Thank you for this post. When you posted with the pictures of the blown out casing I did not have a clue as to what you were talking about. My next gun will be a G22 and I was concerned with your original post, now that I understand what you were talking about my concerns are gone. Again thanks for the pictures and the explaination.
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your welcome. as i stated before, the pics are for educational purposes. there is already 98687956875 posts about how glocks suck, they don't market stuff properly and blah blah blah. and in each new thread there is the same brand haters and debate over who's gun is better. i don't care about all that ####, and i'm glad your taking these pictures and my thoughts for what they are.

happy shooting, and don't be afraid of getting a G22, they are very good guns. mine has tens of thousands of rounds through it with no failures. just one blown aluminum casing that didn't interfere with the guns ability to shoot.
 
I don't totally get the unsupported idea .
I have a G22 and took it out for the first time today .
Did I notice a bulge in the case after firing , yes , but ...
On all my brass the " puff " ran all the way around the cartridge not only at 6 oclock plus it was father forward on the cartridge and the unsupported area was fine ( flat and normal ) .
This was new ammo , worked great , no complaints .
If I were to entertain thought of why this is happening I would supose that the chamber is to large in diameter . I can't see why this would have anything to do with the feed ramp and or lack of support . But what do I know ??
The only other guns I've seen bulge brass the same way are on 38 super race guns . My understanding is on these guns they jack up the power factor so the comp works and they ream out the chambers so they feed better . I seem to recall they have to get specials dies to full length resize or roll size them every now and again .
 
Max Owner said:
Presume that is what makes a Glock such a reliable gun.
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There are enough fully-supported chamber guns out there that are just as reliable as the Glock, if not more so. An unsupported chamber seems like an engineering cop-out rather than an intentional feature to me.
 
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NavalSniper said:
After reading many websites that talked about the kB! factor and 40cal Glocks, I ended up buying a case gauge from Dillion. Now I check all rounds after firing and after re-loading to ensure they meet spec. Any case that fails the gauge, goes into a "requires case-sizing" bin.
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It's not just about being to spec, it's also about the strength of the brass. Used brass, even if only fired once, is weaker than virgin brass and there's nothing you can do to correct that. If you're shooting reloads in your Glock, you're asking for trouble IMO.
 
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