House of 1911S: Fusion Freedom Series Pre-Orders

[Conscript]

Did the research did ya?
Get your flak jacket on. My research indicates all you did was spout off about something you knew nothing about.

No evidence, just hunches and strange coincidences.

The only manufacturer of 1911's that look like the lineup presented here with the black oxide finish are SAM's. I've owned my fair share and shot other owners pistols to be assertive of this fact. Almost all of the guns that come out of SAM that aren't stainless, are black oxide finished.

The slide cuts, the trigger styling, bob hammer, checkering, lettering on the barrel (.45 ACP) and the claimed fit and finish are all indicative of SAM, or an insane coincidence that a manufacturer in the states decided to copy. Typically, these features are all seen through the SAM rebrands (ATI, Seraphim armory, etc..).

And lastly, the marking of SAR PH on all of the Freedom pistols is almost a dead giveaway of SAM Philippines inscribing their pistols discreetly, but still leaving it on there. They went to the limits of putting it diagonally, behind the grip near the mag ejection. Why? And if these are US made, why incribe SAR PH? (Which I think stands for Shooters Arms Philippines).

Bring the flak.

 

[Conscript]

Have Fusion Firearms explain this marking. Case will be closed. I don't see this marking on their beautifully made custom guns (Which yes, I believe are the real deal).

 

[buddythedog]

I asked them directly over on the 1911 forum. Over there I haven't seen any talk about the markings your referring too, other then the questions i just posed. The reviews of some of the pistols over there are good.

 

[Conscript]

I asked them directly over on the 1911 forum. Over there I haven't seen any talk about the markings your referring too, other then the questions i just posed. The reviews of some of the pistols over there are good.

Bring the rep over onto this forum, or post screenshots of my messages over on the 1911 forum. Let's see what they say. I really want them to prove me wrong. I would gladly fork over $1800 if these are all strange coincidences, believe me.

 

[true north]

Do you have this marking on your SAM's?

 

[jakebrake]

The only way to prove it is if Wanstalls will back it up with money back guarantee if these guns are found out to be rebadged sams.Wanstalls is getting this information from Fusion so it's not really on them I guess.I emailed Fusion and they would not say the slides and frame are manufactured in the USA I was on 1911 forum and they would not answer this question either so it makes you wonder when you can't get a straight answer from the manufacturer.I would just hate to spend that money and find out down the road it's a Sam

 

[jakebrake]

Just seen that picture that is very interesting

 

[buddythedog]

Bring the rep over onto this forum, or post screenshots of my messages over on the 1911 forum. Let's see what they say. I really want them to prove me wrong. I would gladly fork over $1800 if these are all strange coincidences, believe me.

When I get a reply I will.

 

[Conscript]

What I find more disturbing is that the marketing photos they took look photoshopped to remove the SAR PH markings.

These guys are either engaging in BIG time marketing fraud and are completely dishonest about the source of these 1911's, and willing to Photoshop and lie to retailers and people on the web, or I am going insane. Tell these guys to prove me wrong or they deserve the backlash I've stirred up.

I will gladly rescind all my comments, fade into the shadows and pick up their fine "All American made 1911, finished by their gunsmiths in house". The price is way too outrageously good to be true.

 

[Conscript]

Also, one of my comments was removed by someone. Do not remove any of the posts until this matter is solved. Covering up an issue of this size is not a good idea for retailer and customer.

 

[EDX2308]

I sifted high and low all over Google images and I cannot for the life of me find a 1911 with the SAR PH markings on the images. The one posted by Conscript is the only one that has it. This isn't an issue of Wanstalls or a fellow CGN member. It's a question of is it true or not?

 

[buddythedog]

I sifted high and low all over Google images and I cannot for the life of me find a 1911 with the SAR PH markings on the images. The one posted by Conscript is the only one that has it. This isn't an issue of Wanstalls or a fellow CGN member. It's a question of is it true or not?

You can see the sar ph on the guns in the youtube video that wanstalls posted.

I did find one other person questioning it on 1911 addicts forum but they didnt get any replys.

 

[9mmGunGuy]

I have a Sam Thunderbolt, it clearly is marked "SAM Inc, Philippines". No SAR PH mark anywhere.

 

[jakebrake]

I just checked on the 1911 forum under fusion some one asked if anyone has one and show some pictures and the same markings are on that gun you have to look hard to see it.

 

[teltec01]

It's a little concerning that the stock photos don't appear to have the SAR PH stamping yet photos of customers pistols do have that marking as do the pistols in the video.

 

[Conscript]

I sifted high and low all over Google images and I cannot for the life of me find a 1911 with the SAR PH markings on the images. The one posted by Conscript is the only one that has it. This isn't an issue of Wanstalls or a fellow CGN member. It's a question of is it true or not?

I did a quick search and found lots.

1:1 EXACT COPY, if Wolverine's SAM 1911 long slide .45's they sold a year ago.

Also, as a bonus to corroborate my SAM - Fusion connection, look at the diagonal markings on this SAM Commodore. They did this stuff in the past.

Wanstalls, the Fusion guys are lying to you, as per my original suspicion a week ago. These are 100% SAM Filipino made for export 1911's. They are committing marketing fraud and are deliberately lying and covering up their Made in USA claims to retailers and customers. Anyone want to continue to throw flak?

 

[Zedbra]

Import and then domestic branding laws in the USA may surprise some people wherein manufactured products may be imported into the USA that are not 100% machined, then simply machine finished and enabled to be marked "Made in USA". Many, many brands that people scream "Buy American" are actually 85% machined overseas and then the final stages of machining performed in the US. Edelbrock, for example that brands "Made in USA" over everything they do, ship in most items for completion from China. Perfectly legal, and the norm for decades down south.

Knowing this, and the quality of SAMs - does it matter if the frame alloy was started offshore but then meets legal USA manufacturing laws to allow the stamp?

 

[tobaman45]

I have a Sam Thunderbolt, it clearly is marked "SAM Inc, Philippines". No SAR PH mark anywhere.

the same with my SAM longslide-no SAR PH, took the grips off to make sure

 

[jakebrake]

These guns do not say made in USA it says Fusion on right side of gun so I'm sure Sam had to put their markings somewhere else on the gun on the left side.this is quite the mystery plus they will not answer the question on 1911 forum they were on it today to promote the freedom line but would not answer the question about the marking on the frame so everyone I think we have the answer.I wanted a cco 1911 but will have to look elsewhere.

 

[Conscript]

the same with my SAM longslide-no SAR PH, took the grips off to make sure
View attachment 85373

You're not going to find those markings because the SAM manufacturer markings are clearly on the side of the gun, and not discreetly hidden like the SAR PH on the frames of the Freedom guns. Fusion is deliberately trying to hide in every possible way, the true provenance of the pistols, even down to their scrubbing of the photos and clear marketing fraud.