Help with my General Purpose M1A Build

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rkungl

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Hi I would like to build a reliable, accurate, light weight, GP M1A (good for CQB but also effective up to 600 yards). So far I am considering the following:

Either Squad Scout or National Match (I've heard National Match holds value better and I could buy an 18.5 inch barrel to keep it non restricted in case I wanted to hunt with it)

If you recommend National Match can you suggest a good 18.5 barrel?

Sage CQB or Vltor (I want pistol grip and something that won't degrade accuracy and at the same time is light weight)

I may use vertical grip (not necessary) but I don't think I will use bipod or flashlight or any other accessories.

Low profile ARMS #18 mount (low profile so cheek riser not necessary)

ARMS #22 rings (again the low ones if possible)

Leupold Mark IV 1.5x5 optics (I would like something that I can use with both eyes open at CQB but also effective at range.

I am completely open to any and all suggestions

Thanks,
Ryan
 
wait till you guys see the new and improved M14S-CQB
I'll be debuting in a couple weeks. Our proprietory laminating system produces a true ONE piece, no seams , totally bombproof carbon fiber composite stock. These new stocks are so solid but yet very light weight. Incorporate the same imbedded aluminum adaptor I have been using since day one. most AR grips and all AR buffer tube stocks (except the Magpul UBR buffer tube) will fit up perfect. For the UBR you will need brownells buffer tube chasing die to reduce the ubr thread size.
no one in the industry makes a stock like the m14s-cqb as far as the methods used and material blends. The McCann industries stock is a close second but is all carbon fiber whereas we utilize a custom carbon fiber composite blend for the balance between light weight and stock rigidity. Some wieght in the right places is better for felt recoil and balanceing the rifle for carry purposes.

shop around for the prices of a vltor (modified usgi fiberglass/screw and glue adaptor) , Mcmillan (heavy sucker, MUST be fully bedded, but very nice), and McCann Industries, full carbon fiber, made in limitted runs. Then send me an email hehehehe, cuz mine are made in canada and very competetively priced starting at 549.00. These new stocks I am making are so solid i may just drive over one with my jeep just to see what happens hehehehe
here's a link to the dealer page with photos http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/forum/showthread.php?t=506183
 
M14Doctor your stock does sound very good. Also I could pick up the M1A National and get one of those McGowen 18.5" barrels. Now for optics and mount/rings?

I saw a post somewhere on here that recommended a burris optic and some other ones as well. I'm going to look for that again. I was reading that the Leupold Mark IV isn't that great for less than 100yards which is not going to work for me I don't think.

As for mount and rings I am thinking ARMS #18 mount (sturdy and low profile, hopefully no cheek riser required) and the appropriate #22 rings (low or medium) based on the optic I choose.

M14Doctor, what is the weight of your stock?
 
You want to build one like this ... ;)

Otokiak
Rankin Inlet, NU
CANADA

DSC00063-1.jpg
 
Ok did a bunch more research on Scope. I'm still thinking Leupold Mark IV 1.5-5, but which one?

59100 Mark 4 MR/T1.5-5x20mm (1") Matte Special Purpose
67905 Mark 4 MR/T 1.5-5x20mm M2 (30mm) Matte Illum.Spec. Purp

I read a previous thread which concluded the following (this is taken from 'best scope for battle rifle at medium range')

[QUOTE START]
Conclusion: Added on march 20 with everyones input.
With my preference for BDC reticle, here's my 2 options:
-Burris XTR 156 with low-profile turrets (new) in ARMS or Larue rings. 1000$
-NightForce 2.5-10x32 with Vreticle Low and hunting turrets. For short range I would use a mini red-dot or EBR see-througt rings. 1400$

If someone prefer BDC turrets over BDC reticle, there's much more choice:
-Bushnell various model including 1.25-8x
-Burris XTR156 or NXS2.5-10 with target turrets
-Leupold Mk4 1.5-5
-USOptics SN-4 or SN-3
-S&B 1.5-6x or 2.5-10x
-Swarovski Z6
[QUOTE END]

Suggestions?
 
- McMillan folder stock
- Norinco receiver
- Norinco gas system
- USGI Barrel(M14Doctor installed)
- SMITH ENT muzzlebrake
- USGI Spring
- Tartan Tactical spring guide
- USGI bolt
- USGI trigger group
- GG&G bi-pod

Going to use either a ARMS #18 mount or find a Sadlak mount. Not sure what scope to go with ... possibly Mark 4 MR/T 1.5-5x20mm M2 (30mm) Matte Illuminated or a Vortex ... possibly a Millett ... I haven't decided and still need to bed the rifle, weld the front end, paint the metal parts ... she's not finished yet.

Otokiak
Rankin Inlet, NU
CANADA
 
rkungl said:
Either Squad Scout or National Match (I've heard National Match holds value better and I could buy an 18.5 inch barrel to keep it non restricted in case I wanted to hunt with it)

If you recommend National Match can you suggest a good 18.5 barrel?

Sage CQB or Vltor (I want pistol grip and something that won't degrade accuracy and at the same time is light weight)
Click to expand...

Hi Ryan,

The Scout / Bush M1A are restricted with the 18" barrel. You shoul go with a standard or loaded model. Or a LRB M25 tanker model...
The NM model is much more expensive, mainly because of the barrel and stock bedding. It don't make sense to pay the premium for that and change the stock and barrel! And keeping the heavy barrel and bedded stock will be too heavy for a general purpose rifle, unless you're a 250lbs of muscle guy.

Weight-wise, choose the M14 doctor stock or a lesser Vltor.

You will probably need the medium height ARMS 22 but ask if you get a replacement height just in case.

I'm happy if my optic thread was useful.

Keep searching!
 
It would be nice if the barrel came in 18.5" direct from springfield. It seems the loaded comes with the medium weight NM barrel anyway.

So maybe the best bet is to just get the standard. Does it make sense to have the barrel professionally cut back to 18.5" or just buy a new barrel all together?

I have never heard about the LRB M25 tanker model what is that all about?

I could also go with the scout and then if I ever wanted to use it for hunting I could then buy a longer barrel (unless there is anything else I would need to do as well to make it non-restricted).

Anyone here have the M14 doctor stock?

WildPhil did you end up going with the Burris scope? Do you like it? Is it 2 separate optics one stacked on top of the other? What don't you like about the Mark IV?
 
argh now I'm reading that arms #18 mount can have problems......

Sadlack? others? I'd like low profile but........no problems jamming or anything

which mount is best for scout? (not the forward mount, I'm thinking of using Mark IV)

which mount is best for standard/loaded?

Thanks everyone!
 
rkungl said:
It seems the loaded comes with the medium weight NM barrel anyway.
So maybe the best bet is to just get the standard. Does it make sense to have the barrel professionally cut back to 18.5" or just buy a new barrel all together?

I have never heard about the LRB M25 tanker model what is that all about?

I could also go with the scout and then if I ever wanted to use it for hunting I could then buy a longer barrel (unless there is anything else I would need to do as well to make it non-restricted).

WildPhil did you end up going with the Burris scope? Do you like it? Is it 2 separate optics one stacked on top of the other? What don't you like about the Mark IV?
Click to expand...

You're right, the loaded would make a good long range rifle but a standard is more practical for your purpose. Yes you could get a standard cut down to 18.5". It would be much more convenient than a restricted scout and cheaper than buying a new barrel for a Scout/Socom.

Search LRB arms or LRB of Long Island on google and here in Main battle rifle. For a little more money it would solve your issues of scope mount and barrel lenght. But you probably won't get it before a year.

Yes I like my Burris XTR156. Good clear optic, nice design, forever warranty.
I never tried a Mark4. It's just that for that price I can get a Nightforce which are more universaly loved. Plus Leupold don't offer a BDC reticle like I like.

rkungl said:
argh now I'm reading that arms #18 mount can have problems......

Sadlack? others? I'd like low profile but........no problems jamming or anything

which mount is best for scout? (not the forward mount, I'm thinking of using Mark IV)
Click to expand...

There's many threads on this topic. An ARMS 18 or Sadlak steel mount should serve you well.
If you want the best, get an LRB M25. Well, try to. There are not many in Canada yet.

Do I understand you never had an M1A/M305? Know that beside all these products options, you have much more to learn. The M14 are not plug-and-play like a 10-22 or a 870. To be a safe and accomplished M14 rifleman you need to learn about slamfire, ammo concerns, cleaning and lubing needs, adjustable sights, inspection, etc. Only then the M14 greatness will be yours. If you don't want to dedicate yourself to a rifle like that, you better turn toward the RFB, AR-10 (restricted) or XCR-M / SAPR (coming shortly) or a bolt rifle.
 
Thanks for your response wildphil. What is the model number of the comparable nightforce optic? I was looking for something a bit cheaper than schmidt and bender short dot II since it is so highly rated but similar in function to it.

I'm going to look into the nightforce and Burris optics tomorrow. I'd like something that I can use quickly with both eyes open for close range but also effective up to say 5-600 yards.

I don't mind waiting for this rifle I just want it to be really good when I do finally get it. I did call LRB and placed an order (because of long wait time I can modify) for the following:

-M25 receiver (no rear lug)
-18.5" standard barrel chrome lined (didn't get medium because wanted lighter barrel, unless you think medium barrel makes a lot of difference)
-unitized gas system
-NM sites (although I've read that front site is too low for 18.5" barrel, thoughts?)
-upgraded gas piston
-upgraded spring guide
-upgraded mag release
-and going to tell them to include muzzle brake

I'm thinking of putting this into M14 doctors carbon fiber stock or Vltor stock (again lightweight). I like the idea of having a carbon fiber stock but I am concerned about durability of it.

I didn't order trigger from them because once you do it increases the cost considerably for some reason. Any trigger suggestions? USIG or match trigger?

Still not sure what rings I'm thinking sadlak???

What do you like so much about BDC reticle? I'm sure you know MUCH more about all this than I do.

I have a military background (5 years) I don't like 5.56 round or the lack of reliability of AR-15 type and I want to get the best legal general purpose battle rifle for 0-600yards. I really wanted FAL but not possible in Canada :S so I figured M14 is next best choice. I want something extremely reliable but I don't want tooo heavy either. Accuracy is also very important but second to reliability.

I know you are partial to M14 but do you think it is the best match for me out including those other rifles you suggested?

I don't have experience on the M14 but I am willing to put in the effort and time if it is truly my best option.

I'm also getting 590A1 shotgun and gold cup stainless 1911A1 any suggestions on where I can get the best price for those? I am pretty set on those choices for pistol and shotgun but I am open to suggestions (I've heard 870 shotgun might be a better choice)

Thanks so much for your help it is much appreciated!
 
Answers in red

rkungl said:
What is the model number of the comparable nightforce optic? I was looking for something a bit cheaper than schmidt and bender short dot II since it is so highly rated but similar in function to it.
NXS 1-4x24. Just choose your reticle (no BDC) and if you want the zero-stop option (if you use BDC turrets).

I did call LRB and placed an order (because of long wait time I can modify) for the following:
-M25 receiver (no rear lug)
-18.5" standard barrel chrome lined (didn't get medium because wanted lighter barrel, unless you think medium barrel makes a lot of difference)
-unitized gas system
-NM sites (although I've read that front site is too low for 18.5" barrel, thoughts?)
-upgraded gas piston
-upgraded spring guide
-upgraded mag release
-and going to tell them to include muzzle brake
You're on the right way for a great (if not perfect) do-it-all rifle.
-Front sight: I suggest a Smith enterprise gas lock dovetail. They make one for the 18" barrel.
-Sights: NM allow great accuracy at surprising range. For your purpose you may just consider that the standard or tritium sights would be better in low-light and quick-shot.

Any trigger suggestions? USGI or match trigger?
My choice was to order a new one from 7,62mm firearms (USGI specs) and I'll get polished by a M14 riflesmith or myself.

Still not sure what rings I'm thinking sadlak???
TPS are really well regarded. You could add that and the BAD tool on your order from LRB. The tool is expensive but I ended paying that money on various single use tools that are too bulky to carry...
Back to the rings, I chose ARMS 22.

What do you like so much about BDC reticle? I'm sure you know MUCH more about all this than I do.
I'm not an expert, I've just been doing my homeworks for longer than you. It's explained in my scope thread but I like that it's simple and easy.

I have a military background (5 years) I really wanted FAL but not possible in Canada :S so I figured M14 is next best choice. I want something extremely reliable but I don't want tooo heavy either. Accuracy is also very important but second to reliability. I know you are partial to M14 but do you think it is the best match for me out including those other rifles you suggested?
Thank you for your service. :)
Your M25 will fill your requirements with ease if a 10-11pounds rifle (all dressed) is not to heavy for you. You can't find much lighter in a .308 semi anyway. It's reliability is legendary and the other .308semi coming on our market will need many years to proove as reliable.

I don't have experience on the M14 but I am willing to put in the effort and time if it is truly my best option.
So while your on the wait list, read the M1A manual from Springfield website. Then the stickies here. Then maybe the M14TFL forum. Along the read you'll know if it's the right rifle for you. If you get the addiction, you'll start getting tools and stuff and you'll order a second M14 before you receive your first! You will know your rifle enough to care for it correctly and it will care for you. If your a guy that change guns every year (going to a bolt, then a lever, than a RFB, etc) stay away from the M14. When hunting with my M1A I felt armed to the teeth like I never did (even with a C6 during my short service). The M14 is the rifleman's rifle.

I'm also getting 590A1 shotgun and gold cup stainless 1911A1 any suggestions on where I can get the best price for those?
Click to expand...
I have no clue! Try in the shotgun and pistol sections.
 
great info wildphil!

Out of curiosity what is the new rifle coming out the xcr-m? It is supposed to be very good?

what is your exact build giwolf?
 
Build has been modified to the following:

LRB M25 receiver
TPS rings (low if can clear otherwise medium)
NXS 1-4x24 (with zero-stop)
Extended Rail
Barrel-standard weight 18.5" (chrome lined)
LRB muzzle brake
Unitized gas system
Sadlak titanium coated gas piston
Sadlak magazine release latch
Sadlak NM spring guide
Smith Enterprise gas lock dovetail
Standard rear sight
USGI spec trigger
M14S-CQB carbon fiber stock OR Vltor (lessor)

Extras:
5x20 round mags
BAD tool
Bolt disassembly tool

Any suggestions for improvement on this build? Any upgrades seem unnecessary?

Does medium weight barrel make a big difference in accuracy (its an extra 1.5 pounds). Would it considerably reduce recoil?
 
giwolf said:
Hey Wildphil you nailed the rifle I'm building right down to the rings and sights I'm using.
Click to expand...
Hi Greg,

Nice to hear from you. Funny we come to the same conclusions doing the same reflections without talking about it.
Which front sight did you pick?

We all wish to see pictures and specs if/when you get it!

rkungl said:
Out of curiosity what is the new rifle coming out the xcr-m? It is supposed to be very good?
Click to expand...

The XCR-M could be very good. The XCR-L is good but not Army tough.
The other one coming is the Swiss Arms Precision Rifle (SAPR). That one will be up to the Swiss Arms reputation with a canadian price of over 5000$ I believe.
 
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