Help Needed - Changing Barrel & Upper Reciever

50calshooter

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So for the first time Im going to be changing my AR upper reciever. Im going to be going from a Stag A4 to a Vltor VIS. Im going to be using the same barrel, gas block, gas tube, charging handle and BCG. The only thing I will be changing is the reciever....

First question, In this senerio will I have to worry about head spacing, or are the recievers specs the same, jus plug and play?

Second question, What tools do I need to buy to do this reciever swap?

Your help is appreciated, I've built everything else on my AR but never fiddled with the barrel and reciever. Im pretty excited to learn how do this, if I can do this I will be able to fully dis-assemble and re-build AR's from A to Z.

Thanks
 
I would recommend getting an Armors Wrench and an upper receiver vice block... If your very careful you can do it without an upper receiver vice block but it can be tricky and you can break things easily.

As far as headspacing... You will get people that argue that AR-15 barrels do not need to be headspaced because with modern machining processes there are very tight tolerances and its just not needed.

Also, many people argue that when using the same barrel but a different receiver that checking headspace is not needed. Their thought being that, someone at some point when originally building the existing upper checked the headspace so it should be fine.


My point of view on headspacing is simple.. If I disassemble my upper OR install a new BCG... I check the headspace (Yes, i know its excessive to check after changing my BCG, but I already have them so i might as well). I will not just hope that the tolerances are correct, I will not just hope that someone has checked the headspace before...

A good set is ~$40, and as I see it... IMHO, That's money well spent for the peace of mind.

ALSO! Many gun shops / gunsmiths will check headspace for you for free. It takes ~2 minutes and is no big deal. So, maybe thats an option as well.
 
Always, always, always check the headspace.

30secs of checking is much better then looking for spare "optics" or digits.

At the very least, put in a FL sized piece of brass to ensure that the bolt locks up properly.

Jerry
 
Like I said, you can use a sized case if you don't want to get a HS gauge but I can offer you all the above.

If you have a strong vise, you can hold the barrel instead of the receiver. That is what I did. Just make barrel blocks out of some nice hardwood.

Some way to keep the action in place while you torque on the armourers tool.

Jerry
 
With the AR rifle, the bolt carrier cannot go fully forward if the bolt does not lock up. If the carrier is not fully forward, the hammer cannot hit the firing pin.

The only real issue would be excess headspace which in an extreme case could cause the cartridge case to rupture.
 
As far as headspacing... You will get people that argue that AR-15 barrels do not need to be headspaced because with modern machining processes there are very tight tolerances and its just not needed.

Some people should not be allowed to own guns... or give advise! :D
c
Also, many people argue that when using the same barrel but a different receiver that checking headspace is not needed. Their thought being that, someone at some point when originally building the existing upper checked the headspace so it should be fine.

Assumption is the Mother of all F.U.'s :onCrack:

The barrel is headspaced to the bolt (supposed to be). Unless you can guarantee that the barrel and bolt were properly headspaced and that they have been checked at the required intervals, (since use will cause wear and wear will cause the headspace to be altered), it would be foolish to just assume that the headspace is still okay.

In the case of changing a receiver... if the barrel and bolt were properly headspaced before (in the old receiver) then moving them to the new receiver should not affect the headspacing... but checking everything after the move is not a bad idea.

PS... there are a lot of uppers and rifles out there these days which are "parts" guns. The barrel would have been headspaced at the factory (most likely) but that means nothing if the barrel was sold on it's own and someone down the line put that barrel together with who knows what brand of bolt/bolt carrier group and if that combination was never checked for proper headspacing then they may or may not be within spec and may or may not pass a headspace check. This is why it's always a good idea to check the headspacing especially if what you are acquiring is not a factory built, factory assembled and factory tested upper.

Mark
 
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Mark

What do you do with LMT uppers? Ive seen a few in the past and have bought one myself where you can get upgraded LMT bolts/ carriers purchased seperately from the uppers? Do you guys at Questar use a no go gauge or something when you ship out an order with mixed parts like what I said above? Or is it just sold as is? Or because all the parts are from LMT are they somehow checked there and the tolerances are maintained?
 
Mark

What do you do with LMT uppers? Ive seen a few in the past and have bought one myself where you can get upgraded LMT bolts/ carriers purchased seperately from the uppers? Do you guys at Questar use a no go gauge or something when you ship out an order with mixed parts like what I said above? Or is it just sold as is? Or because all the parts are from LMT are they somehow checked there and the tolerances are maintained?

If you are buying "parts" then you are building it yourself and it's up to you to check headspace... we might think you are intending to put those parts together... but you might just as easily be intending on putting that bolt into a different upper that you may already have... we have no way to know and frankly it's not up to us to guess or assume. If I was building it for myself then I would personally be quite comfortable putting an LMT bolt with an LMT barrel (factory new items) and shooting it without testing the headspace... unless it "felt" wrong during assembly, the odds are VERY GOOD that headspace will be okay... but it would still be a good idea to check it first and be 100% sure :)

I've actually spent quite a bit of time speaking with engineers and staff at LMT about their in-house process for headspacing their rifles, uppers, barrels, etc.. they helped us a lot in creating the method we used to headspace our Questar barrels. I won't get into details of how they do what they do, but their barrels are headspaced using effectively three different "test bolts" that were specifically built and designed by them for that purpose. Think of these test bolts as a min and max bolt (both ends of their tolerance spectrum). The barrel is headspaced to the "middle" spec bolt... then tested against the min and the max. If it's correct then it works with all 3... if it's off (in either direction) then it will only work with 2 of the 3 and it is corrected or rejected.

This process is supposed to insure that the LMT barrel will work will all LMT bolts (since the bolts are also tested during manufacture to confirm they are within tolerance specs).

When LMT builds/assembles a complete upper half (whether sold on it's own or as a compelte rifle) that upper half is tested (headspace is checked as part of that process).

If the barrel is sold as just a barrel or the BCG is sold as just the parts then there is no final assembly test since there is no final assembly at the factory.

Having said all of that... mistakes happen... parts fail... tolerances are not always perfect (that's why they call them tolerances)... to simply assume that someone else checked it or it's made to a specific tolerance and therefore doesn't need to be checked is just dumb.

It is VERY RARE that an LMT bolt won't properly fit and headspace to an LMT factory barrel (both parts being new factory units)... but I have seen it happen.

When we built our Questar barrels we spent an inordinate amount of time determining how we were going to headspace our barrels and to what bolt specs/tolerances. We literally used a base group of close to 100 bolts from 2 different manufactures (LMT was one of them) to find the min and max to test against and to determine the middle of that range to set at. These in effect became our tolerance test units for the manufacture process.

It took quite a bit of time and cost us a fair buck doing it but the end results appear to have worked well... we have not had a single barrel that did not headspace to any of our name brand bolts... unless the bolt itself was out of spec.

Mark
 
The only real issue would be excess headspace which in an extreme case could cause the cartridge case to rupture.
I've actually seen that happen and is why I now have HS gauges... It turned into a dangerous situation because of an "experience gunsmith" who decided he knew better.


Some people should not be allowed to own guns... or give advise! :D

Assumption is the Mother of all F.U.'s :onCrack:
Hehe, I agree...


I see that brownells has go/no go guage sets, do i need both? I dont understand this, any vids or can someone dumb this down for me, thanks.
I recommend getting both (again, some may disagree with me and say you only really need the no-go)... Bottom line, its a gun, and I would rather assume that NOTHING is correct than loose fingers, maybe my life, and my entire gun...

Also, They are very easy to use and come with instructions...

Basically though:
  1. Make the weapon safe...
  2. Make sure the chamber is clean... (If its not, you may get an inaccurate reading)
  3. Remove the extractor
  4. Place the Go gauge in, place the BCG back into the upper and make sure that the bolt closes fully (it should)... Once you have seen it fully closes remove the go gauge.
  5. Now insert the No-go gauge, place the BCG back into the rifle and check to see if the bolt closes... It should not.
  6. Reinstall your extractor, and put your gun back together
  7. NOTE: You should not have to force anything closed, nor should you slam the BCG forward, take care of your gauges as from what I understand they are relatively easy to damage.
 
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