Has anyone ever truly needed the fast follow up of a semi?

In the last couple years, I did pick up a european 30-06 semi auto. And I like it ....funny thing is in the past, I have only carried out multiple shots on deer ONCE with my remington 788. I did get deer with last and fourth shot and a clean kill I must add. This past season i used the heirloom my Dads 30-30 Winchester Carbine. And I only needed one shot for that buck. The semi is just a personal choice because I can. I do not blast away for the sake of emptying this rifle. I always try for one shot, for one clean harvest of deer.
I will not pick a fight with anyone over their personal choice, to me that is like insulting one anothers spouses, on what they were out at a fancy restarant.
That is all......
 
I guess it truly depends on where in Canada you hunt because I can honestly say I have never seen somebody use a semi auto for hunting in my parts ever in my life:eek: I saw a pump action .280 once;)

The bolt action 270/3006/etc. is by far the most common hunting weapon in my area.

To use fellas out west in BC a deer drive with semi autos and multiple tags is very diffrent. Not wrong just diffrent. I think its important to understand that there are diffrent hunting methods and regulations all over Canada so it will vary region to region.

A bolt gun and selective harvesting tend to be the way to go for me because I usually only get a crack at a couple deer tags a year and I tend to need my scope and bolt gun to get em.

I could definetly see the usefulness of a semi in a situation where mutilpe deer are presenting shots. I would be hard pressed to get more than one shot away with my bolt gun and scope.
 
The only semis (not used by me) I see her in central NF are .22's and shotguns. Rarley centerfire rifles.
 
mcrae555 said:
I guess it truly depends on where in Canada you hunt because I can honestly say I have never seen somebody use a semi auto for hunting in my parts ever in my life:eek: I saw a pump action .280 once;)
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Funny you should say that but the last two Mulies I took and the last three moose were with a remington 7400 (gasp:eek: )semi in 30-06.yes I own other rifles and even a couple of bolt actions in the same caliber.....just always seem to grab the 7400 (guess its time to rotate the safe stock again...lol):D :D :D
and just to stay on track only one of the moose needed a second shot
 
There has been some mention here of the speed of the various actions in a field situation.

I remember a study reported in one of the major US magazines in the late '60's or early '70's on the speed of the various actions (for AIMED shots). All testing was done with shooters who were considered experts with the type of action used. Timing was done between the report of the first shot to the report of the 5th shot. The actions tested were Autoloader, Pump, Lever and Bolt. All shots were aimed at a target with misses being disqualified.

The average times were:

Auto: 5.4 seconds
Pump: 5.5 seconds
Lever: 5.6 seconds
Bolt: 11.0 seconds

Since the speed factor would really only apply to four shots in each instance (since the first shot took no time at all), I've come up with the following per shot average.

Auto: 1.35 seconds
Pump: 1.375 seconds
Lever: 1.4 seconds
Bolt: 2.75 seconds

So, in essence, the three "quick shooters" are essentially the same if you take the time to aim.

A deer can cover a lot of ground in an additional 1+ seconds if you're hunting the thick stuff like we have in Ontario.

I actually found my over-all shooting improved when I switched to an autoloader. I would guess it was because so many shots are lost to unseen intervening brush in my hunting area and under my type of hunting, that I was anticipating the need to have a second round available if the animal didn't drop right away. Because of this I'd guess I wasn't giving my full attentin to that first shot.

once I began using the auto, I became sure that the second shot would be available, and was able to greatly increase my first shot success rate.

And to answer the original question, YES, I have needed the second shot on many occasions. When you can lose between 25% and 75% of your shots to unseen brush, you can do everything right, and still not kill the deer.
 
Just an aside to this...I found that being a lefty that semi autos are more user friendly because when I am carrying out firing from the prone postition,
(compounded even more offhand)I do not need to change elbow postition. Therefore my sight picture has not changed. I found that using a right handed bolt action invaribly I briefly lost the sight picture as my arms shifted position during reloading. This is not conducive to accurate repeat fire. I know this is subjective, especially if only one shot is required.....which it should be for hunting big game.
 
Rick Teal said:
There has been some mention here of the speed of the various actions in a field situation.

I remember a study reported in one of the major US magazines in the late '60's or early '70's on the speed of the various actions (for AIMED shots). All testing was done with shooters who were considered experts with the type of action used. Timing was done between the report of the first shot to the report of the 5th shot. The actions tested were Autoloader, Pump, Lever and Bolt. All shots were aimed at a target with misses being disqualified.

The average times were:

Auto: 5.4 seconds
Pump: 5.5 seconds
Lever: 5.6 seconds
Bolt: 11.0 seconds

Since the speed factor would really only apply to four shots in each instance (since the first shot took no time at all), I've come up with the following per shot average.

Auto: 1.35 seconds
Pump: 1.375 seconds
Lever: 1.4 seconds
Bolt: 2.75 seconds

So, in essence, the three "quick shooters" are essentially the same if you take the time to aim.

A deer can cover a lot of ground in an additional 1+ seconds if you're hunting the thick stuff like we have in Ontario.

I actually found my over-all shooting improved when I switched to an autoloader. I would guess it was because so many shots are lost to unseen intervening brush in my hunting area and under my type of hunting, that I was anticipating the need to have a second round available if the animal didn't drop right away. Because of this I'd guess I wasn't giving my full attentin to that first shot.

once I began using the auto, I became sure that the second shot would be available, and was able to greatly increase my first shot success rate.

And to answer the original question, YES, I have needed the second shot on many occasions. When you can lose between 25% and 75% of your shots to unseen brush, you can do everything right, and still not kill the deer.
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Interesting, but I think the key in this article is "with shooters who were considered experts " I certainly wouldn't consider myself expert but I think it's obvious the non expert like most of us :redface: would be much quicker with an auto not needing to practice with each individual action style! Plus you don't need to divide your attention between keeping track of your target & cycling the next round especially if you tend to hunt with diff guns! That's why I use a bolt or lever when stand hunting where you seldom require more than one shot & an auto for those fast & furious type hunts!
 
Ok, edited, read seniors response to grouseman.

What a goomba


C'mon grouseman, teach me something...
your post to senior certainly didnt
 
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DarrylDB said:
Ok, edited, read seniors response to grouseman.

What a goomba


C'mon grouseman, teach me something...
your post to senior certainly didnt
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I have to side with grouseman here as I really enjoy hunting from a tree stand and I love hunting with my compound bow. I enjoy the solitude of hunting solo most of the time as it is a real challange to try and out smart a mature whitetail on it's own turf. To find a scrape and try to figure out how the buck is coming into the scrape by the direction the dirt is flung, then trying to play the wind so the buck won't bust me, all the while knowing the first time I sit in that tree stand is the best chance of me bagging that buck. to me that is hunting. Am I as successfull as the rest of you guys, not by a damn site but I pass up my fair share of little bucks in search of that elusive Mao Grande.
I hunt a piece of private land in which I watch some very respectable bucks frequent during the summer. The rancher has told me time and again to sit in the hay loft on the opening day of rifle season and shoot the biggest which walks into the field but this I have never done because I want to get a big one with my bow. I have sat in my treestand on the fringe trying to ambush the little buggers but they don't become mature bucks by being stupid. I may never connect with a wall hanger with my bow but it will not be for a lack of trying. Maybe I am puting to much stock in that old saying "all good things come to them that wait".
 
The average times were:

Auto: 5.4 seconds
Pump: 5.5 seconds
Lever: 5.6 seconds
Bolt: 11.0 seconds
Click to expand...

I don't consider myself an expert but I can easily beat that 11 seconds with a bolt with the lighter recoiling rounds.If you step up to the heavier recoiling rounds,say the 45-70 in the lever and in a bolt,either action can be cycled as fast as the shooter can recover from recoil and reacquire the target.
 
The average times were:

Auto: 5.4 seconds
Pump: 5.5 seconds
Lever: 5.6 seconds
Bolt: 11.0 seconds

Since the speed factor would really only apply to four shots in each instance (since the first shot took no time at all), I've come up with the following per shot average.

Auto: 1.35 seconds
Pump: 1.375 seconds
Lever: 1.4 seconds
Bolt: 2.75 seconds
Click to expand...

Sorry, but I don't believe a word of that test, no offense Rick.

My challenge stands... I would love to do a test similar to this one.
Anyone game?
 
LeePeterson said:
If you couldn't drop your target with the first shot, a quick second is gonna be no better probably alot worse if rushed.
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Geeze come on Lee :rolleyes:
Let's just pretend just for arguments sake say there's three ( 3 ) seperate targets.

Or perhaps we should start another poll & ask just how many of us..I'll say hunters with experience, instead of "experienced hunters" have taken careful aim, squeezed of what felt like a good shot, & to this day don't know what happened as the prey ran away or heaven forbid :eek: required a second shot :D

I think Frank is closer "The 11 seconds for 3 aimed shots , but in a hurry, would be closer to reality." I'm sure it would take me 2-3 seconds between shots with an auto! And the aimed shot should be qualified I guess:confused:
It obviously would take longer to make a 2" shot off-hand than a 4-5" shot which is certainly good enough for big game vitals.
 
Do your three shots on a running deer target.I have done it with all the actions above and the semi is fastest for me.Pump and lever very close second.I had a tough time making three good shots with a bolt.Most times I only got two shots before the target got to the end.I prob would be quicker with a bolt gun with practice as I dont use one a whole lot.
 
Or perhaps we should start another poll & ask just how many of us..I'll say hunters with experience, instead of "experienced hunters" have taken careful aim, squeezed of what felt like a good shot, & to this day don't know what happened as the prey ran away or heaven forbid required a second shot
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Now this is a good point... Senior is not only experienced but practicle in his knowledge and statements.
I would not even hazard a guess as to how many big game animals Senior has shot. He does not brag numbers and he does not have too... his posts speak clearly of his experience.:cool:
Senior has undoubtedly had to track and even lost wounded animals, I know I sure have... too damn many if the truth be told! It is this undeniable truth that only experienced hunters can acknowledge and be humbled by.:eek:
If you hunt long enough ... it will happen to you or somebody close to you!
If you have never had to shoot twice or track a wounded animal after you thought you had shot it cleanly... than you are either very lucky or just plain lacking in experience. JBRO:)
 
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Just remember guys, the goal in hunting is to dispatch with the animal as quickly and as painlessly as possible. If we sit back and determine that lots of animals are getting away wounded then one must rethink one's hunting strategy. Always bear in mind the running shot is one of the hightes risk to wound shots there is in a hunting situation.
 
BIGREDD said:
Now this is a good point... Senior is not only experienced but practicle in his knowledge and statements.
I would not even hazard a guess as to how many big game animals Senior has shot. He does not brag numbers and he does not have too... his posts speak clearly of his experience.:cool:
Senior has undoubtedly had to track and even lost wounded animals, I know I sure have... too damn many if the truth be told! It is this undeniable truth that only experienced hunters can acknowledge and be humbled by.:eek:
If you hunt long enough ... it will happen to you or somebody close to you!
If you have never had to shoot twice or track a wounded animal after you thought you had shot it cleanly... than you are either very lucky or just plain lacking in experience. JBRO:)
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OH GEEZE REDD
:redface: :redface: :redface: :redface: :redface: :redface: :redface: :redface: :redface: :redface:

Actually lost a wounded animal my son shot this year :(
Was real close after a mile, it had got up 3-4 times when I got close but the guys from camp perswaded me to leave it for an hr. I knew it was a bad idea because of the occasional snow flurries we had been having! but I guess hindsite is 20/20. Anyway, just got to camp for lunch when down came the snow & you guess it, got back to last track to find nothin. Scared up 3-4 deer in the snow storm but never saw any with blood tracks again :mad: #### does happen. Fortunately that is only the second deer I have lost during my year in the camp. Sorry for the hyjack:D
 
walksalot said:
Just remember guys, the goal in hunting is to dispatch with the animal as quickly and as painlessly as possible. If we sit back and determine that lots of animals are getting away wounded then one must rethink one's hunting strategy. Always bear in mind the running shot is one of the hightes risk to wound shots there is in a hunting situation.
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Not... Not even close... the highest risk to wound shot is the Head shot.:eek: :p
 
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