Funky marks on cases

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energy8667

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I have been using my Norinco M305 with various cartridges:

- PMC Bronze line 7.62 NATO FMJ 147 gr.
- Winchester Super X .308 WIN. Power-point 150 gr.
- American Eagle .308 WIN 150 gr. FMJ-BT

While all these cartridges worked just fine I think I might have made a mistake.

PMC Bronze line claim to be 7,62 NATO and American Eagle's website state that their .308 WIN is within 7,62 NATO specs.

Winchester Super X .308 WIN. does not claim to respect 7,62 X 51 NATO specs.

The M305's manual specify that 7,62 X 51 NATO cartridges must be used.

The funny thing is that tools marks left on Winchester Super X cases were distinct from the other 2 cases types mentionned above: there is a clear and distinct mark on the end of the neck.

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My hypothesis to explain this phenomenon is that .308 winchester Power-point does not respect 7,62 X 51 specs which implies that the case is slightly thinner and pressure is significantly higher which leaves different tool marks on the case neck.

The consequence is that I might have used the wrong ammunition in my Norinco M305 but the cases I retivied after shooting these Winchester Power-point do not only have these funky marks at the case neck but should not be reloaded to shoot in my M305 again.

So my question is: Can I safely reload these Winchester Power-point cases and shoot them in my M305?
 
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You're fine to shoot just about any 150g 308 round in your M305.
And you should be good to reload them all too.

I'm not very particular about whatever range pickup brass I feed my 305, as long as it tests healthy, and have not had any problems.

The M305 is a brass eater, so you won't be too picky after a while either. If it's cheap or free, you'll use it.
 
PS: Americal Eagle pretty much IS Nato 7.62 ammo, they just can't label it as such anymore. Something about the US Gov't not allowing Nato ammo to be exported to Canada anymore, if I remember correctly. So they pretty much just relabeled it.
 
Sooo... is there anyone that can explain the marks on the Winchester Super X case on the left from my Norinco M305?

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Conte said:
PS: Americal Eagle pretty much IS Nato 7.62 ammo, they just can't label it as such anymore. Something about the US Gov't not allowing Nato ammo to be exported to Canada anymore, if I remember correctly. So they pretty much just relabeled it.
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Sorry , it's not pretty much the same , it is or it is not. 308win is commercial ,7.62 NATO is military spec and are loaded to different specs . 308win can go into 7.62 chamber but is not recommended to shoot 7.62x51 in 308 chamber .
There is a constant debate about this , I think there is a sticky in the black rifles forum
 
Perhaps, however there are hundreds of thousands of rounds of 7.62X51 ammo fired in 308 Winchester rifles every year around the world without a whimper. :)

Ted
 
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I have had occasion to load ammo for NATO applications and also for SAAMI (commercial) specs.

Commercial specs are dimensions and pressure limits. These specs are almost identical to NATO specs. Certainly close enough to be 100% interchangeable.

But NATO has many other specs, like case hardness at the head, to allow for violent extraction in semi and full autos. A soft headed commercial case might pull through at the rim.

NATO has specs on neck tension and what they call "pull" - the resitance the bullet has to getting pushed deeper into the case when being cycled.

NATO has a water-proofing requirment.

NATO has both a chamber pressure and a port pressure spec. Commercial is only a chamber pressure.

NATO has a spec on muzzle flash.

Short answer - Commercial ammo with light bullets is just fine. Commercial brass is good for reloading.

The mark on that case mouth is a crimp to hold the bullet in place. Military bullets are also crimped in place. That mark will iron out after being sized and shot a few times.
 
Why not? said:
Perhaps, however there are hundreds of thousands of 7.62X51 ammo fired in 308 Winchester rifles every year around the world with a whimper. :)

Ted
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I agree , but they can't be both ,one is sammi spec witch is commercial ,the other is not . 7.62x51 is not loaded to sammi spec and that's one of the reasons it's not ment for a 308 win chamber
Like I say there is an ongoing debate , I load my own so I really don't care:)
 
Ganderite summed up well what I have read about the differences. There really isn't any unsafe difference between the two for commercial rifle interchangeability.

The thread stickied in the black and green rifle section started out as 5.56 NATO vs. .223 Rem but expanded to others including 7.62 NATO vs. .308 Win.

There is a link to the SAAMI PDF listing what rounds to not chamber in other guns and it says to not put 5.56 NATO into a .223 but it gives no warning about putting 7.62 NATO into a .308 Win. Since that is the most common possible switch I can only assume it means it's safe to do. In my experience it is also safe to do.

I have noticed that Winchester white box .308 Win doesn't throw the brass nearly as far as other brands out of my Norc M305. I guess it's slightly weaker?
 
Crimp marks!

Thanks!

I got lots of stuff to learn!

I am sorry if I feed the 7,62 X51 / .308 WIN compatibility debate!
 
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