After reading the other thread, I'm curious how many of us have ever used a real guide or outfitter? I don't mean in Africa or elsewhere, I'm talking about here at home. And again, I don't mean a hunter host, but a real licensed guide in a lodge somewhere like you see in the magazines or on tv. Myself, unless I win a trip I can't ever see myself doing it except for when I go after cariboo, a trip I'd love to do. But for deer, elk or moose I don't think so. You?
Have you ever or would you use a guide or outfitter in North America?
- Thread starter pharaoh2
- Start date
I have never used a guide and generally speaking, don't have a desire to. I would consider one though for a hunt that I don't have experience or the gear required. I don't have a lot of experience with waterfowl, but I would consider an guide for that since they would supply decoys and such. Or maybe something that was on horseback as I don't have a lot of experience on horses. Winning a guided trip wouldn't be a bad thing though! It's hard for me to justify paying the kind of cash required for a guided hunt when there are so many opportunities for "do it yourself" hunts.
BC Bigbore
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- BC's Peace Country
I went on an outfitted hunt in the northern Rockies a few years ago. There was an opening at the tail end of the season, the price was right & I had some extra cash on hand. We flew way back into the mountains, stayed in beautiful log cabins, had cooks, wranglers, guides, the whole enchilada. The weather was absolutely perfect and the elk were bugling all around us. I took a nice six point on the first morning and then stayed for a few more days just to enjoy the mountains and comradeship. I now know why those that can afford it go on these magnificent wilderness vacations.
Mighty Peace
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Land of the Mighty Peace
If I hunted out of province where no friends live then YES--NWT or Yukon, maybe BC if things werent working out for time. Maybe "some" day for a Dall Sheep. That is my dream hunt.
Anything in Alberta...NO....Its my passion. I cant wait to teach my boys what I have learned during my years/experiences hunting and share new ones with them.
Sometimes I guess the extra cost to do certain hunts as to getting setup with equipment (camps/horsesd/gear)to do it then maybe, but price would have to be a good one too.
I have guided for big game in the past for a few seasons during archery and rifle seasons just for a change of pace taking time off work in slow seasons. I would say not all guides / outfitters are the same....but the ones that do their work and scouting prior to clients arrival and put in the extra effort, usually have their client succeed with a great/enjoyable hunt. I have some live long friends now from great experiences guiding that still give me a call or send an email through out the year...especially during hunting season. They are as interested in my hunting season as they are in their own back home. If they come to Alberta and are near where I live they always touch base and want to hook up for a visit.
I have had the other end of the stick to where no matter what you did....it wasnt good enough....and these clients were usually the ones with alot of $$$$$$$, but couldnt shoot accurately if their life depended on it and were LAZY!!
Anything in Alberta...NO....Its my passion. I cant wait to teach my boys what I have learned during my years/experiences hunting and share new ones with them.
Sometimes I guess the extra cost to do certain hunts as to getting setup with equipment (camps/horsesd/gear)to do it then maybe, but price would have to be a good one too.
I have guided for big game in the past for a few seasons during archery and rifle seasons just for a change of pace taking time off work in slow seasons. I would say not all guides / outfitters are the same....but the ones that do their work and scouting prior to clients arrival and put in the extra effort, usually have their client succeed with a great/enjoyable hunt. I have some live long friends now from great experiences guiding that still give me a call or send an email through out the year...especially during hunting season. They are as interested in my hunting season as they are in their own back home. If they come to Alberta and are near where I live they always touch base and want to hook up for a visit.
I have had the other end of the stick to where no matter what you did....it wasnt good enough....and these clients were usually the ones with alot of $$$$$$$, but couldnt shoot accurately if their life depended on it and were LAZY!!
The closest I've come to use a guide is the camp hand on a caribou hunt. He wasn't a guide, but di steer us where the caribou's were passing. Other than that, once I took a couple of customers bass fishing for the day with a guide. It was a fish filled day and loads of fun!
Republic of Alberta
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- ,location, location
The only way i would ever do it is is someone else was going on something like a caraboo trip and needed a buddy to come along for company and good times.
Highly unlikely I would pick up the phone and buy a hunt for myself.
Highly unlikely I would pick up the phone and buy a hunt for myself.
I've used a outfitter as a packer here in BC, for horseback hunting. I've also used lots of fishing guides that for the most part I didnt' have to pay for, since I was on sponsored fishign trips.
I'd have no problem hiring a outfitter for most any species that interested me outside my home province of BC. Caribou in the NWT sounds great...
And if I got a good deal on a quality experience with a quality outfit here in BC, I'd hire a outfitter, but that would be a horse trip in the mountains, I wouldn't pay for a drive around and glass clear cuts type of hunt.
I like hunting on horses in the back country, but don't own horses myself, so if I want to do that I need to rent horses (not as easy as it sounds) hire a packer, or hire a outfitter.
I'd have no problem hiring a outfitter for most any species that interested me outside my home province of BC. Caribou in the NWT sounds great...
And if I got a good deal on a quality experience with a quality outfit here in BC, I'd hire a outfitter, but that would be a horse trip in the mountains, I wouldn't pay for a drive around and glass clear cuts type of hunt.
I like hunting on horses in the back country, but don't own horses myself, so if I want to do that I need to rent horses (not as easy as it sounds) hire a packer, or hire a outfitter.
Never have and probably never will for both hunting and fishing I would rather put the money into another rifle or more equipment that I will have for years.
All of the money I spend is for equipment that I will enjoy for years to come not gone at the end of a 5 - 14 day hunt with only a mount and pictures, I also pay my own way unlike some that get sponsored hunts then brag about how good of a hunter/shooter they are...
I can go anywhere in BC that I want to hunt or fish and don't need someone to point out the game or hook the fish for me I can do it myself just as good if not better than any guide.
Now if I lived in any other province then I would probably need a guide because the hunting and fishing sucks so bad anywhere outside of BC you need all of the help you can get...
All of the money I spend is for equipment that I will enjoy for years to come not gone at the end of a 5 - 14 day hunt with only a mount and pictures, I also pay my own way unlike some that get sponsored hunts then brag about how good of a hunter/shooter they are...
I can go anywhere in BC that I want to hunt or fish and don't need someone to point out the game or hook the fish for me I can do it myself just as good if not better than any guide.
Now if I lived in any other province then I would probably need a guide because the hunting and fishing sucks so bad anywhere outside of BC you need all of the help you can get...
NZClaybuster
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- Calgary, Alberta
I grew up in an non hunting family, and as such would had ZERO experience. I would never hunt without a guide, mentor, or instructor. I can guess what I should do, I don't think hunting and guessing go together.
My .02
My .02
I'm going on a DIY Antelope hunt this year, but I wish I had some extra cash to hire a guide or outfitter. When you're on a limited time, out of province hunt I think that guides basically pay for themselves by eliminating time wasted learning an area. They also know local landowners and in many instances have land access that you might not be able to get. DIY hunts can be a lot of fun, but there's also a lot to be said about someone with the right equipment setting up camp for you in a good game area.
BigUglyMan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- New Scotland
If you want to hunt somewhere that you need to have a guide (ie non resident wants to hunt the NWT) then you pretty much have to. No sense in whining about it.
1GLOCKAHOLIC
Regular
- Location
- SW Ontario.
Went on a duck hunt with a guide about 15yrs ago, Still remember it like it was yesterday a ton of fun without the work of setting up, just a lot of shooting and eating bacon and eggs....lol
So heres my 2cents,
I fully understand that there is people from all walks of life, varying incomes, different wants, different needs, and any combination thereof. Guided hunts may not be in the cards for some people whatever the reason and some people may be able to do two or three hunts a year. To use an outfitter is a personal choice and in most cases its not indicative of the skill of this said hunter, it basically boils down to the fact that there are some species and ares in this world that are not "doable" by yourself. Critters like Sheep are fortunately still "doable" by individuals, but on the other hand having horses, scouting time already done, and a really good area make it easier to lean towards getting an outfitter. I guess the stigma of using a guide stems from these BS shows we see on wild TV. You see guys ride around in a truck, or generally participate in anything but the hunt in question, and then go shoot the biggest critter you have ever seen and then expect praise at the end of their hunting accomplishment. I think this stems alot of controversy in regards to guided hunting.
Personally I have done a bit of guided hunting so i know what is entailed on these hunts. My 2cents are based on been there and done that... not read on the internet somewhere :
2- trips to zimbabwe for cape buffalo and plainsgame
1- Moose hunt in the Talkeetna Mountain Range in Alaska
1- Pronghorn hunt in Montana
1- Muskox Hunt on Victoria Island
4- Guided hunts for Geese/Ducks in Saskatchewan
1- Bison Hunt in Wyoming
All of these were guided hunts, and all of which came with great success. The work involved in even getting these hunts even underway is more than one might think. If a guy is to spend the money and wait the years it takes to go with one of the better outfitters in the better areas, it takes long hours of research talking to references, researching outfitters, and acquiring the necesary gear to do the job. Gun Import/Export Permits, licenses, tags, airline tickets, CITIES permits, Broker/Customs agents and fees, and physical conditioning are all things that have to be considered.
I get into discussions about the guided hunts I've been on and some people call me crazy when I tell them what costs are involved. Ive had some say things like "so you pay people to get these for you" and that "youre not a real hunter if you need a guide" and its basically a lack of understanding on their part. My standard reply is " have you done a guided hunt?" Most of the time its a NO, and then i get into telling them that these animals on my wall are not tied up in a field somewhere by my guide before I get there. I tell them of the long miles, ups and downs, poor weather conditions, passing up the smaller ones to get the one I point to on my wall, sleeping in the cold for 10-14days on the side of a mountain, close calls with dangerous game, cold cans of ravioli because the guide and I are so tired from walking all day and we want to go to bed, the cameraderie between guide and hunter/client, the people i now call good friends that I have met while hunting with an outfitter, and even in some cases going home without an animal.
With the money thing, I can remember pumping gas when i was in highschool for $6/hour to pay for a muskox hunt in the arctic with my dad. I am so thankful that my dad taught me that benefits come with hard work. All of the hunts I've been on have only been possible because I am the type of guy who works that extra weekend, or foregoes the bar on a friday or saturday night. One of my most common replies when people tell me im crazy for spending that kind of money on a guided hunt is " well, I could have just snorted it up my nose or smoked it". It just goes to show a guy that people have wants and if you want these things you work for them and make sacrifices to do them. It would make no difference if it were a $50K sportscar i wanted, it basically boils down to the fact that its what i want to do with my money and therefore i do it.
As I said before GUIDED hunting is not indicative of the skill of the hunter in question. The guide is there as a "GUIDE" he is not going to do the hunt for you. Hes basically there to give you a better chance at that trophy of a lifetime. Hes not going to carry you up the side of that mountain and he is not going to make all your calls for you. You have expectations of your guide but hes also got expectations of you. You still have to be in shape, you still have to be able to shoot straight, you still have to judge your animal before you decide to take it, and you still have to endure everything that the guide does. Yes' Ive done guided hunts for alot of the animals on my wall, but YES the majority of the other animals on my wall are ones I've taken while hunting under the leadership of myself. I know how to pattern deer, bait bears, call ducks and geese, judge antlers and horns, field dress animals, cape animals for taxidermy, and make calls on how to make a proper stalk on a distant animal. Ive killed bigger mulies and whitetails than I see on TV myself, and I really know how to hunt deer..... so why use an outfitter.... right.
I refer to these " trophies on my wall " in my post and yes they are on the wall because it is somewhat of an achievement for me, but let me assure you that there are more trophies in brown freezer paper form than on the wall. I hunt to feed my family, and luckily one can do this hand in hand with trophy hunting as well. Another reason I would like this stigma of guided hunting to go away is that there are people out there that do it for a living and support their families. Why would one want to badmouth or help make it more difficult for a guy whos doing what he loves while supporting a family. Times are tough right now and let me assure you there are hunting guides unemployed right now during this recession just like an accountant, mechanic, WAL-MART greeter, or whatever.
Just to quote one post in here regarding this topic:
"the money I spend is for equipment that I will enjoy for years to come not gone at the end of a 5 - 14 day hunt with only a mount and pictures, I also pay my own way unlike some that get sponsored hunts then brag about how good of a hunter/shooter they are... "
I cant tell you how to spend your money and I cant really see anything wrong with what you are doing. I spend money on equipment that will last for years as well, as we all know the better gear is more of a pleasure to use in the field. I totally agree with you in that there are some people out there that get sponsored to hunt and think that they are better than others, and it makes me sick. It makes me sick but at the same time I am jealous that they get to go and do all this stuff....lol. But seriously I see your point.
With the mount and the pictures at the end of a hunt line....... well.... I dont really concur with that one. I look at one of the mounts on my wall and I see not only a beautiful animal, but I can take you back to the whole story of the quest for that animal as if it were yesterday. Knowing all the miles that you humped your ass, and all the S#*T you went through to get that guy really makes you appreciate that. The same goes for a picture... as you know a picture is worth a thousand words. Thankfully most of these hunts I've been on have included my dad, who introduced me to hunting at a young age. He was always taking pictures, and I always saw his mounts in his house, and since we shared these experiences together, these pictures and mounts help remind me of the times we spent together doing what we both love..... and now that he is hunting in heaven... these things are not just a picture and a mount on a wall.
At any rate, thats my rant.
TIM
I fully understand that there is people from all walks of life, varying incomes, different wants, different needs, and any combination thereof. Guided hunts may not be in the cards for some people whatever the reason and some people may be able to do two or three hunts a year. To use an outfitter is a personal choice and in most cases its not indicative of the skill of this said hunter, it basically boils down to the fact that there are some species and ares in this world that are not "doable" by yourself. Critters like Sheep are fortunately still "doable" by individuals, but on the other hand having horses, scouting time already done, and a really good area make it easier to lean towards getting an outfitter. I guess the stigma of using a guide stems from these BS shows we see on wild TV. You see guys ride around in a truck, or generally participate in anything but the hunt in question, and then go shoot the biggest critter you have ever seen and then expect praise at the end of their hunting accomplishment. I think this stems alot of controversy in regards to guided hunting.
Personally I have done a bit of guided hunting so i know what is entailed on these hunts. My 2cents are based on been there and done that... not read on the internet somewhere :
2- trips to zimbabwe for cape buffalo and plainsgame
1- Moose hunt in the Talkeetna Mountain Range in Alaska
1- Pronghorn hunt in Montana
1- Muskox Hunt on Victoria Island
4- Guided hunts for Geese/Ducks in Saskatchewan
1- Bison Hunt in Wyoming
All of these were guided hunts, and all of which came with great success. The work involved in even getting these hunts even underway is more than one might think. If a guy is to spend the money and wait the years it takes to go with one of the better outfitters in the better areas, it takes long hours of research talking to references, researching outfitters, and acquiring the necesary gear to do the job. Gun Import/Export Permits, licenses, tags, airline tickets, CITIES permits, Broker/Customs agents and fees, and physical conditioning are all things that have to be considered.
I get into discussions about the guided hunts I've been on and some people call me crazy when I tell them what costs are involved. Ive had some say things like "so you pay people to get these for you" and that "youre not a real hunter if you need a guide" and its basically a lack of understanding on their part. My standard reply is " have you done a guided hunt?" Most of the time its a NO, and then i get into telling them that these animals on my wall are not tied up in a field somewhere by my guide before I get there. I tell them of the long miles, ups and downs, poor weather conditions, passing up the smaller ones to get the one I point to on my wall, sleeping in the cold for 10-14days on the side of a mountain, close calls with dangerous game, cold cans of ravioli because the guide and I are so tired from walking all day and we want to go to bed, the cameraderie between guide and hunter/client, the people i now call good friends that I have met while hunting with an outfitter, and even in some cases going home without an animal.
With the money thing, I can remember pumping gas when i was in highschool for $6/hour to pay for a muskox hunt in the arctic with my dad. I am so thankful that my dad taught me that benefits come with hard work. All of the hunts I've been on have only been possible because I am the type of guy who works that extra weekend, or foregoes the bar on a friday or saturday night. One of my most common replies when people tell me im crazy for spending that kind of money on a guided hunt is " well, I could have just snorted it up my nose or smoked it". It just goes to show a guy that people have wants and if you want these things you work for them and make sacrifices to do them. It would make no difference if it were a $50K sportscar i wanted, it basically boils down to the fact that its what i want to do with my money and therefore i do it.
As I said before GUIDED hunting is not indicative of the skill of the hunter in question. The guide is there as a "GUIDE" he is not going to do the hunt for you. Hes basically there to give you a better chance at that trophy of a lifetime. Hes not going to carry you up the side of that mountain and he is not going to make all your calls for you. You have expectations of your guide but hes also got expectations of you. You still have to be in shape, you still have to be able to shoot straight, you still have to judge your animal before you decide to take it, and you still have to endure everything that the guide does. Yes' Ive done guided hunts for alot of the animals on my wall, but YES the majority of the other animals on my wall are ones I've taken while hunting under the leadership of myself. I know how to pattern deer, bait bears, call ducks and geese, judge antlers and horns, field dress animals, cape animals for taxidermy, and make calls on how to make a proper stalk on a distant animal. Ive killed bigger mulies and whitetails than I see on TV myself, and I really know how to hunt deer..... so why use an outfitter.... right.
I refer to these " trophies on my wall " in my post and yes they are on the wall because it is somewhat of an achievement for me, but let me assure you that there are more trophies in brown freezer paper form than on the wall. I hunt to feed my family, and luckily one can do this hand in hand with trophy hunting as well. Another reason I would like this stigma of guided hunting to go away is that there are people out there that do it for a living and support their families. Why would one want to badmouth or help make it more difficult for a guy whos doing what he loves while supporting a family. Times are tough right now and let me assure you there are hunting guides unemployed right now during this recession just like an accountant, mechanic, WAL-MART greeter, or whatever.
Just to quote one post in here regarding this topic:
"the money I spend is for equipment that I will enjoy for years to come not gone at the end of a 5 - 14 day hunt with only a mount and pictures, I also pay my own way unlike some that get sponsored hunts then brag about how good of a hunter/shooter they are... "
I cant tell you how to spend your money and I cant really see anything wrong with what you are doing. I spend money on equipment that will last for years as well, as we all know the better gear is more of a pleasure to use in the field. I totally agree with you in that there are some people out there that get sponsored to hunt and think that they are better than others, and it makes me sick. It makes me sick but at the same time I am jealous that they get to go and do all this stuff....lol. But seriously I see your point.
With the mount and the pictures at the end of a hunt line....... well.... I dont really concur with that one. I look at one of the mounts on my wall and I see not only a beautiful animal, but I can take you back to the whole story of the quest for that animal as if it were yesterday. Knowing all the miles that you humped your ass, and all the S#*T you went through to get that guy really makes you appreciate that. The same goes for a picture... as you know a picture is worth a thousand words. Thankfully most of these hunts I've been on have included my dad, who introduced me to hunting at a young age. He was always taking pictures, and I always saw his mounts in his house, and since we shared these experiences together, these pictures and mounts help remind me of the times we spent together doing what we both love..... and now that he is hunting in heaven... these things are not just a picture and a mount on a wall.
At any rate, thats my rant.
TIM
Great (no, wonderful!) rant...
My absolute favourite bit that you already commented on is:
"the money I spend is for equipment that I will enjoy for years to come not gone at the end of a 5 - 14 day hunt with only a mount and pictures..."
I must confess that I shared that view several years ago. Looking back, it came from an entirely misplaced belief in the value of things and in the money it cost to buy them. I suspect that view is something shared by many, from a time when we were all younger and somehow felt that the money really mattered. As I get older, the toys and the cash pale in comparison to the fact that with each passing day, I have one less to live. Each season, it seems, I'm more and more convinced that the "equipment" I use holds much less value than the memories I collect while in the field. Mounts and pictures, far from being an extravagant expense, are actually a wonderful investment in preserving those memories.
Now, at the ripe old age of 43, I seem to have come full circle. The gun collection seems to get smaller each year as I try to raise funds for yet another hunting trip. South Africa last time, Alaska just 2 months from now, Zimbabwe in two more years. Truly, I feel sorry for those who just don't get it, who feel that it's somehow wrong to spend cash on indulging their passions. For God's sake, what are you going to do with it? Buy a house that's 500 square feet bigger? Buy a new car a couple years sooner? In the end, who and what we are is the collection of memories we've acquired, not the number at the bottom of our statement of net financial worth. Deride guided hunting if you will; it doesn't bother me. Hell, the critics can even make fun of my smaller house or older car. I'll just smile and walk away, and actually feel a bit sorry for them, that sorry majority who never knew what is was like to shoot a kudu as the sun set in the Karoo, to stalk a grizzly in the Talkeetnas, or to have a leopard appear on a bait in the Matobo Hills.
In the end, we all get to choose how we live our lives. Live yours as you see fit. I'm quite busy living mine.
My absolute favourite bit that you already commented on is:
"the money I spend is for equipment that I will enjoy for years to come not gone at the end of a 5 - 14 day hunt with only a mount and pictures..."
I must confess that I shared that view several years ago. Looking back, it came from an entirely misplaced belief in the value of things and in the money it cost to buy them. I suspect that view is something shared by many, from a time when we were all younger and somehow felt that the money really mattered. As I get older, the toys and the cash pale in comparison to the fact that with each passing day, I have one less to live. Each season, it seems, I'm more and more convinced that the "equipment" I use holds much less value than the memories I collect while in the field. Mounts and pictures, far from being an extravagant expense, are actually a wonderful investment in preserving those memories.
Now, at the ripe old age of 43, I seem to have come full circle. The gun collection seems to get smaller each year as I try to raise funds for yet another hunting trip. South Africa last time, Alaska just 2 months from now, Zimbabwe in two more years. Truly, I feel sorry for those who just don't get it, who feel that it's somehow wrong to spend cash on indulging their passions. For God's sake, what are you going to do with it? Buy a house that's 500 square feet bigger? Buy a new car a couple years sooner? In the end, who and what we are is the collection of memories we've acquired, not the number at the bottom of our statement of net financial worth. Deride guided hunting if you will; it doesn't bother me. Hell, the critics can even make fun of my smaller house or older car. I'll just smile and walk away, and actually feel a bit sorry for them, that sorry majority who never knew what is was like to shoot a kudu as the sun set in the Karoo, to stalk a grizzly in the Talkeetnas, or to have a leopard appear on a bait in the Matobo Hills.
In the end, we all get to choose how we live our lives. Live yours as you see fit. I'm quite busy living mine.
I agree 100% on the last 2 posts, especially about spending money on experiences rather than objects.
Sure, when I was building up my inventory of good gear I spent lots of money. I look in my workshop and see thousands of dollars of firearms, reloading equipment, components, backpacks, optics, rain gear etc etc. Lots of this stuff gives me great pleasure and enjoyment. While I woudl not be without my guns and gear, I value experiences more than objects.
I recall how I got my first really good $$$ job in 1997. I bought myself a new truck and I loved that truck. It was very nice to look at, a pleasure to drive and it served me well. But after a couple of years and a few hunting seasons, she wasn't all that shiny and new anymore. It was just a truck.
I never think about that truck anymore except when I see it in old hunting pictures. I've got all these great pictures and some mounts and they bring me great memories, which I cherish much more than another inanimate object in my life. I never took any "trophy" pics of the truck, either.
When I see the truck in the pictures, and then think of the truck, I do get reminded that is was very $$$ and I should have made do with an older truck and used the rest of the money to go to Africa or something.
When I speak to older people, the sometimes express regret they never did something they always wanted to do, whether it be go skydiving, hunt sheep, or sail to Australia. I've never heard them express regret that they didn't buy some object. Most of them arent' that smitten by possessions anymore, anyway.
Sure, when I was building up my inventory of good gear I spent lots of money. I look in my workshop and see thousands of dollars of firearms, reloading equipment, components, backpacks, optics, rain gear etc etc. Lots of this stuff gives me great pleasure and enjoyment. While I woudl not be without my guns and gear, I value experiences more than objects.
I recall how I got my first really good $$$ job in 1997. I bought myself a new truck and I loved that truck. It was very nice to look at, a pleasure to drive and it served me well. But after a couple of years and a few hunting seasons, she wasn't all that shiny and new anymore. It was just a truck.
I never think about that truck anymore except when I see it in old hunting pictures. I've got all these great pictures and some mounts and they bring me great memories, which I cherish much more than another inanimate object in my life. I never took any "trophy" pics of the truck, either.
When I see the truck in the pictures, and then think of the truck, I do get reminded that is was very $$$ and I should have made do with an older truck and used the rest of the money to go to Africa or something.
When I speak to older people, the sometimes express regret they never did something they always wanted to do, whether it be go skydiving, hunt sheep, or sail to Australia. I've never heard them express regret that they didn't buy some object. Most of them arent' that smitten by possessions anymore, anyway.
