Hunting deer with ANTIQUE rifles in Ontario

Whelen B said:
The hunt originally mentioned in this thread was "muzzleloaders only" seasons - no shotguns allowed unless of the muzzleloading type.
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I know. I was just saying that with an antiques/ML season, I would get to use my Springfield for hunting, which I otherwise can't do in this region.

As far as reloading, I can reload my traditional caplocks fairly fast - much faster than my in-lines. I don't think I've ever had an opportunity to get a second consecutive shot off. I've also used black powder cartridge rifles on bear, and don't think I could have gotten a second shot off before they disappeared into the brush (thankfully, never had to. It's funny how 500 gr. of pure lead slows them right down.) I guess maybe if you are hunting in the open and had your second shell in your hand when you fired, you might get off another shot, but I really think it would be the exception much more than the rule. I've never timed myself, but I'm pretty sure it would take at least 2-3 seconds to reload and get your sight picture back. A deer can cover a lot of ground in 2-3 seconds. Anyhow, I'm not an authority on the subject, just going on past (limited) experience.
 
Antiques are pretty well defined by the CFC regs. The onus could very well be on the gun owner to carry some documentation from Flaydermans or simalar book to verify the antique status.
The Firearms Committee at the OFAH are going to discuss it in at a meeting and go from there. Don't hold your breathe on this one..............but maybe!
 
ali68 said:
Something is going to have to be well defined for it to be antiques because the people with replicas that look and function the same way as the antiques will want to use them in the season as well.
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Why? Surely the fact that a single shot 45 70 is a ##### to reload quickly makes it as difficult to hunt with. If you can only afford a replica then why should that be banned its about the difficulty of the hunt (the extended season) not the depth of your pockets or the foresight of your ancestors!
 
I thought allowing inlines was getting far enough off track for what was supposed to be a "primitive weapons" season. Sorry Willy, I don't like your idea at all. Lots of people already use single-shot cartridge rifles every fall during gun hunting season.
 
Personally I'm for a primitive season that would eliminate all the inlines and be limited to exposed hammer caplocks, flinters, matchlocks, or wheellocks with iron sights.

I believe some states go so far as to limit it to flinters with fixed iron sights and round ball only. That wouldn't hurt my feelings either.
 
Since we don't hunt with your style of firearm we should be excluded in the muzzle loader season,seems a bit elitist?
 
In Ontario it was always a muzzle loader season never a primitive weapon season(although they are only include, if a muzzle loader)
 
It should read "muzzleloaders and antique status firearms" All centerfire antiques are single shot by definitition. I'm in. I've been thinking of it for some time. Willy, PM me your phone number and we'll talk.
 
burnt_servo said:
easy way to fix this , use specific laguage saying " SINGLE SHOT ONLY " in the hunting regs , if they open up the season to antiques .
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What if you rechambered your single shot antique to .375 H&H? It would still qualify as an antique. Kinda beyond the intent and range of a muzzleloader season, though. Personally I can't see this working well, although it does appeal to me.
 
jethunter said:
What if you rechambered your single shot antique to .375 H&H? It would still qualify as an antique. Kinda beyond the intent and range of a muzzleloader season, though. Personally I can't see this working well, although it does appeal to me.
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Thats easy enough, to qualify it has to be chambered in a calibre that was commonly available then. It also helps if its no longer commercially available but what will you do with modern 45 70 ammo?
 
In Ontario it was always a muzzle loader season never a primitive weapon season
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yep - that's dead nutz right
It should read "muzzleloaders and antique status firearms" All centerfire antiques are single shot by definitition.
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not quite - there are many centerfire revolvers which are legal antique status too.
Thats easy enough, to qualify it has to be chambered in a calibre that was commonly available then.
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Easy enough concept. But that is not in keeping with the legal definition of an antique in Canadian law.
 
So should you be excluded from hunting because yours is a faithful but modern repro? Surely the point is about the difficulty of it not the depth of your pocket?
 
:evil:
tactical870 said:
It should read "muzzleloaders and antique status firearms" All centerfire antiques are single shot by definitition. I'm in. I've been thinking of it for some time. Willy, PM me your phone number and we'll talk.
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My 1898 M 96 swedish mauser is my favorite deer rifle. does it count?:evil::evil:
 
TimC said:
Thats easy enough, to qualify it has to be chambered in a calibre that was commonly available then. It also helps if its no longer commercially available but what will you do with modern 45 70 ammo?
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So, it should be chambered for a cartridge which is commercially unavailable. Yup, I bet the MNR jumps all over that.
 
No you miss the point, if the cartridge was available at the cut off date in theory then the round is antique, they arent going to make you hunt with 120 year old ammo are they? My point was what happens when you fire modern pressure full on 45 70 as opposed to one of an authentic for the time frame energy? So if I cant afford a high wall from before the date but shoot using a repro (were that allowed and it is in competitions where spirit of the original is enforced) how do you stop hunters using modern energy level ammo as opposed to authentic energy level ammo? Its a problem we have here with historic rifle shooting, how do you ensure someone isnt creating handloads in competition for a set range rather than to match original specs?
Range gamesmanship is appalling and thhere is no money at stake.
 
TimC said:
Thats easy enough, to qualify it has to be chambered in a calibre that was commonly available then. It also helps if its no longer commercially available but what will you do with modern 45 70 ammo?
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Whelen B said:
..Easy enough concept. But that is not in keeping with the legal definition of an antique in Canadian law.
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Whelen B has it right, but so many continually have it wrong. Antique Status has nothing to do with "availability of ammo".

This is an old Gun Shop myth and seems to stem from the twisted logic that since ammo for many antiques is not "commonly available", therefore that is part of the definition.
 
Andy said:
Whelen B has it right, but so many continually have it wrong. Antique Status has nothing to do with "availability of ammo".

This is an old Gun Shop myth and seems to stem from the twisted logic that since ammo for many antiques is not "commonly available", therefore that is part of the definition.
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At one time there was a version of the law that provided that a handgun would be deemed an antique if it did not accept commony available ammunition. To the best of my knowledge there was never a working definition of what this meant.
Perhaps this is where the commonly available ammunition tale originated.
 
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