Galling

C

canuckiron

Regular
EE Expired
Rating - 100%
16   0   0
Location
Near Mount Forest, ON
Hi Folks,

I was at the gun shop the other day looking at 1911 pistols, specifically the Remington R1 enhanced, and got into a conversation with this other shooter. I mentioned I may get the stainless one and he was saying he wouldn't buy a gun in stainless because of galling. He was a machinist. Hell, he may even be on this list. My point is that I thought that by now they may have gotten the various alloys figured out and that galling would not be a problem. Any thoughts would be appreciated.
 
While most galling problems have been sorted with materials selection and lubrication, stainless will always have more of a tendency to gall than carbon and alloy steels.


Mark
 
John in B.C. said:
So............................what's the solution?

John
Click to expand...

Use the right material combinations and make sure the gun is properly lubed. The first part is the manufacturers job, the second is yours.

I didn't mean to make it sound like stainless will always gall no matter what, just that it has a stronger tendency to than carbon or non-stainless alloy steels. As noted, there are a lot of stainless guns made now and they don't seem to have many problems with it any more. The machinist in OP was probably basing his opinion on the lower strength stainless steels like 304 and 316. They are very gummy and tough and are a b!tch to machine and get good results with. The stainless steels used in guns are much higher strength grades that have a lot more carbon in them and are much less susceptible to galling than the 300 series steels.


Mark
 
I wouldn't worry about it, I have a few stainless auto's with many thousands of rounds through them and have never had a problem, just use a bit of lube like you would for any pistol.
 
mmattockx said:
Use the right material combinations and make sure the gun is properly lubed. The first part is the manufacturers job, the second is yours.

I didn't mean to make it sound like stainless will always gall no matter what, just that it has a stronger tendency to than carbon or non-stainless alloy steels. As noted, there are a lot of stainless guns made now and they don't seem to have many problems with it any more. The machinist in OP was probably basing his opinion on the lower strength stainless steels like 304 and 316. They are very gummy and tough and are a b!tch to machine and get good results with. The stainless steels used in guns are much higher strength grades that have a lot more carbon in them and are much less susceptible to galling than the 300 series steels.


Mark
Click to expand...

Thank you for that.

I am kind of old school myself in that the only lube I use is moderate amounts of ATF. Have never had any issues so far so all good.

John
 
I'm sure ATF would do fine on stainless as well. The trick is to apply it frequently enough that the rails never go dry. And the thing with any light body oil like ATF is that it doesn't tend to stay in one place what with all the motion and back pressure puffs from the firing. But as long as the ATF is applied often enough to ensure that the slides never run dry it should be fine.

I'm just not that good at it so I tend to go with a thin smear of grease applied with a small toothbrush. I'll use oil at the range if I find the slides are quite dry but at home I prefer to lube the slides with a smear of synthetic grease.

Stainless steel alloys have come a long way. If the alloys are correctly chosen for use on a gun the risk of galling is greatly reduced. I'm not sure if it's reduced to the same risk level as carbon steels but it's certainly much better than the guy at the store said. But in my reading about guns over the last few years since getting into the sport I've seen some references to early semis not using the optimum alloys and having the slides gall badly.

It's not a case of just picking one alloy either. The COMBINATION of the two sliding surfaces have to be compatible if the frame and slide are made from different alloys. This can often be the case in carbon steels as well. In those cases it's pretty well documented that if two carbon steel surfaces of the same hardness are used it's likely that if they run dry that they will gall even if they are hardened. But if one surface is hard and the other is soft the surfaces resist galling naturally.

The same will be true of stainless alloys for the most part. But the guy was right that if the alloys are not wisely chosen that they can gall much easier.
 
"...He was a machinist..." That doesn't mean much. Not all machinists are smithies. Apparently, he knows little or nothing about SS. It ain't all the same.
 
KImber Stainless 2

1200 rounds in

No galling issues.

I haven't heard of galling issues since the late 80/90's.

If you read older paper books about gunsmithing , this issue is a significant topic of discussion.

I'm 36 years old, it's about as much of an issue today as using unleaded gasoline with respect to valve surfaces.

That's my thoughts, cheers
 
Last edited:
Galling is often seen on the locking lugs of rifles that are not greased from time to time. It is most common on stainless rifles.
I have a small pot of moly grease (in a 35mm film can) that I use to lube rifle lugs each time the trifle is cleaned.

I carry a small tube of grease in an old glue stik container in my range kit, just in case lube is needed.

I have never seen a problem in handguns, but the rails of an auto tend to be lubed from time to time, anyway. That is all it takes.
 
Thanks everyone for your input on this. I strongly suspect that much progress has been made on this issue. I used to be a much talked about topic in gun magazines years ago but I would think it would be addressed by now.
Thanks again.
 
BCRider said:
I'm sure ATF would do fine on stainless as well. The trick is to apply it frequently enough that the rails never go dry. And the thing with any light body oil like ATF is that it doesn't tend to stay in one place what with all the motion and back pressure puffs from the firing. But as long as the ATF is applied often enough to ensure that the slides never run dry it should be fine.

I'm just not that good at it so I tend to go with a thin smear of grease applied with a small toothbrush. I'll use oil at the range if I find the slides are quite dry but at home I prefer to lube the slides with a smear of synthetic grease.

Stainless steel alloys have come a long way. If the alloys are correctly chosen for use on a gun the risk of galling is greatly reduced. I'm not sure if it's reduced to the same risk level as carbon steels but it's certainly much better than the guy at the store said. But in my reading about guns over the last few years since getting into the sport I've seen some references to early semis not using the optimum alloys and having the slides gall badly.

It's not a case of just picking one alloy either. The COMBINATION of the two sliding surfaces have to be compatible if the frame and slide are made from different alloys. This can often be the case in carbon steels as well. In those cases it's pretty well documented that if two carbon steel surfaces of the same hardness are used it's likely that if they run dry that they will gall even if they are hardened. But if one surface is hard and the other is soft the surfaces resist galling naturally.

The same will be true of stainless alloys for the most part. But the guy was right that if the alloys are not wisely chosen that they can gall much easier.
Click to expand...

What grease are you using? I have tried a couple but haven't found any I really like.

John
 
I've put literally thousands of rounds through my old stainless Hardballer over the last 24 years without a single issue but I have always used RIG gun grease. A gunsmith friend suggested it when I bought the gun and I use it now in all my guns.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom