Had a issue today with my WK

beltfed said:
You blew 203 primers and you plan to shoot it some more?
Sounds to me like you should stop while you are ahead and contact the rifle manufacturer.
If it is having that much trouble digesting factory ammo, I’d suspect an issue with the chamber and/or headspace.
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Sorry. 2-3 primers. Not 203.
 
The thing here seems to Hornady brass cased ammo seems to be fine with these rifles. I've seen this behavior before with Hornady Superformance and Kel tec RFBS; my suspect is soft primers.
 
Firstly these are newly manufactured rifles with a warranty, please contact Kodiak defence if you have a problem, we do not expect you to have to fix a problem yourself.

Secondly if you have trouble chambering a round, STOP. Could be a foreign object in the chamber (I had it happen to me with a hunting rifles when a tiny piece of plastic from the cartridge packet was stuck to the round) If you force a round into the chamber you may have a catastrophic failure, something that should be avoided.

I have just had a discussion with Steve at Kodiak and have learnt the following.

In order to source enough chamber reamers (.223 Wylde) Kodiak sourced them from more than one manufacture. All reamers give correct head space but as .223 Wylde is a “new” caliber there are no SAMI specifications for the chamber. We are now seeing that some chambers are “tighter” than others and this is why we are seeing some problems with some ammo. Unfortunately we do not know which rifles were chambered with which reamers.

If you are experiencing any issues at all, please stop shooting with any “suspect ammo” and contact Service@Kodiakdefence.com
 
Mr Wolverine said:
Firstly these are newly manufactured rifles with a warranty, please contact Kodiak defence if you have a problem, we do not expect you to have to fix a problem yourself.

Secondly if you have trouble chambering a round, STOP. Could be a foreign object in the chamber (I had it happen to me with a hunting rifles when a tiny piece of plastic from the cartridge packet was stuck to the round) If you force a round into the chamber you may have a catastrophic failure, something that should be avoided.

I have just had a discussion with Steve at Kodiak and have learnt the following.

In order to source enough chamber reamers (.223 Wylde) Kodiak sourced them from more than one manufacture. All reamers give correct head space but as .223 Wylde is a “new” caliber there are no SAMI specifications for the chamber. We are now seeing that some chambers are “tighter” than others and this is why we are seeing some problems with some ammo. Unfortunately we do not know which rifles were chambered with which reamers.

If you are experiencing any issues at all, please stop shooting with any “suspect ammo” and contact Service@Kodiakdefence.com
Click to expand...

I will concede that I don't know much about the chamber dimensions of .223 Wylde, but I can't reconcile these two comments.

1) All reamers give correct head space
2) some chambers are “tighter” than others and this is why we are seeing some problems with some ammo

Based on the photos provided above, and given that the issues is common across firearms with a particular ammo manufacturer, I am confident it IS in fact an ammo issue. But that said, if all your reamers have correct head space, what variation is there in the reamers that causes some of them to be "tight" and therefore experiencing issues? What dimension on some of the ammo is causing the problem, if not head space? Is the diameter at the case body, or case neck? Something else?

I have two of these on order. Have all of the barrels for the next two thousand rifles been made? Now that you know about the issue, what can be done? How will I know if my rifles are right or loose when they show up?

I will reload for this rifle eventually, so measuring fired brass shouldn't be an issue. Is it possible to get the dimensions of the chamber reamer or of the intended chamber dimensions for reloading purposes? You mention there is no SAMI specs. Thats fine, but can we get YOUR specs?

Should I just avoid a certain type of ammo? I'm fine if thats the case, but it would be nice to know it definitively?

Just curious what the resolution might be. Still Can't wait to get these rifles.
 
Mr Wolverine said:
Firstly these are newly manufactured rifles with a warranty, please contact Kodiak defence if you have a problem, we do not expect you to have to fix a problem yourself.

Secondly if you have trouble chambering a round, STOP. Could be a foreign object in the chamber (I had it happen to me with a hunting rifles when a tiny piece of plastic from the cartridge packet was stuck to the round) If you force a round into the chamber you may have a catastrophic failure, something that should be avoided.

I have just had a discussion with Steve at Kodiak and have learnt the following.

In order to source enough chamber reamers (.223 Wylde) Kodiak sourced them from more than one manufacture. All reamers give correct head space but as .223 Wylde is a “new” caliber there are no SAMI specifications for the chamber. We are now seeing that some chambers are “tighter” than others and this is why we are seeing some problems with some ammo. Unfortunately we do not know which rifles were chambered with which reamers.

If you are experiencing any issues at all, please stop shooting with any “suspect ammo” and contact Service@Kodiakdefence.com
Click to expand...

Just going by a visual inspection of my fired brass I would say the chamber is on the tight side. There is virtually no visible expansion of my brass. I'll measure some fired and unfired rounds when I get a chance
 
Could someone educate me as to why they would chamber this in 223 Wylde over 5.56? I've shot a lot of .223 out of rifles chambed in 5.56. Have I been doing something wrong?
 
I just went back and looked at my last couple boxes of brass after reading this.

Federal AE 62 grain seems OK (some slight cratering) but the S&B 69gr HPBT has 15 of the 20 rounds with primers as you show. The cases are marked 5.56 but box says 223 rem.
They did not seem tight - I did not have to push the bolt or touch it and all rounds ejected fine.

My firing pin looks OK at the tip, it has a couple of rough spots where it changes diameter, I assume it probably touches the inside of the bolt at those spots.

My upper 'just' arrived at Kodiak so I'll have them check the chamber out while it is there.


 
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Cameron SS said:
I will concede that I don't know much about the chamber dimensions of .223 Wylde, but I can't reconcile these two comments.

1) All reamers give correct head space
2) some chambers are “tighter” than others and this is why we are seeing some problems with some ammo

Based on the photos provided above, and given that the issues is common across firearms with a particular ammo manufacturer, I am confident it IS in fact an ammo issue. But that said, if all your reamers have correct head space, what variation is there in the reamers that causes some of them to be "tight" and therefore experiencing issues? What dimension on some of the ammo is causing the problem, if not head space? Is the diameter at the case body, or case neck? Something else?

I have two of these on order. Have all of the barrels for the next two thousand rifles been made? Now that you know about the issue, what can be done? How will I know if my rifles are right or loose when they show up?

I will reload for this rifle eventually, so measuring fired brass shouldn't be an issue. Is it possible to get the dimensions of the chamber reamer or of the intended chamber dimensions for reloading purposes? You mention there is no SAMI specs. Thats fine, but can we get YOUR specs?

Should I just avoid a certain type of ammo? I'm fine if thats the case, but it would be nice to know it definitively?

Just curious what the resolution might be. Still Can't wait to get these rifles.
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I am not an engineer, this is the situation as I understand it.


Headspace is measured from the bolt face to a datum point on the case shoulder with bottle neck cartridges like the .223. the exact location of that point varies from one type of cartridge to another.

All WK180-C rifles have their head spaced checked before leaving Kodiak

When headspace is set correctly, there is a tiny bit of extra length in the chamber to accommodate the slight variations in cartridge length that occur in even the most rigorously manufactured commercial ammunition.

Head space gauges are manufactured undersize in that they do not contact the chamber wall that could give a false reading.

The chamber dimensions are what the reamer manufacture produces their reamer to and when the headspace is correct.

We have a situation where some chambers are tight with some ammo.

Now Kodiak are aware of this situation I can assure you that all future rifles will be correct.

At this point I must refer any customers who have problems or concerns, please take it up with Kodiak as they are the experts in this area, not me.
 
Mr Wolverine said:
I am not an engineer, this is the situation as I understand it.


Headspace is measured from the bolt face to a datum point on the case shoulder with bottle neck cartridges like the .223. the exact location of that point varies from one type of cartridge to another.

All WK180-C rifles have their head spaced checked before leaving Kodiak

When headspace is set correctly, there is a tiny bit of extra length in the chamber to accommodate the slight variations in cartridge length that occur in even the most rigorously manufactured commercial ammunition.

Head space gauges are manufactured undersize in that they do not contact the chamber wall that could give a false reading.

The chamber dimensions are what the reamer manufacture produces their reamer to and when the headspace is correct.

We have a situation where some chambers are tight with some ammo.

Now Kodiak are aware of this situation I can assure you that all future rifles will be correct.

At this point I must refer any customers who have problems or concerns, please take it up with Kodiak as they are the experts in this area, not me.
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That all sounds great. I have complete confidence in Wolverine and Kodiak.

Is there any way we can get a reference or resource that you or Kodiak can provide on the chamber dimensions that were used for this firearm? Or should I just wait until I can measure the brass that comes out of mine when I get it?
 
Cameron SS said:
That all sounds great. I have complete confidence in Wolverine and Kodiak.

Is there any way we can get a reference or resource that you or Kodiak can provide on the chamber dimensions that were used for this firearm? Or should I just wait until I can measure the brass that comes out of mine when I get it?
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Right now I would recommend you just wait and measure the brass.
 
jza said:
Could someone educate me as to why they would chamber this in 223 Wylde over 5.56? I've shot a lot of .223 out of rifles chambed in 5.56. Have I been doing something wrong?
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To my limited knowledge the .223 Wylde is a "best of both worlds" middle ground sort of idea between .223 Remington and 5.56x45mm NATO chamberings.

It's usually more accurate than the standard mil-spec 5.56mm offerings while still being able to stand the higher pressure loads found in the military cartridge.


As far as the doing of anything wrong it's just important to know which cartridge runs which way as far as chamber pressure.
5.56x45mm runs at a higher pressure than the commercial .223 typically, so you're typically fine to go that way since the commercial rounds aren't creating as much "stress" on the action as the 5.56mm rounds would.

.308 WIN on the other hand, the commercial cartridge runs higher than the standardized 7.62x51mm NATO, so a bit more research may be involved going that direction, but the 7.62x51 in the .308 chamber goes about the same as .223 in the 5.56mm chamberings.

Worst case a trip to someone with go/no-go gauges usually can't hurt.

My experience with the dimensionally comparable cartridges are fairly limited to just being my T97 and M305.
 
I've had ammo issues with cheap 5.56 in an AR15. I have a lot of brass cased Norinco that a family member gave me for free. I fired it alot in cooler weather with no problems and then went to the range on a 30+ degree day in mid-August. The rifle jammed after a few mags (not closing the bolt all the way) and I discovered a loose primer in the barrel extension. Upon checking my fired brass I found that 10% had no primer left in them. I assume that Norinco uses cheap powder that turned out to be very temperature sensitive. Hornady's ammo may have a high-performance powder in it that is temp sensitive; I don't know.

I've also had a Federal Gold Medal Match primer fail on the corner in my 300WM, cutting a divot on my bolt face. Once out of 500 of those primers so far. A match-grade primer with an inclusion in the brass; it happens. I also locked up a Mauser 96 (to the point where the head expansion made the case look like it had a belt on it) when I didn't trim my brass...the neck pinched the bullet and pressures skyrocketed.

Long story short, in my experience, ammo issues are much more common than rifle problems. A "tight" chamber where the brass sits is not common but a short throat can be. Especially with all the different 5.56, 223 Rem, and 223 Wylde chamber out there.
 
Seems like if you want a reasonably priced semi auto 5.56 that is reliable with common ammo you need to buy chinese lol. Hopefully as they work out the chamber issues these guns become 100% reliable with common ammo. Looking forward to trying one out in the future.
 
I do not believe there are any issues with my rifle and think that my blown/pierced primers are from the Hornady varmint express55gr vmax. I contacted Hornady customer Service in Nebraska and they told me this ammo is actually designed for a bolt gun with a minimum 20” barrel. Not sure if I believe that but they are contacting Korth and I am to call Korth tomorrow morning and was told they will make it right with me.
 
jiffx2781 said:
You should NEVER have to force a round into baterry. And if you do you should NEVER fire it.
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I learned the hard way and had a norc jw105 blow into pieces in my hands. Aside from being scared ####less and some very small cuts on my face, I was fine.
I was fairly lucky.
 
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