Help needed in gathering any information on 3 older rifles

[johnny1981]

My father inlaw as 3 rifles that were passed down to him from his great grand father,

Can anyone tell me anything on these, make, year and model, value wise?

Any info would be appreciated:

1st one: 303 caliber, 1896:

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2nd one: 12 gauge, Janssens sons 809, the interchangeable, serial #482:

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3rd one: Musket, snider patend, 1860 enfield:

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[mrclean89]

the lee is 250-300 mabye more if the barrel is uncut but its hard to see. 1897

the shotgun isnt really worth much as it looks like the stock is broken, mabye 75 to 100 probably late 1800's-early 1900's

the snider probably 500-600 1870's

 

[johnny1981]

Thanks for all the information , the 303 is in original condition, the barrel is uncut.

 

[tiriaq]

The Lee Enfield has been sported.

 

[johnny1981]

What does that mean exactly? The rifle has been his ever since his father died a good 30 years ago and he is now 73 years old, he told me that he did nothing to it. Thanks

 

[unstableryan]

There were so many surplus lee enfields that some companies and lots of people cut all the excess weight off of them to use as hunting rifles. I'm not anything near an expert at this stuff but it could have been done like 60 years ago.

The third gun is by far the most interesting.

 

[johnny1981]

Thanks, it makes sense now!

 

[johnny1981]

Here is a bigger picture of the 303, it might help to see it better:

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[johnny1981]

Bigger picture of the snider 1860:

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[mooncoon]

if you look at the forestock, you can see that it has been shortened from the full length wood of a military rifle. Hard to see the receiver very well but it looks to be a long lee with a dust cover on top of the bolt. The dust cover is a sort of half round piece of metal fastened to the top of the bolt body and makes the receiver quite distinctive from all of the later short lees

cheers mooncoon

 

[GrantR]

This is what a Magazine Lee-Enfield rifle (sometimes referred to as a "Long Lee-Enfield") looks like in original unaltered configuration -

These lads are Canadian Mounted Rifles Troopers in South Africa during the Boer War (1899-1902.)

 

[smellie]

The Sparkbrook is an 1897 rifle, therefore it is a Magazine Lee-Enfield Rifle, Mark I*.

I have its twin, also sportered and with the barrel left uncut (same as this one). It is a GLORIOUS piece with an extensive history in England and in South Africa, all marked onto the Body and the Barrel. The work was done about 1920 and I would think the OP's rifle was done about the same time. The remodelling of the pistol-grip is most distinctive and I would lay a whole piece of raisin pie that our rifles were done in the same shop.

Personally, I care little about money, despite the fact that I have little. But the only guy who will get my lovely Sparklbrook away from me, wears a long black robe and carries a scythe.

The Snider is the archetype Canadian Rifle. It is the rifle which MADE Canada in so many ways. Sniders were supplied HERE to face the Fenian threat while the British Army in England still was carrying muzzleloaders! The Great Eastern Steamship (SS LEVIATHAN) was removed from laying the first trans-Atlantic cable to speed back to England and bring a load of Sniders to Canada; perhaps this on was part of that shipment. It is certainly early enough. The Snider is the rifle of the North West (Riel) Rebellion. Th Army at that tim had some modern Martinis and a bunch of Sniders. So, to avoid ammunition supply problems, the Martinis were withdrawn and the entire force which came West was armed with Sniders. And they were used on both sides, too. Louis Riel had one, a Cavalry Carbine which I once was privileged to hold, although his main weapon was a prayer-book.

As to the shotgun, from the shape of the standing-breech, I would think it could be Settlement period in this part of the country: roughly 1879 to 1900. I once had a Spencer INTERCHANGEABLE shotgun, Belgian, of course, which got borrowed and never returned. As the Jansens, they were inexpensive, workmanlike guns: TOOLS for the settler, the farmer. Th also are a part of out heritage, although a most misunderstood and short-changed part of it. They deserve much better than they are served.

A lot of Canadiana there, friend......

So nice to see.

 

[johnny1981]

Thanks alot for all the information Smellie, I will pass it down to my father inlaw, he said the same thing that you did, he was interested in seeing what kind of value these had, but he wont sell them, they have been in his family for ever.

 

[GrantR]

Yes, if any arm is the quintessentially "Canadian" military rifle, it is the Snider-Enfield! As smellie says, the Canadian Militia were armed with the newly-issued Snider conversion as soon as it became available, and then it was kept in service by the parsimonious Canadian government (which was just coming into existence about that time) as our primary-issue military rifle much longer than anywhere else in the British Empire. Very few Martini-Henry rifles were ever issued here, and our Militia only began to have their Sniders replaced by Magazine Lee-Enfield rifles in 1896-97 ...... Indeed, many of them didn't get rid of their Sniders (a system adopted in 1866) until well after the turn of the 20th century!