How far would you go to save some weight?

sillymike

sillymike

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How far would you go to shave some weight off your SxS ?

Stumbled upon this, listed by InterSurplus
Thomas Turner SxS 12 GA
12GA chokes Mod & Cyl.
Extractor
Barrel length: 28 inch
Length of pull: 14 3/4 inch
Chamber : 2 1/2 inch
Weight: 6 lbs
Click to expand...

When I first look at it, my reaction was a :eek: what is that?
- After a bit of time... doesn't seem that bad... and a 6lbs SxS with 28" tube, that could be interesting...

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Made for Thomas Turner by Westley Richards using the patent Westley Richards Anson & Deeley action. Like many ‘makers’ Thomas Turner did not make their own barrelled actions, buying them in from true makers in different stages of production. Various makers used different approaches to produce a lightweight 12 gauge, mostly involving pared down actions, thinner barrels, even 16 gauge frames. Turner’s approach used an unaltered action, thinner barrels, a minimized forend and skeletonized stock. This was the most successful commercially, they produced these sparingly for many years until WW2. As you can see, this gun was of very high grade and with great wood, a very expensive gun when new, very scarce now. However it has fallen on hard times and while still usable it’s no longer the beauty it once was. I considered buying it, primarily because of the WR connection and the modest cost but for me this would definitely be a project and I’m not prepared to go there.
 
Here is a Skimin & Wood---BLE---2" chambered 12 gauge---27" barrels---weighs 5 lb 3 oz. And, it has a man sized 14" LOP.
Doubt if you can find a lighter 12 gauge side-by-side.

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There is a Turner at auction I'm watching. A lower grade gun and I don't think the barrelled action is from Richards, although pics are poor. BUT, the barrels on the auction gun were cut to 28" and no choke remains. I don't need another 12 gauge without choke.
IDK if that is the case for the Intersurplus gun as well but they don't state what the chokes are in the ad. I would like to see a pic of the muzzle if I were to pursue it.
No more guns, John. No more guns.
 
Londonshooter said:
BUT, the barrels on the auction gun were cut to 28" and no choke remains. I don't need another 12 gauge without choke.
IDK if that is the case for the Intersurplus gun as well but they don't state what the chokes are in the ad.
Click to expand...

A little off-topic (kinda) but I've had the opportunity to shoot some older guns that were initially built without any kind of choke... and I was kind of surprise how nice the patterns were at the 20y line
 
Ashcroft said:
Don’t worry about the balance. The British makers were very particular about balance and this gun was finished with perfect balance for it’s intended purpose.
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You're not helping... I think most of us are trying NOT to buy another gun :p

Anyway, I thought Anthony from Tradeex was quick to respond... Denis at InterSurplus is right up there!

In case anyone is wondering about the barrels

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I had looked at it but passed on it. Reminds me of the boat paddle stock ruger rifles.

I am very tempted to buy one those 12ga 2 1/2" guns...
 
So what do we say about those flats then?
The gun’s been reproofed, but really very little change in bore diameter @ 9” from breech face, if any, in the left barrel because stamped a 12 originally which is already a .729 isn’t it, and the right barrel a 13/1 well I guess that would be .719 original so not much removed to increase that into the .729 range.
Maybe the second proofing was just the nitro proof and/ or chokes altered with the left barrel polished out a bit?
There’s a date code for the reproofing too in the bottom left corner of the flats as seen in the pic.
I don’t have any of those lists at hand so don’t know what the date is.
Hallowell and co website has lots of that info, great resource.

All in all not altered very much at all so that’s good.
If the bores are free of pits and dents then they should be just fine and good to go.
Also with a .729 proof the standardized choke tool will work reasonably accurately to determine the choke, so the left/second barrel actually is full, or close to it.
**wait just looked at that pic again and that’s the right/first barrel with the tight choke.
Maybe since bore increased to make it into the .729 range but orig choke left the same, the degree of choke would make it a Full now, whereas previously it would have been Mod ~??

That’s my take.
Anybody else, what do you think?
 
Did some googling last night, seems like the guy was known for making light guns...
- The address of "172 New Bond Street " was used between 1892-1893

The proof mark crown over BNP, was used the Birmingham proof-house starting in 1954
The diamond with 12 over C was used for the chamber size, from 1887 to 1954
The diamond with only 12 inside was introduced in 1954
The 2 1/2" was introduced in 1925

Just thinking out loud, but in the 1890s, wouldn't the barrel had been some sort of Damascus?
 
Sillymike, a fluid steel set of barrels would have been available in the 1892-3 timeframe that you found the rib address narrowed it down to, but I understand it was a more costly option at that time.
Parkspipes, good pick up on the proofs being incongruous.
 
This sudden glut of British guns looks suspiciously like unsold leftovers from a large British auction, mostly previously consigned by gun shops with a surplus of unsold stock. Many of them have marked bores, have thin wall thickness or are sleeved, all features that make them a difficult sale in Britain or Europe. Some of them may have marginal proof dimensions. Some may be out of proof making them illegal to sell in Britain or Europe. There are some good solid used guns coming in to various outlets that could be fine value but do your homework carefully.
 
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