HK416/MR223 Info Thread

greentips

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I gonna start this because HK deserves it. I will put in more info as I have time.

There are 4 different distinct generations/types of MR223

MR223: 2007
Non-chromelined barrel
rear pin hole moved to be not compatible with standard AR15
Threaded but with no flash suppressor M15X1
Commercial dimension stock extension tube.
Standard AR15 trigger

MR223A1: 2009
Non-Chromelined barrel
BKA approved new lower/upper with standard AR15 push pin locations
Threaded but with no flash suppressor M15X1
HK 2 stage trigger with disconnector hood, can be put to safe with hammer uncocked

MR556(A1): 2010 - American version
Non-Chromelined barrel
Mil-spec stock extension
Standard AR15 push pin locations.
Lower with flared competition style magwell
Standard HK416 birdcage flash suppressor 1/2X28
Locked down push pins ( must use tool to unlock push pins)
HK 2 stage trigger with disconnector hood, can be put to safe with hammer uncocked

MR223A3: 2013 to present
based on HK416A5
Commercial stock extension
Chromelined barrel and chamber
Standard AR15 push pin locations
G3 type flash suppressor without locking ring M15X1
HK 2 stage trigger with disconnector hood, can be put to safe with hammer uncocked
New Slimlined buttstock


Difference between MR223 and MR223A3

Barrel and chamber: A3 is chrome lined
Barrel extension: starting at A3, HK no longer uses traditional AR15 index pin and slot arrangement. Not backward compatible with A1 upper
Lower: A3 lower has Ambi safety and bolt release
Upper: A3 upper has raised area to protect bolt release. Push rod bushing is roll pinned. A3 has more picatinny slots. Different barrel extension indexing slot from A1


Difference between MR223A3 and HK416A5

Barrel and chamber: different muzzle crowning and potentially slight difference in chambering
Barrel exterior: MR is approximately 0.15" thicker both in front and behind gas block
Gas block: MR uses A1 gas block. A5 has gas block with 2 settings
Barrel thread: M15X1 vs 1/2X28 tpi
MR has protrusion in barrel extension to prevent use of full auto BGC

Tools for "gun plumbing"
HK flash suppressor - 17mm wrench
Barrel Nut Wrench - "Giessele barrel nut wrench" for Giessele AR15 rails
Barrel Nut Torque - just above 32 ft lb ( this is not a factory spec, just by my own experience - use at your own peril )
Barrel Extension "reaction rod" - Magpul Biv block compatible.

FAQ
Q: Are MR223 and MR308 trigger groups interchangeable?
A: No, they look the same, but MR308 has different pin hole size to prevent installation of MR223 trigger group

Q: Can I remove trigger block safety from bolt carrier to use regular Giessele SSA trigger?
A: It will not be safe. HK has higher bolt velocity that may cause discharge by the forward inertia of the firing pin.

Q: Can I use aftermarket AR15 charging handle in a MR?
A: Generally yes.

Q: Does HK use standard AR15 sights?
A: HK used to have its own sight height for HK416 and MR223. Around 2014/15ish, HK began to supply BUIS in standard AR15 height with their MR rifles. In general, if you have a rotating "drum" rear sight, it is in the old HK proprietary standard. See picture below:

HKsightheight.jpg

Q: Are MR556 and MR223A3 barrels interchangeable?
A: No. You cannot purchase a MR556 barrel from the US and install it in the Germany MR223A3. They have different barrel extension and indexing. See picture below:

HKbex.jpg

Q: My gunsmith was cursing when he re-profiled a HK barrel. Internet said HK uses a tougher steel, so what is it really?
A: The exact steel used by HK is not known and they probably won't tell anyone. It was guessed by many that Aubert & Duval is a HK steel supplier because at one point A&D used a HK G36 in its "GKH" steel brochure.

There are at 3 melting modes of GKH and qualities of cleanliness. It is unknown which one HK actually uses.

Here is a comparison of what a typical US mil-spec steel to A&D GKH
HKSteel.jpg

Comparison of AISI 4140 and 4150 to the vacuum arc remelt mode of GKH. The Charpy V-Notch test measures the energy absorbed during fracturing. This partially explains why European military small arms passed barrel obstruction tests without rupturing, while some US made commercial barrels simply blows apart.
GKHsteelvs4250.jpg
 

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I wish they dropped the barrel thread thing. Reduces options. M15x1 no thanks. Its a good thread but it limits option for FH.

Well at least Surefire makes them for both thread measurements.
 
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Good start, I'll add that there are differences between the A1 & A3 upper receiver (shown) in case you are considering a "barrel swap" . Also the 416A5 LE guns have adj GB, , Cheers

I'll add some info for DIY gun plumbers, if you decide to change or remove the gas block the pins install right to left, from the "shooters" perspective and remove in the reverse. The pins shouldn't be reused? however they can, maybe once.



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I wish they dropped the barrel thread thing. Reduces options. M15x1 no thanks. Its a good thread but it limits option for FH.

Well at least Surefire makes them for both thread measurements.

Surefire does make the 15x1 but only by special order & minimums apply

gadget
 
I've been working on a flash hider that is incredibly effective on 10.5" barrels (or longer) ... and had exactly this request from a store employee - they have a few customers who have been looking. It appears as though a number of individuals are looking for a M15x1 threaded flash hiders.
 
Here is some info for you fellas.

M15x1mm Internal Thread Size.

Minor Diameter Min13.917 mm Max14.153mm, Tap drill size is 14mm

Surefire 5.56 Flash hiders with 1/2-28 TPI Can be modified to HKs M15x1.0mm

It does suck to cut through the Hardened Nitrided Stainless, but still very doable
 
Not sure if it still applies but it was 100 units at one time / that’s going back a couple of years though

gadget
 
Here is some info for you fellas.

M15x1mm Internal Thread Size.

Minor Diameter Min13.917 mm Max14.153mm, Tap drill size is 14mm

Surefire 5.56 Flash hiders with 1/2-28 TPI Can be modified to HKs M15x1.0mm

It does suck to cut through the Hardened Nitrided Stainless, but still very doable

Most like it won't work. Typical "AR15" barrel has a different shoulder geometry and length of thread from HK. It is a different ball game, not just thread size.
 
If anyone can provide the geometry, length of thread etc on the HK muzzle, would love to see if I can incorporate the differences into the current prototypes.
 
Most like it won't work. Typical "AR15" barrel has a different shoulder geometry and length of thread from HK. It is a different ball game, not just thread size.

Is there some proprietary feature like a taper on the shoulder?

Based on a sample I have here, thread length doesnt seem to be a issue on my Surefire brake, still some meat left to put a 15mm thread atleast an inch deep and still be away from the first angled port hole. And smallest shoulder diameter at threaded end is 20mm .

Would need to see one to understand what your saying.
 
Not sure if it still applies but it was 100 units at one time / that’s going back a couple of years though

gadget


Well as time passes a market or demand is growing in Canada for a 100 unit order. I could see it happening. I could see them selling for SL8s and MR223. I’m sure IRG can bring them in. As Trainihg Cans and Wardens become more popular this will push people to get these.
 
Well as time passes a market or demand is growing in Canada for a 100 unit order. I could see it happening. I could see them selling for SL8s and MR223. I’m sure IRG can bring them in. As Trainihg Cans and Wardens become more popular this will push people to get these.

It is an item in the catalogue but no one ever see M15X1 surefire in the wild. Simply, in the US all MR556 are 1/2X28 Tpi. Only the old HK91 uses M15X1, and surefire (especially Warcomp and brake that need indexing) won't work because HK uses ratchet and locking ring in anything other than 416/MR.

B&T does make M15X1 sound suppressor adaptor ( that looks just like the factory HK) and surefire looking brakes for HK. I asked wolverine earlier and they said they can be ordered in.

Bottomline, the factory HK flash suppressor works. I don't see a point of replacing it with something else other than going for the "suppressor adaptor" look.
 
I added a new section in the first post about the gun plumbing tools . HK is all metric and I had to buy a few new things. Feel free to let me know of any information and I will add to the list.

Also starting a FAQ
 
MR556 barrel extensions- available by phone at HK Webshop;

I was quoted $85 ($95 shipped)


So this is just a FYI if your don't "hang out" at HKPRO, this is really the "crown jewel" of changing a barrel, this means that you can use an AR barrel. You will have to "spec" the GB etc, just letting you know it "out there" . ALL ITAR RULES APPLY GOVERN YOURSELF ACCORDINGLY
 
It is an item in the catalogue but no one ever see M15X1 surefire in the wild. Simply, in the US all MR556 are 1/2X28 Tpi. Only the old HK91 uses M15X1, and surefire (especially Warcomp and brake that need indexing) won't work because HK uses ratchet and locking ring in anything other than 416/MR.

B&T does make M15X1 sound suppressor adaptor ( that looks just like the factory HK) and surefire looking brakes for HK. I asked wolverine earlier and they said they can be ordered in.

Bottomline, the factory HK flash suppressor works. I don't see a point of replacing it with something else other than going for the "suppressor adaptor" look.



https://www.bt-ag.ch/shop/eng/category/miscellaneous


Are these what you are referring to Greentips ? Does B&T make a fake Can as well or trainer ?
 
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