Hardcast Lead for .45-70
- Thread starter baldtop
- Start date
- Location
- AB foothills
Another vote for the Bullet Barn.
M.T.Chambers......mtchambers@skvelocity.ca.......I don't know if its called 45/70 journal or"supreme handloads for the 45/70" but it is a journal published by Canadian B. Mitchell of Lindsey Ont.....he packs alot of top end reloading data into the journal....with test results.....very experienced shooter/reloader/ballistician......a must read for anyone interested in top end loads for the 45/70.....loads that nip at the heels of the .458 Win.....breaks loads down into 3 catagories...Ruger #1....Marlin'95.....Nef....I have a recent copy of the journal if you need more info!
Chris: The Reverend Bob Mitchell is not on computer: 13 Orchard Dr.
R.R.1
Lindsay, Ont.
Canada K9V 4r1
From his manual: For Ruger #1 only:using AA2015 and 500gr...2200fps
for Marlin '95 using H335 and 465gr.Chambers...1920 fps
for NEF usingRL-7 and 465gr. Chambers...1816fps...35000CUP (with 1" groups)
I don't include the actual charges as it is right up there and I don't want to include pages of disclaimers, however....some of these loads have been pressure tested by Accurate Arms....and pressure limits (for Marlin) are similar to the .450 Marlin in the same rifle.(45/70 produces less pressure for same loads)
R.R.1
Lindsay, Ont.
Canada K9V 4r1
From his manual: For Ruger #1 only:using AA2015 and 500gr...2200fps
for Marlin '95 using H335 and 465gr.Chambers...1920 fps
for NEF usingRL-7 and 465gr. Chambers...1816fps...35000CUP (with 1" groups)
I don't include the actual charges as it is right up there and I don't want to include pages of disclaimers, however....some of these loads have been pressure tested by Accurate Arms....and pressure limits (for Marlin) are similar to the .450 Marlin in the same rifle.(45/70 produces less pressure for same loads)
"supreme loads in the 45/70
Further to my last post.....B. Mitchell lists these loads and their vel., press., trajectory, as well as their Taylor Knockout Values. I think the one overriding theme is that.....loaded properly with well constructed heavy jacketed or hard cast(properly sized) bullets with high BC(for penetration)...the 45/70 is still the KING......Some Taylor values listed are double that of a 300 win mag.....He also touches on a subject that comes up alot on this board....Cast bullets,properly done,sized .001 over bore size, x-hard w/gas check, are not for just plinking....they are suitable for all large and dagerous game as is the 45/70!!!
All I can add is that heat treating cast bullets tends to make them brittle and that would take them out of this cat......MT Chambers uses lots of tin to harden bullets....matching tin % to vel. to produce bullets that will/will not expand as per customers request.
Further to my last post.....B. Mitchell lists these loads and their vel., press., trajectory, as well as their Taylor Knockout Values. I think the one overriding theme is that.....loaded properly with well constructed heavy jacketed or hard cast(properly sized) bullets with high BC(for penetration)...the 45/70 is still the KING......Some Taylor values listed are double that of a 300 win mag.....He also touches on a subject that comes up alot on this board....Cast bullets,properly done,sized .001 over bore size, x-hard w/gas check, are not for just plinking....they are suitable for all large and dagerous game as is the 45/70!!!
All I can add is that heat treating cast bullets tends to make them brittle and that would take them out of this cat......MT Chambers uses lots of tin to harden bullets....matching tin % to vel. to produce bullets that will/will not expand as per customers request.
I've used Bullet Barn 405gr triple-groove bullets, pushed to 2000fsp with minimal leading. Drop it to 1750fps, and there' no leading whatsoever.
You might also want to track down the Remington jacketed generic .458 bullets, like these guys (US site):
http://lockstock.com/products.asp?dept=174
If you can find them in Canada (try Higginsons), the price should be comprable - not too much more than a high-end cast bullet. Stick to cast for plinkers, and jacketed for full-house loads. You won't rip through a hundred 2000fps 400gr loads in any great hurry, I assure you
You might also want to track down the Remington jacketed generic .458 bullets, like these guys (US site):
http://lockstock.com/products.asp?dept=174
If you can find them in Canada (try Higginsons), the price should be comprable - not too much more than a high-end cast bullet. Stick to cast for plinkers, and jacketed for full-house loads. You won't rip through a hundred 2000fps 400gr loads in any great hurry, I assure you
There's that line again....."stick to cast for plinkers and jacketed for full-house loads" alot of very knowledgeable shooters would disagree.......most jacketed bullets lack the S.D. to be reliable on large game...combine that with soft lead and thin jackets(in 45/70)....the line should say"stick to 450+grs,Wide Flat Nose, gas check, hard cast bullets in the 45/70 and save the piddly,short, jacketed bullets for plinking"!!
ben hunchak said:
Sorry, but that's crap. The SD only involves calibre and weight, not construction. Ergo, a 405gr hard cast has EXACTLY the same SD as the Remington 405gr jacketed - AND the jacketed will expand unlike the hard cast.
But at the speeds we're talking about, the jacket does NOT seperate, it mushrooms beautifully. You don't NEED a premium bullet to mushroom properly, ESPECIALLY at the speeds we're talking about here. Especially if you use a 500gr soft nose jacketed designed for the 458..
And as a side note - a properly motivated 350gr jacketed soft nose will through-and-through a moose.
And as a side note - a properly motivated 350gr jacketed soft nose will through-and-through a moose.
