HK P2000 vs SIG 2022

bjjzak

bjjzak

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Here's another of those annoying "which would be better" threads.
Looking at something polymer framed, 9mm, medium size, have medium hands, already have a nice heavy steel frame pistol (S&W659, 108 bbl), want something lighter and a bit smaller, and have narrowed it down to these 2. Anyone out there have some experience or insights to offer up?
Assume a standard da/sa trigger on both, but open to suggestions.
Also, looking at approx 1000-2000 rounds per year, with some lead bullets making 25% of the total, thanks to indoor range rules.
 
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They were both brought to the market as less expensive alternatives to the USP and P226 series of pistols to compete with the Glock and others in their price point as a duty pistol. I'd recommend trying before you buy if you have the opportunity. I've tried both and don't like either.
 
I've shot the P2000 and handled the SP2022. Both are quality guns, but the P2000 is considerably smaller, the grip is smaller and more narrow. It has the now-standard decocker button at the rear end of the slide, which is nice, but I did not appreciate the magazine release. I could not hit the paddle with my thumb or index finger, forcing me to shift my entire grip. Otherwise, no complaints.

The SP2022 is a larger, heavier pistol. The arrangement of controls and buttons is perfect for my rather long fingers. I prefer the SIG-style sliding decocker on the grip. The grips are interchangeable and the pistol comes with tritium sights. Both guns are well engineered and manufactured.

Try both.
 
beltfed said:
They were both brought to the market as less expensive alternatives to the USP and P226 series of pistols to compete with the Glock and others in their price point as a duty pistol. I'd recommend trying before you buy if you have the opportunity. I've tried both and don't like either.
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P2000 is not a cheap alternative to the USP - their prices are virtually identical. P2000 was meant to be an updated version of the USP Compact.
 
How would the 2022 compare to something like a Browning HP, Para double stack 9 or a CZ75? I've fired both and liked them. Have also fired the Beretta 92 and the Clock 17, find them a bit boxy. My S&W isn't too bad sizewise, but I wouldn't want to go bigger.
Under single stacked guns, have used 1911's, P38's, 3904 S&W, SIG 220, sounds like the H&K is more along those types for grip dimensions.
 
bjjzak said:
How would the 2022 compare to something like a Browning HP, Para double stack 9 or a CZ75? I've fired both and liked them. Have also fired the Beretta 92 and the Clock 17, find them a bit boxy. My S&W isn't too bad sizewise, but I wouldn't want to go bigger.
Under single stacked guns, have used 1911's, P38's, 3904 S&W, SIG 220, sounds like the H&K is more along those types for grip dimensions.
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Have you considered HK P30L? It's probably the best polymer pistol out there right now, and the only one with fully adjustable grip panels and backstrap.
 
Hmmm, hadn't thought on that one, I think price wise it wasn't too far off the P2000. Sizewise, how does it stack up with the other 2? Had a peek at their website, like the regular 30 a bit better, but can we get it with the longer barrel here, or is the 30L the only way?
 
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capp325 said:
P2000 is not a cheap alternative to the USP - their prices are virtually identical. P2000 was meant to be an updated version of the USP Compact.
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Read the entire sentence - just because you are charged similar for both at retail, doesn't make it so for an agency sourcing a duty pistol.

As to why I didn't care for them, I didn't see improvement over the Glock products, and if I wanted a Sig or HK, I'd buy the USP or 226 models.
 
bjjzak said:
Hmmm, hadn't thought on that one, I think price wise it wasn't too far off the P2000. Sizewise, how does it stack up with the other 2? Had a peek at their website, like the regular 30 a bit better, but can we get it with the longer barrel here, or is the 30L the only way?
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The regular P30 is about the same size as the P2000. P30L is half and inch longer; otherwise it's identical to the P30. I've never heard of the P30 being sold here, but why would you want the protruding barrel in the first place?
 
beltfed said:
Read the entire sentence - just because you are charged similar for both at retail, doesn't make it so for an agency sourcing a duty pistol.
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So are you saying that the P2000 costs police agencies significantly less than the USP? What's the source of this information?

This doesn't even make any sense, as P2000 is essentially a USP Compact with a few minor cosmetic/ergonomic changes.
 
I own two P2000's. 9mm SA/DA and .40 S & W with the LEM trigger. All I can say is that it is my favourite gun. Fits my hand perfectly and is very accurate. I much prefer the SA/DA trigger to the LEM. If you buy the LEM, make sure you try it first. Bought mine from Wolverine for a great price but find that the trigger is way too light. Just can't get used to it.
 
capp325 said:
So are you saying that the P2000 costs police agencies significantly less than the USP? What's the source of this information?

This doesn't even make any sense, as P2000 is essentially a USP Compact with a few minor cosmetic/ergonomic changes.
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It is my understanding H&K made those changes and marketed the P2000 specifically to police agencies in direct competition to Glock and were flogged at significant savings to bite into Glock's market share.
It makes perfect sense if you are a firearms manufacturer that wants police agencies to replace their current duty pistols by purchasing your system, parts, training, etc.....
 
I have a SP2022. I haven't had it for very long and have only taken it to the range once since then. I like it a lot. if you are familiar with other Sig models it doesn't feel incredibly different in the hand. Shoots well. I like the grips and the decocker lever as well.

To me it feels roughly like a USP size wise.

It was the price that was the selling point for me though.

I shoot a Sig at work so it was a bonus to have a similarly designed handgun to shoot on my own time.
 
I have a P2000 and I have shot various of the SIG Pros over the years. I don't own a SIG Pro, but I do own other SIGs.

The main practical difference with these guns is size. The P2000 is a small feeling gun. The SIG Pro feels "stocky" (thick, but still comfortable) like a 229.

I didn't like my P2000 all that much until I got the extended baseplates for the mags which - stupidly - they don't ship the guns to Canada with. If you buy the gun - order some baseplates from Wolverine or you probably won't like the grip. With the baseplates on the grip is great. It feels similar to the Walther P99 grip. Due to a somewhat unexpected series of events, looking for them in different places, I now have 9 mags - all with the extended baseplates.

The gun is fantastic. I like it more all the time. The balancing seems almost perfect for me. Keep in mind everyone is different. I am a "small gun" guy. My pistols are the SIG 228, 229, 239 and the HK P2000. I don't like pistols that are long off the front. My girlfriend likes Beretta 92/90-two guns. To me those feel long and unwieldy. I'm not saying that is "the way it is", that is just the way is the way it is for me. P2000 I think I can get good control on it firing quickly. Here is a video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OqOhhqBR63Y

I actually have the target from these 20 rounds (no I am not completely OCP, but I do save some targets :p), and it is actually pretty good for the speed of shooting. I'll see if I can find it tonight.

I have a video of me shooting the SP2009 here as well. This is a friend's gun. I think it may have not been clean - the reason why it didn't go into battery when I released the slide. Anyway, it doesn't do that very often:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NIjnzCECRI&feature=channel_page

The SIG Pro, to my mind, was an attempt to make "SIG Classic" with a polymer frame - and it was a success in my view. Some people bag on those guns, but they are nice, and great value for money. The gun looks and feels a lot like a 228 or 229 on the outside - particularly the outside of the slide. The new SP2022's in Canada have the same nightsights that 229s ship with - which are some of the best on the market IMHO. The gun doesn't have the same balance that a 28 or 29 has, but it is still pretty good. The trigger also seems to be not quite as crisp as a well broken in SIG classic, but it is miles ahead of most of the polymer guns on the market. The trigger is abut the same feel as an HK USP/P2000/P30-type trigger, but the re-set is shorter (strange given the SIG classic re-set, but it is true). I did a side-by-side off-hand accuracy test with a SP2022 and a 229, and got very similar results. That is on the board here somewhere, I just don't feel like looking it up.

If I were going to buy one of these two guns.... SIG Pro is really tempting given the cheap price. If the gun is, or becomes, a parts orphan - that is something to consider... but the price is definitely right. P2000 is 30% more, plus you need those baseplates for it to really come into it's own.

One things with the SIG Pro - they use (what I think of as) as "CZ75-style" barrel and locking mechanism - where the barrel has a loop under it that the slide catch lever fits into:

http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/schematics/schemmfg.aspx?schemid=829&m=25&mn=SIGARMS®&model=SP2009+

This is totally different than the "classic" SIGs. Not to sure why they did it that way, but they disassemble more like a CZ than a SIG.

The other thing with the SIG Pro, they have this plastic guide rod with a little plastic "nub" on the end that fits into a little hole on the front of the barrel (part 33 connecting to part 52 on that diagram). Again, not sure why they did it that way, but the little nub thing will wear... and I know of at least one case where it broke off. You can get a stainless steel guide rod, which sounds like a good idea, if someone will ship one to you from the U.S.

The P2000 uses the same "recoil buffer" system that the P30's use. Like the USP's the P2000 inspires a lot of confidence on the wear issues, becuase they don't really seem to wear much. It is a flat (not wound) recoil spring. I guess at some point users should probably replace the spring, and it could be tricky to find one in Canada, but with that buffer in there it should last a long time.

Like the other guys have said... see if you can try both. If one or the other really turns your crank, get it.
 
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ceriksson said:
I shoot a Sig at work so it was a bonus to have a similarly designed handgun to shoot on my own time.
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I see alot of people who think along the same line. Personally I went the opposite direction. Why shoot more of the same, why not change it up, try something different?

Not criticizing, just found it peculiar.

Back on topic, I like the 2022 better.
 
Good comments ghostie, I tend to preffer "small guns" despite being a bigger fellow. I'll be in Calgary this summer, will have to check out these guns in person. At least there's enough stores with some selection, Regina tends to suck in that aspect.
Starting to sound like the 2000 may fall more along my lines of thought. Curious to see how wide the SIG sits, my 659 despite being a rather heavy pistol, is rather slim as compared to my Norc NP34 sig copy, which I find a bit wide, especially with the Houge grips. (659 is restricted, or I'de have all sorts of 12-6 options, darn.)
 
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