How long can you store Powder??

I agree completely finished product is best. For myself having a lifetime of components is a little out there though it's an idea I can certainly get behind. I guess the bottom line is I would rather be looking at it than looking for it. This is especially true when The store has none for months. I go through reloading spurts, I'll take a notion to crank out a couple thousand .223 and I just want to have what I need when the mood strikes me. Last year I bought all the Varget a certain high river fly shop had because I was on my last 1lb and I hadn't seen any in almost 2 years. I dunno I just don't wanna be without.

and here's me.. wanted some varget last week but couldn't find any.. had to settle for BL-C(2)..... Sigh.. IT WAS YOU!!! LoL!!!

btw... that ball 2 powder cost me 43 bucks and change.. whats it worth in your fields?

I share that same notion.... load for a week or until I get bored... then put it away.. I am sitting on a lot of .223 ready to go.. I figure powder is safer stored in little separate vials than it is in one big jug. and its far closer to being used. and it is capable of being subjected to greater extremes with less CHANCE of DECAY over TIME. If one goes... it doesnt necessarily mean that all will go. on the other hand.. if you put all your eggs in one basket.. well... see the baker and ask him what he thinks.
 
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I tend to stock up on the components that have the highest price fluctuations. So powder and primers. Usually do a bulk buy of projectiles once a year. I'm not a fan of amassing a huge stockpile for a SHTF scenario. I'm just cheap :)



LoL!! I bet im cheaper than you are.....

whos been your best bet so far for components?

Reliable is more expensive than some other places Ive looked... enough to turn me away... cuz Im cheap and I dont believe that anything we use is priced fairly.. its all a greedy money grab at your expense... imho... yours might vary.
 
LoL!! I bet im cheaper than you are.....

whos been your best bet so far for components?

Reliable is more expensive than some other places Ive looked... enough to turn me away... cuz Im cheap and I dont believe that anything we use is priced fairly.. its all a greedy money grab at your expense... imho... yours might vary.

Reliable is ok for smokeless powder when they have it in stock. They had a great 20% off sale over Christmas, and they sometimes throw in a "Customer Appreciation" sale once in a while - I got 10lbs of Titegroup @ 24.99/lb last year :) For bullets and primers, give John/Brad a call over at Custom Reloading. They have great prices and lots of stock of Berry's and Campro, and usually have good stock on primers to sell as well.
 
very dumb questions guys... but....

Why have some of you held on to powders for such long periods of time? I have some here.. and I intend to load it and use it within the next 6 months or less... Then maybe get more? I dunno. Just sayin' seems odd to hold dangerous goods for an extended period of time. As is the case with all things, I would think that "the odds" -whatever they may be for whatever items you have will be stacked against you. Its simply the way nature works.. Always towards the side of time and decay... along with time and decay comes other such phenomena as "luck" or "chance"... Chances are your luck will run out one day.... even in my predetermined 6 month time frame I wont escape nature, time and decay, but my chances are less than someone in it for a long duration.... all trucks need new tires eventually.

Think back 10 years. Suppose you were offered powder at $2.50 a pound. Just about any powder of any brand. Only problem is that it comes in 45 or 60 pound drums. How many drums would you buy?

I bought as much per trip as my truck would hold - 1,350 pounds. And I made more than one trip. That is why I still have some powder on hand. My powder magazine is almost empty. But there a few jugs or various powder.
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If you are not new to the game you sure ask newbie questions. Anyone that reload the last several years knows the answer.

Hint: price, shortage, same batch...
...
Im not new to "this game" as you say. and I don't much appreciate your inference that I am "new"..

very dumb questions guys... but....

Why have some of you held on to powders for such long periods of time? I have some here.. and I intend to load it and use it within the next 6 months or less... Then maybe get more? I dunno...
 
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...if you have any older powder that concerns you, you may send it to me and I will dispose of it properly for you :rolleyes:
 
Think back 10 years. Suppose you were offered powder at $2.50 a pound. Just about any powder of any brand. Only problem is that it comes in 45 or 60 pound drums. How many drums would you buy?

I bought as much per trip as my truck would hold - 1,350 pounds. And I made more than one trip. That is why I still have some powder on hand. My powder magazine is almost empty. But there a few jugs or various powder.


I see your point.. I trust you are storing that mass appropriately. The oil spot on the one container is worth looking into. But I see your point. Being a cheap a$$ myself.. I would have done the very same thing as you.. Im sure you've saved TONS of money by doing this. Very Smart. but also a calculated risk... Again... TIME, DECAY, and CHANCE.. these are undeniable forces at play at all times in our world and universe.. Im not sure if anyone here is seeing my point. Ive heard a few times now how "new" i am.. Maybe true.. i'm newer than you..thanks for thhe diss. I can only wish to be as experienced as you all, but i still buy powder and that's the truth.. I wont play the.. "oh we're all out.. Sorry... maybe next week" game. When .22 went rare... I just didn't buy ammo or go shooting.I was pissed off you bet, but there are many other things to do... And I can recall even to this day hearing BS stories from all the stores.. Got one just the other day from some guy manning the counter at Wholesale. Then got another one from some other guy behind the counter at Cabellas... so.. yeah... do you figure you shoot 200 rounds a week day in day out? or? I wish I could do that.. but its not reasonable at this time and inmy circumstance. If I had property backed onto crown land... There would be a lead and copper mine out back!

I can only imagine all the fun you've had over the years... and at a price far less than a lot of others here have had to pay.... Good on ya for such a lucky score! Still though.. If something happened and that all went up... I would not want to see you experience it.. TIME , CHANCE & DECAY....

I figure you have enough there for some 200,000-225,00 rounds of modestly loaded 308... that's a lot of trips to the range! and that's just a days worth of production for some factories out there!
 
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...if you have any older powder that concerns you, you may send it to me and I will dispose of it properly for you :rolleyes:

Do you want the wet sticky stuff or the stuff with the acrid odour and plummped up container? LoL!!! a sandwich perhaps? LoL!!!

Theres one thing that everyone fails to address..and Yes you are entitled to think your powders will last your lifetime and this certainly is a fact... BUT everything out there in the elemental world has a half life. And yes that half life may be thousands of years... but in the end everything breaks down. There have been no reports of private residence explosions of magazines, but maybe I havent looked hard enough... Im just saying. Common sense says to me to use what you have as soon as you can.. or at least make it as safe as you can as fast as you can...
Those milk jugs of powder dont strike me as the containers in which the product was delivered but I cannot say that is for sure. The containers are white and opaque after all. Its the lack of labelling that gets me.. and the sharpie markings denoting powder type. Safe storage? Probably yes. Acceptable, Probably yes.. Legal? probably no. and if something did happen and it did go off , some smart a$$ forensics tech inspecting the fire damage might just say something that would affect your insurance. Check the laws and regs concerning the amount of powder you are able to store and how it should be stored. Dnt get me wrong. I cant see your set up and you just might be doing it all by the book.. or you could simply be storing it in a dark dry corner of your basement.... Just be careful what ever youre doing. powder is powder.. its an explosive agent that needs ZERO outside oxygen and can be ignited in more ways than one.
 
I see your point.. I trust you are storing that mass appropriately. The oil spot on the one container is worth looking into. But I see your point. Being a cheap a$$ myself.. I would have done the very same thing as you.. Im sure you've saved TONS of money by doing this. Very Smart. but also a calculated risk... Again... TIME, DECAY, and CHANCE.. these are undeniable forces at play at all times in our world and universe.. Im not sure if anyone here is seeing my point. Ive heard a few times now how "new" i am.. Maybe true.. i'm newer than you..thanks for thhe diss. I can only wish to be as experienced as you all, but i still buy powder and that's the truth.. I wont play the.. "oh we're all out.. Sorry... maybe next week" game. When .22 went rare... I just didn't buy ammo or go shooting.I was pissed off you bet, but there are many other things to do... And I can recall even to this day hearing BS stories from all the stores.. Got one just the other day from some guy manning the counter at Wholesale. Then got another one from some other guy behind the counter at Cabellas... so.. yeah... do you figure you shoot 200 rounds a week day in day out? or? I wish I could do that.. but its not reasonable at this time and inmy circumstance. If I had property backed onto crown land... There would be a lead and copper mine out back!

I can only imagine all the fun you've had over the years... and at a price far less than a lot of others here have had to pay.... Good on ya for such a lucky score! Still though.. If something happened and that all went up... I would not want to see you experience it.. TIME , CHANCE & DECAY....

I figure you have enough there for some 200,000-225,00 rounds of modestly loaded 308... that's a lot of trips to the range! and that's just a days worth of production for some factories out there!

Sorry there Mr. Jeffrey, but you are showing you are "new" to at least the reloading forum here at CGN. Ganderite has been reloading for longer than the average person here has been alive. He speaks from decades upon decades of experience, and his opinions are extremely valued here on CGN. A lot of people have been encouraging him to write a book based on his experiences. We would be very fortunate if he ever did :)
 
Sorry there Mr. Jeffrey, but you are showing you are "new" to at least the reloading forum here at CGN. Ganderite has been reloading for longer than the average person here has been alive. He speaks from decades upon decades of experience, and his opinions are extremely valued here on CGN. A lot of people have been encouraging him to write a book based on his experiences. We would be very fortunate if he ever did :)

Thats all good. I am not trying to be disrespectful in any way. What does it matter how much experience I have? It seems that no one is taking the time to see what I am trying to say.. Seems its easier to point a finger and call a guy a noob. I guess what would need to happen for my point to be remotely considered would be to have a keg go off in someones home and that might be that.. but anyway.. Im a noob. I know nothing.. My points are moot.. Go on and keep reloading.. you'll be fine. its all good. Nothing bad will ever happen.. cuz some company has a display of 100 year old powder that should have been shot years ago but hasnt simply to make a point of how safe it all is.. S'all right.. Im done.. I can see I will not be able to get my point across.

OP as you can see your powder is still in fact quite viable and will serve you well at any time you should consider it is time to use it (up).

Ganderite.... You have my respects. No disrespect intended. I look forward to learning whatever you wish to teach me. All you other 4 digit posters.. DEFINITELY you all have MUCH more experience at "this game" than I do. I can honestly concede this. Ive been arguing the point of purpose of holding such substances for such long periods of time.. Time and chance are always running against you in the ether and chaos that surrounds us. If I buy reloading supplies its because I want to go out for a good days shooting. Nothing more.. I have just under 2 pounds of powder on hand at the moment and the nature of "the game" says that I too will in fact someday have scads of various half full containers in my magazine. I will always be holding some back as I develop my loads to the perfection and precision I seek. Some will always be left on the shelf because inevitably I will come back from the range thinking that an extra tenth of a grain will flatten out the trajectory just that much more or it will balance the velocity against the weight of the bullet to some magical combination that is absolutely unbeatable.. I dunno. Im a gunoob. Its just the way it is.. Just like a flyfisher has a bookful of dry flies, wet flies , nymphs and larvae.

Gotta be prepared for the situation. Yeah?

If you thought this was a stupid question... just like i said inthe very beginning... Just wait till you see what other stupid questions I have to ask!!
stupid question are far better than stupid mistakes... n'est pas? :cool:
 
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I see your point.. I trust you are storing that mass appropriately. The oil spot on the one container is worth looking into. But I see your point. Being a cheap a$$ myself.. I would have done the very same thing as you.. I wish I could do that.. but its not reasonable at this time and in my circumstance. If I had property backed onto crown land... There would be a lead and copper mine out back!

I can only imagine all the fun you've had over the years... and at a price far less than a lot of others here have had to pay.... Good on ya for such a lucky score!

I figure you have enough there for some 200,000-225,00 rounds of modestly loaded 308... that's a lot of trips to the range! and that's just a days worth of production for some factories out there!

My powder is stored in a magazine that used to be inspected twice a year. I say "used to be" because it no longer has tons of powder. The oil stain on the drum is because the drum has been empty for years. It is just one of many such empty drums around the farm that got used for storing tulip bulbs, bird feed, etc. That one is turned upside down and I use it as a work station for servicing my chain saws.

When you load 308 ammo by the hundreds of thousands and a lot of 50 cal ammo too, powder does not last long. Some powder was sold very cheap or just given to me free because I used to share my research results with the powder companies. Some powder companies are just chemical manufactures. What they know about how and why we use it you could stick in your ear and still have room for a banana.

Short story. I was begging a company, who shall remain nameless, to short cut long powders like 4064 and 4831 so it would meter better. They did not know what I meant by "meter". I asked to visit their test lab where they loaded their test ammo. The guy had a cereal bowl of powder, a beam scale and teaspoon. On the next visit I gave him a powder thrower. he was like a dog with 2 dicks.

Anyway, they made up a batch of short cutted powders. 4831, 4895 and another. They gave me the 2000 pounds of shot cut 4895 and told me they had tested it and it was no good, because it was identical to regular 4895. Of course to you and me, if it gave identical results, we would consider that a perfect outcome. That was good powder and it did not last very long. I may have only 2 pounds of it left. Too small a quantity to load in anything.

Here is what the short cut powder looked like. I called it 4896 just to differentiate it from the regular powder.
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The story has a terrible ending. I shared that powder with a lot of target shooters. They loved it. One of them was an American shooter, who in his day job was involved with the procurement of powders and ammo for the US Army. He wrote a letter asking that the "failed" powder not be destroyed, suggesting the idea was worth pursuing. He was also interested in a test we had done where we added moly to the final step of manufacturing, in addition to the graphite. They ignored him.

I have a copy of his letter. I never told the powder company (who shall remain nameless, of course) who he was and the significance of his day job. He was a target shooter and did not want it generally known.
 
interesting story. What is the terrible ending? Hopefully no harm was realized....
I am immensely jealous of your tonnage. I could have a lot and I mean A LOT (1) of fun with that. I never considered any 50 bmg loads.. there goes a barrel. and the bank account.
I tell ya... I could have 'some' fun with just 2 pounds too...

wouldnt short cutting the propellant actually give it more surface area and ultimately make it burn that much faster? I would think that this would be a factor.
 
interesting story. What is the terrible ending? Hopefully no harm was realized....
I am immensely jealous of your tonnage. I could have a lot and I mean A LOT (1) of fun with that. I never considered any 50 bmg loads.. there goes a barrel. and the bank account.
I tell ya... I could have 'some' fun with just 2 pounds too...

wouldn't short cutting the propellant actually give it more surface area and ultimately make it burn that much faster? I would think that this would be a factor.

At first blush, you would think a short cut powder would burn faster. more surface area. But the surface of a powder is infused with a deterrent (like DNT). A short cut powder has more surface area, and therefore has more area exposed to the deterrent, which slows the initial burn. And deterrents can be made thinner or deeper, so a powder is tweaked to give the desired burn characteristics. By good work and maybe some luck, the 4896 gave identical results to 4895, on the first test.

The "tragedy" is that they did not understand how to capitalise on an opportunity.

Keep asking questions. I enjoy explaining the basics to newbies.
 
interesting story. What is the terrible ending?

The terrible ending was that a Canadian company was first on the block with an idea and the technology to capitalize on that idea, putting them in position to be a world leader... but they had their heads shoved too goddamned far up their asses to see it and the opportunity was lost. A tragedy that has been far too common in this country.
 
I have some Noble shotgun #2 that I have no data for. Would anyone know of a source for said data. No idea of age any more but still looks and smells fine would like to try it sometime.

Just about every posting here reminds me of a story. A guy went into a British gunshop to buy a pound of Nobel Rifle #1 to load his heavy bullet 308 match rifle (for 1200 yard shooting). Clerk says "We are out of Rifle # 1, but we do have Pistol #1" "Ok", he says, "I'll try that."

He wanted a slow rifle powder like 4831 and went home with something like H110. 45 gr of it in a 308 apparently makes a big fireball. Melts brass cases, too.

Anyway, to address your question. I pulled out my 1985 Nobel loading manual. They switched from Shotgun 1, 2 and 3 to a new powder numbering system.

In the old Nobel system, #1 was the slowest powder. #3 the fastest. If I had that #2 powder, I would assume a speed of Unique, load low and work up in a pistol. I would not experiment in a shotgun.

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Thanks for your interesting story and info.

Pretty obvious what the "tragedy" was and why we stock up on powder.

Even a newbie with silly questions can turn out good when folks like you are kind and patient enough to respond. Keep it up.
...

The "tragedy" is that they did not understand how to capitalize on an opportunity.

Keep asking questions. I enjoy explaining the basics to newbies.
 
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