Help me identify this Israeli Mauser

A

AJones

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Hello, I was at the Orangeville gun show last weekend and I came across this mauser, the seller was adamant about it not being an Israeli mauser and said it was a czech mauser made at brno, converted to 7.62 Nato. After carefully looking at it and spending a few hours reading about israeli mausers on the net, I'm fairly certain that it is an israeli. It has the typical buttstock marking 7.62, typical hole drilled in the buttplate to dissassemble the firing pin. There is also a star of david stamp on the breach. Not a single marking remains on the stock. They did a real number removing the original markings and very few remain. I would like to know the origin of the rifle before israeli conversion. I think its german, what do you think?
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It is an Israeli K98k. The large 7.62 on the receiver, Israeli proofs on the receiver, and 7.62 brand on the stock confirm this.

From what I can see it is made up of some German parts, some Czech and some Israeli. The trigger guard is post war Czech and possibly the stock. It is weird that the stock appears to have had the take down disc removed and a wood plug installed. I would suspect that it started out as a post war Czech k98k originally in 7.92x57 that was sold to Israel. A lot of the post war Czechs sold to Israel had their receivers scrubbed to hide the identity of the manufacturer. It was then rebarrelled and rebuilt by the Israeli's to fire 7.62 Nato. There should be a date on the barrel that will tell you exactly when this was done. Some of the German parts probably made their way onto it at that time as the Israeli's also had large amounts of German K98k's that they converted as well.

I like the Israeli K98k's. They are an interesting variation with a lot of history that fire an easy to find round.

Cool rifle!
 
desporterizer said:
Its Israeli. I have had dealing with the guy you bought it from & he tends to spew equal parts ignorance & BS.
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He did have another israel that did have the lions crest on the breach, but i think this one is german. The bore is excellent, nice enough that I didnt care about the look of the rest of the rifle...
 
Thanks man :)
jbmauser said:
It is an Israeli K98k. The large 7.62 on the receiver, Israeli proofs on the receiver, and 7.62 brand on the stock confirm this.

From what I can see it is made up of some German parts, some Czech and some Israeli. The trigger guard is post war Czech and possibly the stock. It is weird that the stock appears to have had the take down disc removed and a wood plug installed. I would suspect that it started out as a post war Czech k98k originally in 7.92x57 that was sold to Israel. A lot of the post war Czechs sold to Israel had their receivers scrubbed to hide the identity of the manufacturer. It was then rebarrelled and rebuilt by the Israeli's to fire 7.62 Nato. There should be a date on the barrel that will tell you exactly when this was done. Some of the German parts probably made their way onto it at that time as the Israeli's also had large amounts of German K98k's that they converted as well.

I like the Israeli K98k's. They are an interesting variation with a lot of history that fire an easy to find round.

Cool rifle!
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Looking back at your pics I see the date on the barrel is 2-56. Mine still has the Czech lion crest on it and is a mixture of German and Czech parts like yours. It was rebarrelled 4-57.
 
Israeli definitely. A Czech produced rifle judging by the leftover WaA parts and the large Czech trigger guard but the 7.62 marked stock plus the finger grooves in the same scream Israeli. A Brno built rifle rebarrelled and restocked in Israel in my opinion.
 
Mike Webb said:
Israeli definitely. A Czech produced rifle judging by the leftover WaA parts and the large Czech trigger guard but the 7.62 marked stock plus the finger grooves in the same scream Israeli. A Brno built rifle rebarrelled and restocked in Israel in my opinion.
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Do you think it is possible that the stock was German originally but the Israeli's removed the take down disc and cut finger grooves into it to standardize its configuration like the rest of their stocks? I've never seen an Israeli with a plugged take down disc that I can remember. Also I don't think the Israeli's ever made laminate stocks but I could be wrong on that.
 
This rifle certainly seems to have had and interesting history, the waffenamt stamps on the rear sight and rear sight base are WaA359, and the underside of the bolt was WaA77, thats why i guessed german, but Czech seems to be the consensus. Thanks for all the help so far. Any idea where else I could look for for markings.

jbmauser said:
Do you think it is possible that the stock was German originally but the Israeli's removed the take down disc and cut finger grooves into it to standardize its configuration like the rest of their stocks? I've never seen an Israeli with a plugged take down disc that I can remember. Also I don't think the Israeli's ever made laminate stocks but I could be wrong on that.
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The rear sight sleeve and bolt are definitely German WWII parts. When the Israeli's were rebuilding them to 7.62 they would have salvaged and mixed up parts from different guns. Not unusual to see a mixture of Czech, German and Israeli parts. The Israeli's made their own barrels, bands, trigger guards, followers, stocks, buttplates, and sight parts. You could check on the rear sight parts, and the bands for German acceptance markings. The bands are not Israeli made so they could have markings on them. I'm pretty sure the receiver is a Czech part and the trigger guard is Czech for sure.
 
looks to be a very late war Czech action .do you have a close up of the left side of the action . interesting that it was in a German proof house in 2011 and stamped 308.
 
gaff said:
looks to be a very late war Czech action .do you have a close up of the left side of the action . interesting that it was in a German proof house in 2011 and stamped 308.
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I think that is actually 1 IE which would be jan 1984 according to some sources.
 
jbmauser said:
Do you think it is possible that the stock was German originally but the Israeli's removed the take down disc and cut finger grooves into it to standardize its configuration like the rest of their stocks? I've never seen an Israeli with a plugged take down disc that I can remember. Also I don't think the Israeli's ever made laminate stocks but I could be wrong on that.
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My Israeli has no take down disk. I think they made some of their own stocks and found it maybe unnecessary.
 
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The stock on the OP's rifle is not Israeli manufactured in my opinion. I strongly suspect it is a German WWII stock that has been modified by the Israeli's to their standards by cutting the finger grooves in the forend, removing the take down disc and adding the buttplate with the take down hole in it. Israeli made stocks have a different band retaining configuration than both the Czech post war and German WWII stocks. On the Israeli made stocks they use a spring for the lower band and the upper band is held on with a pin. Below is a pic of my Israeli made stock. Unfortunately mine is missing the pin and I haven't been able to find one yet.
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I picked up one about 10 years ago at a local gunshow... the receiver was dripped and tapped and had an old scope on it... the owner said it was shot out. It looked like a smoothbore on inspection but I took a chance and paid $150.00 for it.

After I got it home I spent 3 days cleaning the bore and it was not shot out but leaded badly. It turned out to be a really good shooter and I still have it.
 
Popurhedoff said:
I picked up one about 10 years ago at a local gunshow... the receiver was dripped and tapped and had an old scope on it... the owner said it was shot out. It looked like a smoothbore on inspection but I took a chance and paid $150.00 for it.

After I got it home I spent 3 days cleaning the bore and it was not shot out but leaded badly. It turned out to be a really good shooter and I still have it.
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Sweet. Most Israeli's are great shooters. Mine is a peach, even if the exterior is a little rough. They are military bubbas, not civi's.
 
Popurhedoff said:
I picked up one about 10 years ago at a local gunshow... the receiver was dripped and tapped and had an old scope on it... the owner said it was shot out. It looked like a smoothbore on inspection but I took a chance and paid $150.00 for it.

After I got it home I spent 3 days cleaning the bore and it was not shot out but leaded badly. It turned out to be a really good shooter and I still have it.
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Are you hunting an pecking the keyboard in the dark over there in Kabul as your L's became P's.

Mine was about the same and I paid $120 and still have it. At one point I had a long eye relief scope on it so I didn't have to drip and tap it. :)
 
Mine is drilled and tapped, but I have no idea where to find a mount. It has two holes on the left side of the receiver, just behind the barrel. The only mount style I can imagine working would be like this:

564_001


or this:
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