Help pricing a Mannlicher Schoenauer Y.1903/14 rifle

[H Wally]

Hi folks,
looking for help roughly pricing a Mannlicher Schoenauer 1903/14 long rifle. I've wanted one for a while due to family history with the rifles, but haven't seen any for sale so don't know what a reasonable price may be.

I'll have to stick with verbal description for now as I wasn't planning to be looking at guns

Gun is a 1903/14 full wood long rifle. Wood is nearly black with fairly heavy denting and marks, but no splitting or cracking from what I can tell. Front top wood is missing. Metal is brown/black patina with light wear on edges. Signs of old corrosion with pin prick pitting on some exposed surfaces, but appears to have been neutralized and oiled long ago. Unsure of under the wood, but lots of old grease/dirt present, so likely same or better. Mechanically complete and functioning with some light damage to screw heads as expected. Bore is dark but appears shootable.

I realize this isn't ideal, but looking for an approximate market price. I've watched US sales and the prices fluctuate widely, as do conditions, and our market is different than there so looking to see if anyone knows what they might be worth here, as I would like to make a fair offer to the owner.

 

[yomomma]

Hey wally I think you know my guess

 

[H Wally]

Hey wally I think you know my guess

Hmm - more than $4 and less than $10?

 

[MiG25]

$3. Personally I'd hold out for a better one.

 

[bearhunter]

OP, I don't think you've been looking very hard. They show up at most of the large gun shows, such as Chilliwack, Kamloops and Calgary.

They are very nice rifles when found in decent condition. The rifle you describe is borderline IMHO. The folks in the US have access to a lot more milsurps than we do. They can afford to be choosy. I also notice on several sites that many US collectors who are financially well heeled have a tendency to knock anything that isn't high end or has certain anomalies that aren't original to the rifle. The anal ones tend to forget that many people just can't afford to be that picky.

You need to ask yourself why you want that rifle and what condition are you willing to accept at the price you're willing to pay.

I recently sold two 03/14/30 rifles as a set. One was a carbine and one was a long rifle. I hadn't taken them out of the safe in ten years other than to wipe the stocks with BLO and check the bores were clean every six months. They were clean, with a few dents, about 95+% overall condition. Smooth as oiled glass and from what I can remember quite accurate. The carbine, from my notes was more accurate. Likely because it had a .2645 bore diameter and the long rifle had a .2655 bore diameter. They were both good with 140 commercial and 160 grain bullets in the surplus ammo I had for them.

The fellow I sold them to offered me $1500 for both of them. We settled on $1750. That would be pretty much top price for rifles in such condition IMHO. If they were as still in the grease and wrapped???????????? They do exist though. I've seen them. Lever Arms had about two dozen crates of them in 1966 and they came with matching accessories. I was usually allowed first pick on that stuff but these were out of my price range at that moment. To many other pieces were available in the same condition and I was only making so much money. Not only that, both commercial ammo and surplus were extremely difficult to find.

As you know, unless something is rare, condition is everything. The rifles were stamped BREDA 27 on the left side of the receiver. Not rare. My long rifle didn't have top wood. The carbine did. The early, pre WWI rifles all had top wood.

If you're just looking for a shootable representative rifle at a reasonable price and from your description I would offer $500 or less and feel like I've paid top dollar and a fair price for value but only if the bore is at least 90%.

 

[buffdog]

.
Much of the Greek stuff was shot using corrosive ammunition. They did have a civil war after WWII when the Communists tried to take over.

During the 1960s there were a lot of them imported into Canada, but most were in a bit of a rough condition, and not the best bores.

Winchester did make a couple of Lots of 6.5 MS ammunition after WWII for the Greeks, it came in plain white boxes of 20.

 

[Coffice]

I have recently seen similar rifles you are describing with and without top wood going for between 500-900 CAD, and one very excellent condition rifle selling for about 1200 USD.

Have you considered the Dutch examples in your searching?

As for 6.5X54 ammo pricing...that seems to have a spread similar to the cost of the rifle! I've seen boxes go for 90 dollars to as cheap as 20 dollars. I have a box in my ammo crate I've been holding on to which came from Greece. Gun shows are your friend!

 

[H Wally]

OP, I don't think you've been looking very hard. They show up at most of the large gun shows, such as Chilliwack, Kamloops and Calgary.

They are very nice rifles when found in decent condition. The rifle you describe is borderline IMHO. The folks in the US have access to a lot more milsurps than we do. They can afford to be choosy. I also notice on several sites that many US collectors who are financially well heeled have a tendency to knock anything that isn't high end or has certain anomalies that aren't original to the rifle. The anal ones tend to forget that many people just can't afford to be that picky.

You need to ask yourself why you want that rifle and what condition are you willing to accept at the price you're willing to pay.

I recently sold two 03/14/30 rifles as a set. One was a carbine and one was a long rifle. I hadn't taken them out of the safe in ten years other than to wipe the stocks with BLO and check the bores were clean every six months. They were clean, with a few dents, about 95+% overall condition. Smooth as oiled glass and from what I can remember quite accurate. The carbine, from my notes was more accurate. Likely because it had a .2645 bore diameter and the long rifle had a .2655 bore diameter. They were both good with 140 commercial and 160 grain bullets in the surplus ammo I had for them.

The fellow I sold them to offered me $1500 for both of them. We settled on $1750. That would be pretty much top price for rifles in such condition IMHO. If they were as still in the grease and wrapped???????????? They do exist though. I've seen them. Lever Arms had about two dozen crates of them in 1966 and they came with matching accessories. I was usually allowed first pick on that stuff but these were out of my price range at that moment. To many other pieces were available in the same condition and I was only making so much money. Not only that, both commercial ammo and surplus were extremely difficult to find.

As you know, unless something is rare, condition is everything. The rifles were stamped BREDA 27 on the left side of the receiver. Not rare. My long rifle didn't have top wood. The carbine did. The early, pre WWI rifles all had top wood.

If you're just looking for a shootable representative rifle at a reasonable price and from your description I would offer $500 or less and feel like I've paid top dollar and a fair price for value but only if the bore is at least 90%.

I appreciate the rundown Bearhunter - somehow I just haven't been seeing them so it's good to get others' input. I'd figured $300-$500 with bore and condition being the determining factor, so nice to know I was at least in the ballpark

.
Much of the Greek stuff was shot using corrosive ammunition. They did have a civil war after WWII when the Communists tried to take over.

During the 1960s there were a lot of them imported into Canada, but most were in a bit of a rough condition, and not the best bores.

Winchester did make a couple of Lots of 6.5 MS ammunition after WWII for the Greeks, it came in plain white boxes of 20.

Thanks Buffdog. I've got to get the bore brushed out for a proper look but like you say, probably not the best bore.

I have recently seen similar rifles you are describing with and without top wood going for between 500-900 CAD, and one very excellent condition rifle selling for about 1200 USD.

Have you considered the Dutch examples in your searching?

As for 6.5X54 ammo pricing...that seems to have a spread similar to the cost of the rifle! I've seen boxes go for 90 dollars to as cheap as 20 dollars. I have a box in my ammo crate I've been holding on to which came from Greece. Gun shows are your friend!

Much appreciated Coffice -I'd consider a dutch gun, but the Greek ones are really what I'm after. Ammo's another factor like you say - reloading's not a problem in any event.


Thanks for the input folks - it's never straight forward assessing a gun without pics, and I don't want to lowball the seller or end up overpaying, so the up-to-date values are really helpful.