Great Uncle gave me a .303!

heliwrench

heliwrench

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UPDATE post 44 (pg 5)! - Hunting Success with the .303!

Went hunting with my great-uncle and he gave me this .303 as well as my great grandfathers childhood cooey 22!

Some questions for you lee enfield guys:

So it was made in 1916?

BSA is burlington amll arms co?

was it made for the war or for sale to public?

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Here is the stock. The butt and grip have pads made by churchill gunmkers of london. anyone know any history on these pads and stock?

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What do you guys think of the condition?

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Are these good holes to mount a scope with?

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Thanks!
 
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Fixit said:
looks great, those family heirlooms are always my most treasured firearms.

yes those holes are to mount a scope base to.


happy shooting
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Ya. it was so cool to plink with the same gun my great grandfather (he left quebec and set up a farm near wainwright alberta) shot as a young man.

As my great uncle said........."ahhhh if only all those gophers I shot could be here now"
 
That's a Lee-Enfield No1 MkIII*. It was originally built as a military rifle with full-wood stock and it's undergone FTR (Factory Thorough Repair) at some point in it's service life. After it left military service it was commercially converted into a sporting rifle.

IIRC, a 1916 BSA (Birmingham Small Arms) SMLE would have been produced in the MkIII variant. That means it would have originally have a magazine cut-off before being updated to the MkIII* pattern.
 
Some newwwwwbie ????:
I am starting to really like this whole mil surp thing :)
What does the mag cut off do?

Any idea of how to find out what theater of the war it was in?
 
The mag cut-off blocks the rounds in the magazine and you single load the rifle. It was pre-war doctrine to reduce ammunition "wastage".

It could have served from the Far East to Africa to Europe, or it may have never left England. There's no way to tell.
 
That's what uncles are for.

Converted to a sporting arm by Churchill, who generally did good work of this sort, it is not what we commonly refer to as a "bubba".
 
From the pics, this rifle really looks like a Parker-Hale Sporter rifle. These were made up by BSA and sold by Parker-Hale.
They could have come with either a 5 shot or the standard 10 shot magazines. This particular one looks to me (well, the pictures don't show enough) like a "Supreme" model (an No. 1??).

Not all sporters are bubba"s job.... some are somewhat valuable as collectors.

Some were also commercialized as Curchill.

P-H also converted P-14 and M17 by cutting the ears, re-heat treating them, and installing them in new or salvaged from military stocks. The military stock were cut and given checkering, thgough.

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The holes are for a Weaver TO-1 scope base. An easy to find base if you want to scope it.
 
Baribal said:
P-H also converted P-14 and M17 by cutting the ears, re-heat treating them, and installing them in new or salvaged from military stocks. The military stock were cut and given checkering, thgough.
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Effectively making them not unlike the Winchester sporting rifle that came out based on the P17 (I forget the model number).
 
THATS AWESOME
MY UNCLE IS A POT SMOKING HIPPE THAT HATES GUNS.
You can pick your friends, you can pick your nose, but you can't pick your family.
 
Riflechair said:
THATS AWESOME
MY UNCLE IS A POT SMOKING HIPPE THAT HATES GUNS.
You can pick your friends, you can pick your nose, but you can't pick your family.
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HAHAHA!

So I am thinking of putting an appropriate scope that fits with the churchill sportsterization.

What set up do you guys think would be historically appropriate.

What year(s) do you think the sports mods would have/ could have been done by churchill?

Thanks for all the information!

Marc
 
Many so-called "Babba'd" SMLE were in fact factory refurbs. These also have an historical value; they are the hi-power rifles our ancestor could afford to buy. I remember those days when every farmer got a L-E in the basement, and this was not 50 years ago....
Now, a lot of yesterday's country have become big city.

While not really easy to know for a newbie, Bubba's job may look quite a bit like the "real" B.S.A. sporting rifles. The more common model found here in Canada, is the Standard No. 1 (see below). But for someone who used to see how well these rifles were crafted it's hard to miss them.

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The Churchill / B.S.A. are stamped "Churchill" on the barrel. The Parker-Hale / B.S.A. have much more variations in "design.

They were available after WWII, from the very early '50's to the start of the '60s. A small run of modified No. 1 from WWI did see light, same as the No.1 Standard Model, about 1925-1930 and these were made in cnada from military left-over stock.

The correct scope for the time of your rifle would be something like a Weaver K series (all steel, not nitrogen filled) or even better a early KV scope. The "K" series was as follow; K1 (1X), K2.5 (2.5X), K3 (3X), K4 (4X), KV (3-5X), K6, K8 and K10. The cheapest one was 44.00 $ and the most expensive was 76.25 $. In those days a high-end rifle like the M-S model "GK" or "MC" were 189.00 $... and the high-end Weatherby 379.00 $....
But originally, the people who bought the Standard P-H models did not have the money to spend in scoping a "work" guns, they simply used the iron sights. Thos more fortunate usaully had Mauser rifles. I suspect your rifle was scoped in the '70s or maybe end of '60s when the scopes were a bit more affordable for "common people". The pre-"60s scope mounts made for L-E rifles were mostly of the side mount type (as shown below).
Some guys like Ellwood Eps contributed a lot in the democratization of the tecnologies applyed to firearms.

This is your rifle (or a very similar model, either Churchill or P-H) with the correct scope on it, circa 1960
elwoodepps1960p32.jpg
 
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By the look of it I have the Deluxe #4. I never realized it was professionally done. I knew it was very nice work, but thought it was a Bubba. Thanks Guys!:)
Not that I'd ever sell it, but any idea what they're worth? I'd like to bug my buddy that I bought it from.
 
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