generic hunting reloads

jiffydawg

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pretty new to reloading and have been having good success with my 308.

picked up a tikka 300wsm for my new hunting rig and have a few loaded up starting at the low end of the scale

my question is i have never come across any generic reloads ie something that would be productive enough in most given firearms...

both me and my friend shoot 300wsm and can go to the store and but a box of winchester, remington whatever that will work well enough for most hunters. i understand trying to get the most out of a rifle but kinda surprised no one says that 63.6gr H4350 with a 180ttsx will mimic x brand factory load and be safe to shoot in most rifles.
 
You can't really mimic a factory load since although the brass, primer and case may be the same they do not use canister powders but rather bulk powders not available to handloaders. This being said the performance of a given cartridge can be matched or in some cases exceeded ( see 7x57 or 280 Remington) and tuned to an individual rifle. Modern factory ammunition is very good but carefully constructed handloads will be better in a given rifle.
 
Generic load. In theory, the START load in the manual should work in all rifles - but I know of one rifle where the START load blows the primer and the bolt has to be pounded open.

If you don't want to do a lot of load development, load 3 each, in 0.5 gr increments, starting with the START load and shoot them off sandbags. Let barrel cool after each 3 shots.

If you find any hint of a sticky bolt life, back off a half grain.

If they all extract fine, use the load with the best group and call it done.
 
The ammo makers try to stick to a honey load, but it doesn't work for every gun equally. Rifle have different harmonics for heavy barrels verses light barrels, long barrels, short barrels, bedded receivers, and new barrel verses old and worn barrels.

From over 40 years of loading, I find the honey spot is somewhere between the 60 to 80% max load for accuracy. Just because its faster does not mean it shoots better. I start my ladder loads at 50% and up.

If you want to make a post looking for the best load for your rifle, make an inquiry with what model rifle you own and what barrel length you have, and anything that makes your rifle different. Someone here has the same rifle and has already done the work and test shooting.
 
The ammo makers try to stick to a honey load, but it doesn't work for every gun equally. Rifle have different harmonics for heavy barrels verses light barrels, long barrels, short barrels, bedded receivers, and new barrel verses old and worn barrels.

From over 40 years of loading, I find the honey spot is somewhere between the 60 to 80% max load for accuracy. Just because its faster does not mean it shoots better. I start my ladder loads at 50% and up.

If you want to make a post looking for the best load for your rifle, make an inquiry with what model rifle you own and what barrel length you have, and anything that makes your rifle different. Someone here has the same rifle and has already done the work and test shooting.


My opinions and your opinions are certainly different! My number one opinion on such matters is a good barrel, with the action and barrel properly bedded, will shoot any good ammunition very well. Some rifles, such as many Tikka's are designed to shoot best with a floating barrel, but probably the majority of sporting rifles out there shoot best with pressure under the barrel at the front of the stock. This greatly reduces the vibrations caused by the bullet going down the barrel, thus doing away with much of those, often mythical, nodes and such that people on here talk about that they are often searching for.
With any new to me rifle I acquire I sight it to be on the paper at 100, then get the best, most solid bench type rest I can get and fire five shots, one after the other, so the barrel heats up. I don't even take the time to spot my shots, because I want the barrel to heat up.
In a great many cases the pattern will string, maybe due north, or SW or NE, as the barrel heats up. Any stringy is a sign of the barrel receiving uneven pressure. Next step is to free float the barrel by sanding out the wood where it was hitting and try the same five shot, hot barrel test.
The stringing now may end, but the group is likely considerably larger than we want, as the barrel heats, so next step is to put a temporary block, maybe even thicker paper folded, until when placed under the barrel and the action screws tightened back up, it will take quite a pressure, like maybe six pounds on a spring scale, to move the barrel off the temporary block. When the block is adjusted for the best groups we can get, a permanent block will be put in and away you go to shoot.
This whole thing I am talking about I learned from good, old time competitive rifle shooters and it is exactly the procedure that was used by the world class benchrest shooters of yester-year.
The old time benchrest shooters of years gone by also loaded their rifles to above normal pressure, even for 100 yard shooting. I know this, because it is in a book written by a bench rest shooter who won the National Match Championship nine different years and who is often referred to as the worlds greatest rifleman, ever, Warren Page.
Thus, when I load for accuracy, my loads are loaded to the top of what the rifle will comfortably handle, whether it is above what is listed in the manuals as "maximum" loads, or not. Like what is stated in a previous thread, I load until there is a touch of the bolt sticking, then I slack off a half gain or so.
 
thanks for all the imput guys appreciate it

i guess more along my thinking would be something that gave adaquate performance but if a buddy say lost his ammo along the way could safely run your reloads through his savage with a quick re-zero and little safety concerns
 
My opinions and your opinions are certainly different! My number one opinion on such matters is a good barrel, with the action and barrel properly bedded, will shoot any good ammunition very well. Some rifles, such as many Tikka's are designed to shoot best with a floating barrel, but probably the majority of sporting rifles out there shoot best with pressure under the barrel at the front of the stock. This greatly reduces the vibrations caused by the bullet going down the barrel, thus doing away with much of those, often mythical, nodes and such that people on here talk about that they are often searching for.
With any new to me rifle I acquire I sight it to be on the paper at 100, then get the best, most solid bench type rest I can get and fire five shots, one after the other, so the barrel heats up. I don't even take the time to spot my shots, because I want the barrel to heat up.
In a great many cases the pattern will string, maybe due north, or SW or NE, as the barrel heats up. Any stringy is a sign of the barrel receiving uneven pressure. Next step is to free float the barrel by sanding out the wood where it was hitting and try the same five shot, hot barrel test.
The stringing now may end, but the group is likely considerably larger than we want, as the barrel heats, so next step is to put a temporary block, maybe even thicker paper folded, until when placed under the barrel and the action screws tightened back up, it will take quite a pressure, like maybe six pounds on a spring scale, to move the barrel off the temporary block. When the block is adjusted for the best groups we can get, a permanent block will be put in and away you go to shoot.
This whole thing I am talking about I learned from good, old time competitive rifle shooters and it is exactly the procedure that was used by the world class benchrest shooters of yester-year.
The old time benchrest shooters of years gone by also loaded their rifles to above normal pressure, even for 100 yard shooting. I know this, because it is in a book written by a bench rest shooter who won the National Match Championship nine different years and who is often referred to as the worlds greatest rifleman, ever, Warren Page.
Thus, when I load for accuracy, my loads are loaded to the top of what the rifle will comfortably handle, whether it is above what is listed in the manuals as "maximum" loads, or not. Like what is stated in a previous thread, I load until there is a touch of the bolt sticking, then I slack off a half gain or so.


Well there you go. Not only your opinion is different that mine, you've read and responded to something completely different than what the original question was. The nice fellow was simply asking why it seems hard to find a generic load for his rifle. Go back and read the crap that you wrote and see if you answered his question? or made him more confused. Its responses like yours here that make people run away. Not everyone here wants to be a precision custom loader. Why don't you delete it and speak in terms that not only answer the simple question, but also that any new reloader can understand?
 
thanks for all the imput guys appreciate it

I guess more along my thinking would be something that gave adequate performance but if a buddy say lost his ammo along the way could safely run your reloads through his savage with a quick re-zero and little safety concerns

No. Not at all.

If his ammo is neck sized, it might not even chamber in another rifle.

If the bullet is seated long, it could stick in the rifling.

If it was made for a rifle with a deeper throat or larger bore, it could be dangerously over pressure in your rifle.

In summary, handholds are made for ONE rifle.

If buddy left his ammo at home, he gets to shoot his, or someone else's back up rifle.
 
Well fiddler, if you read my post, I guess you completely failed to comprehend it. Sorry I went over your head.
It was you I was replying to, the reason I quoted your post and not the post of the OP. And here is what I was relying to:

Originally Posted by fiddler View Post

"The ammo makers try to stick to a honey load, but it doesn't work for every gun equally. Rifle have different harmonics for heavy barrels verses light barrels, long barrels, short barrels, bedded receivers, and new barrel verses old and worn barrels.

From over 40 years of loading, I find the honey spot is somewhere between the 60 to 80% max load for accuracy. Just because its faster does not mean it shoots better. I start my ladder loads at 50% and up."

I thought I pointed out plainly, that a honey load, a load that was supposed to do wonders for that particular rifle, was a bit of a myth and if you properly tuned your rifle it would largely do away with the vibration and shoot any good load very well.
I thought I also adequately and decisively answered your statement about the most accurate loads being between 50 to 80% of full power loads.
Most importantly, I tried to be very polite and refrained from calling your views anything but a difference of opinion to mine.
I did not get personal, nor say anything derogative about you or your writing, while you made the following slurs and personal attack on me, such as,

" Go back and read the crap that you wrote--"
"Its responses like yours here that make people run away"
"Why don't you delete it and speak in terms that not only answer the simple question, but also that any new reloader can understand?"
 
thanks for all the imput guys appreciate it

i guess more along my thinking would be something that gave adaquate performance but if a buddy say lost his ammo along the way could safely run your reloads through his savage with a quick re-zero and little safety concerns

It is possible to do, but to be safe you would need to use a very low powder chage, fl resize and make sure to seat the bullet in to minium sammi spec. It really wouldn't be worth it performance wise and there would still be an inherent risk.
 
I would like to thank H4831 for a usefull post, possibly a little off the original subject but very informative for a relatively new reloader like myself.. To answer the original question I remember 30 years ago seeing a recipe for reloading AA trapshot to factory specs. In my limited reading and online reshearch into rifle reloading I have never seen a similar recipe for rifle ammo. As to your next question on reloading for you and your buddy. I have 2 savage "99s" in 30-30 and have reloaded. I took all my once or twice fired brass and reloaded it only to find that some of it will only chamber in one rifle.
 
Generic loads as in one size fits all is a tough job. On the other hand, one size sorta fits most is within reach, at least for emergency use. For instance we know my son can use my .257 Weatherby and .300 Win ammo in a pinch. The .300s make his rifle into a single shot, but beggars can't be choosers.

A 30-06 that doesn't shoot a 180 with IMR or H4350 at least as well as randomly selected factory ammo is a pretty rare cat. My bullet test load for for the 30-06 was Varget and 165ish bullets. Worked in 4 different rifles well enough for several hundred animals. Likewise a .270 that won't work with 130s and H4831, or a .300 Win that fails to deliver with H1000, RL22 or 7828. How about H335 in a .223 or H380 and H & IMR4895 in a 22/250? Hedge your bets with simple cup and core flat based bullets and keep the COL around SAMMI so it will fit in everyone's mag. This isn't the place to try to wring the last fps out of a cartridge, and someone will likely have to settle for good enough. Everything has to be full-length sized. For years I loaded 7 Rems for several friends. They all got the same load and nobody complained. 154 Hornadys and IMR 4350 by the way.
 
I reload for 2 Savage bolt actions 7mm-08’s. The ammunition loaded for my rifle will fit my son’s, however…

[ My rifle has a smaller chamber but longer throat. This determined with hornady comparator/headspace tools and verified using Mystic’s masking tape tests. I bump my shoulders back .002 more and for .020 bullet jump seat .003 longer than my son’s rifle.]

… I would use ammunition for my rifle in my sons in a pinch IF we are running similar tested recipe’s in terms of bullets and powder type and charge weights. The plan here is to develop hunting loads using the same components/charges for each rifle and test. There will be a difference obviously with the most accurate charge weight for each rifle, but if my charges are less than his (very similar loads), then I wouldn’t hesitate…pending range testing to confirm.


My two cents.
To note:
- Sophomore reloader sharing the situation here.
- Learned/solved reloading process issues from the experienced guys as stated above.


Whatever these guys, H4831, Ganderite, and to add a not yet present member Eagleeye......say.

When in doubt go with guys that have powder magazines with more powder than any three gun stores, have reloaded for decades, have shot anything that walks or flys with their loads.

^^^ yes.

"Ganderite

Originally Posted by thepolinator
It is possible to do, but to be safe you would need to use a very low powder chage, fl resize and make sure to seat the bullet in to minium sammi spec. It really wouldn't be worth it performance wise and there would still be an inherent risk.
^^ Exactly" Endquote Ganderite

Regards
Ron
 
Thanks guys, for your support.
Regarding the original question by the OP, it should be very easy to have a go to, generic hand load for any rifle in any normal calibre.
Every rifle out there with a proof mark has been tested for 20% over loads, for that calibre and they are all designed to handle standard factory loads. All you do is load up a common bullet weight, for the calibre, to about the velocity it was designed to go. A 30-30 with 170 grain flat nose, or rounded bullets, was designed for 2200 fps, but 2100 is more realistic. If you have access to a chronograph you just load up the 30-30 with suitable and common powders, such as 3031, 4895 or 4320, until you get that velocity. Seat the bullet exactly like the same bullet is seated in factory loads and there is your generic load.
The same theory adapts for any calibre.
 
Somewhat exactly what H4831 just said, and at the same time bass ackwards of the OP's question.

I have a 300 Rum. Rifle was rechambered, originally being a 300wm. The Magazine box is long enough for generic factory loads...just. So since its next to impossible to find virgin or 1F 300 Rum, i have taken to buying "cheap" 300 Rum factory to use as general hunting rounds and for the brass. My standard load for this rifle mimics these factory loads, which of course are still much more powerful than the original 300 wm. But, the 300 Rum comes into its own as a calibre that carries large projectiles for long distance hunting. So i have developed a over length load, too long for the magazine box, for long distance shots. Must be loaded single shot.

This is the beauty of handloading, tayloring specific loads for specific rifles. One looses this by trying for generic loads; in that case all you are doing is making ok ammo that is cost effective, not necessarily superior.
 
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