Hunting - right type of bullet

sulisa

sulisa

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Here's a question for the group, semi-related to another current thread, that raised this question in my mind:

I just started hunting coyotes this past year, and only managed one so far. I use .223 with Hornady V-Max 60s. What do you think about VMax-type bullets versus FMJ for coyotes and foxes? We want to minimize damage to the pelts, but at the same time we don't want to have them escape wounded - obviously a careful aim will help greatly there, but in your opinion, which is the best one-shot bullet - an expanding or fragmenting bullet to give the best possible chance of a quick kill, or an FMJ to minimize damage to pelts?

Please chime in with your preference, and what caliber you use (I wonder if larger calibers would use FMJ, and smaller would try for an expanding round).

Larger rifle game hunters can chime in too - do you look for exit wounds (bleed holes and less damage to meat), or try to expend all the energy in the animal?
 
Any use of FMJ bullets will result in far more "hit and run" situations from which you will lose some animals, even though they will eventually die. I want expanding bullets to put the animal down as soon as possible. Clean, humane kills are more important to me than some pelt damage.

I use a .22-250 as my coyote gun, but have used others when "targets of opportunity" have presented.
 
I agree with rral22. A quick kill must be a much higher priority, and it can be achieved with bullets that often make only one hole in the hide. I would expect an fmj to have a higher incidence of producing an exit wound and more animals running away to die slowly. And if the pelt damage is critical, take up trapping.
 
I use my Swift for coyotes a lot, and while I have to give up some BC when I use it, the bullet that most frquently stays inside [no exit] and still kills very quickly is the Speer 52 grain HP.
The large open cavity seems to facilitate rapid disintegration inside the animal, with a lot of tissue damage and seldom an exit.
I have also used the 40 and 45 grain Ballistic Tips, but neither is quite as accurate in my Swift.
The 50 Ballistic Tip and the 50 V-Max are both very accurate, but almost always exit on a broadside shot, and the exit is not small! Regards, Eagleye.
 
Good frangible bullets like the Vmax usually ensure a caliber sized entrance hole and no exit. Even FMJ's can make a mess of a pelt if you hit a shoulder, etc and the bullet comes apart and exits or tumbles, etc. I have found the 60 grain Vmax to be one of the most accurate bullets I could find in .223 and it will always be a superior coyote bullet in my books.
 
I agree with you guys - if it can't be a quick kill, it's unnecessarily cruel.

Eagleye, I haven't researched Speers, but this must be the one you're using:
http://www.speer-bullets.com/ballistics/detail.aspx?id=134

It looks shorter than the Hornady V-Max 60gr I have now... I'd have to watch how far I could seat the bullet (I read that you should seat about a calibre-deep, so about .22 or so... what kind of OAL does that give you?)

Among my .223-eaters, I've used 55gr FMJBT match for range work, and kept the VMax for hunting and serious target shooting (well, serious for me is 300m or less). I'm running low on Vmax (one box left), so I think I'll branch-out and try new rounds. I'll see if I can find some Speers, Swifts, etc (any other recommendations?). My barrel is 1:9, so I think 50-60gr is about where I want to keep the weights.
 
The 52gr Speer HP is one accurate SOB. I just wouldn't try making accurate hits beyond ~400 yards with it, since it get blown around in the wind like an NDP politician.

I would stick with the 60gr V-Max and liver happily ever after.... ;)
 
Well, there's that too... I'm shooting cloverleafs at 100yds with the VMax, which should be accurate enough for hunting out to 300yds (assuming all the basics like braced-stable, breathing controlled, trigger press, etc, etc). Funny many of us just can't stop tweaking, customizing, replacing. It's an illness :)

So another vote for the Speer... I'll pick up a couple boxes and see how well I can get them running with the rifle.
 
I hit a 40 lb. male bush mutt the other day with a 67gr match bullet out of a .243 and the dog ran a solid 75 ydrs making it through a fence and into the ceder trees.
And it was well hit. Mid way up from the breast bone to the spine. Exit hole same as the entry hole. He took off so fast I thought Id missed. Last time for the bullet.

Minimal pelt damage yes. Bang flop no. I don't like that. If I would have had more time I'd have gone head shot , but it did not seem prudent at the time. So I went for the engine room.

Stick with a varmint bullet IMHO.

I like the 50gr. Hornady SX or Nosler Balistic Tip in the 22-250. and Sierra H.P. in the 243.

Regards
Rocco
 
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TPK said:
Where did you do your C.O.R.E. ??? It is ILLEGAL to hunt with FMJ .. period !
Click to expand...

Maybe if you're in CORE country... we have bigger problems around here, like only being able to hunt deer with a shotgun :(

I haven't researched FMJ for hunting - just pulled that from the other thread, for discussion and opinions... it wouldn't surprise me if it was legal somewhere... aren't people hunting with SKS and surplus ammo?
 
TPK, fmj bullets are generally prohibited for hunting Big Game (deer, moose, cougar, etc.) and is usually not specifically prohibited for small game and varmints.

Off the top of my head, I cannot recall the specifics for BC, but using AB for example, you can legally hunt Coyotes and other small game with FMJ bullets. IIRC Wolves are not considered "Big Game" here either, so same deal.

Your mileage may vary...
 
sulisa said:
Eagleye, I haven't researched Speers, but this must be the one you're using:
http://www.speer-bullets.com/ballistics/detail.aspx?id=134

It looks shorter than the Hornady V-Max 60gr I have now... I'd have to watch how far I could seat the bullet (I read that you should seat about a calibre-deep, so about .22 or so... what kind of OAL does that give you?)
Click to expand...

Sulisa; That is the bullet!! As Jordan Smith so eloquently stated, it is not a bullet to use at extreme ranges, but within 400 yards [95% of all shots taken] it is one deadly projectile.
I am not at home right now, so do not have the COL for that load, but my M77 Tang-safety Ruger has a fairly short throat, so no issue with at least a full .224" in the case.
I have used the 60 V-max, but about 3 out of 5 exit, and it's not pretty when they do! I can drive the 55 to just over 3900, and the 60 to 3750 in my Swift. Regards, Eagleye.
 
My humble apologies for the multiple posts. I have no idea what happened there, since I only posted once. It seemed a long time to enter, but otherwise, just a normal entry???? Eagleye.
 
I'll pick some up for sure, "you don't have to tell me twice" (or four times) ;)

At the risk of derailing my own topic, I don't think I'd try to shoot a yote beyond 300yds with my .223 anyway - I'm not that experienced yet to make the right shot, and though the bullet drop seems to be approximately 12" at 300, if I remember, it's something like 30" at 400yds. Surely beyond 400, there can't be much speed and power left in a shot? Plus wind, target movement, and that drop again...

Edit: My wife communicates with me the same way, so no harm :)
 
Pudelpointer said:
TPK, fmj bullets are generally prohibited for hunting Big Game (deer, moose, cougar, etc.) and is usually not specifically prohibited for small game and varmints.

Off the top of my head, I cannot recall the specifics for BC, but using AB for example, you can legally hunt Coyotes and other small game with FMJ bullets. IIRC Wolves are not considered "Big Game" here either, so same deal.

Your mileage may vary...
Click to expand...

I would have thought that this would be more uniform between the Provinces as it's a matter of ethics .. but maybe not. In any case, in BC it is definitely illegal (section 17.1).
 
These bullet selection threads appear every Fall/Winter on CGN, one of them should just get stickied. IMHO varmint bullets are the only choice for coyotes if you are concerned about pelt damage. FMJ's will work but you will lose animals. Expanding big game bullets will give you bangflops but the exit wound will NOT make you happy. I use the Hornady VMAX bullet, & recommend it highly. Small entry hole, no exit! BTW FMJ's are legal in Bantario :eek:

George
 
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