That mirrors my findings as well, the Amax and ELD m are both more consistent and penetrate deeper than the SST.
Zero qualms using the ELD m on game, but I won’t use an SST on anything.
Hunting with ELD Ms
- Thread starter 156821
- Start date
That mirrors my findings as well, the Amax and ELD m are both more consistent and penetrate deeper than the SST.
Zero qualms using the ELD m on game, but I won’t use an SST on anything.
There's a reason that hunters tend to use solids on elephants, but not for lion.
I prefer my game to die suddenly, as close as possible to where I shot it. I don't care too much about meat damage in most cases. I like a fairly frangible bullets simply because they kill fast. I don't care if it's not a fashionable bullet.
I think we overthink deer bullets. Deer are human sized, and the math for calculating bullet performance requirements on deer is not complicated. It starts to matter more on bigger animals.
I prefer my game to die suddenly, as close as possible to where I shot it. I don't care too much about meat damage in most cases. I like a fairly frangible bullets simply because they kill fast. I don't care if it's not a fashionable bullet.
I think we overthink deer bullets. Deer are human sized, and the math for calculating bullet performance requirements on deer is not complicated. It starts to matter more on bigger animals.
It bothers me to see you posting something I agree with. Please stop.I’m having dejavu, i can’t get past about 20 seconds of this guy in a Ben stiller kind of way. But recollection he hit a muley doe around 560 in not best spot on animal and thought he lost it. Yet it slowed it down enough he got a second chance either later in day or next day? Ringing a bell? I couldn’t suffer the video and his voice again.
So he got his animal despite his p1ss poor placement. We all know nothing short of a bazooka can save you from poor placement.
I probably posted in his comments that had he been using a tougher bullet that did less internal work he probably wouldn’t have done enough damage to get his 2nd chance. Remember his shot placement was bad lol, I pointed out the eldm will give you more chance to save the day for your poor shooting than anything else.
Not sure where his logic went but right out the window sounds about right. At that distance the only thing that saved him was that he was shooting an eldm. An x likely do same. If you can tell difference when knife comes out then I’ve got some cheap ocean front property for sale in Arizona for ya.
Now run an accubond or fusion or copper and see if he ever saw that doe again. Not a chance. This guy is straight click bait clown.
Anyway...he got lucky and he should have praised the eldm that actually saved him rather than just make another YouTube for clicks.
I won’t comment on shooting game with match bullets, as I’ve not done it but if fragmentation is the result I’ll stick to cup and core or bonded.
In all the deer I’ve shot with plain old cup and cores I’ve had two cuts of meat with fragments of lead/copper in them, one was a pellet from an air rifle lol.
In all the deer I’ve shot with plain old cup and cores I’ve had two cuts of meat with fragments of lead/copper in them, one was a pellet from an air rifle lol.
Out of curiosity:
If the manufacturers state that you should not use their match bullet for hunting, because the bullet was not designed for that purpose and they cannot guarantee on-game performance; Why would you?
And:
Doesn't the targeted game animal deserve more respect than that?
Thoughts to ponder...
Well, the manufacturers cannot guarantee that a bullet designed for hunting will kill any better either.
There is such devision among hunters on bullet performance ie. Wanting them to exit, not exit, controlled expansion, rapid expansion, etc. That I really think it is a non issue and up to the the hunter themselves .
As far as respect for an animal goes, as quick a death as possible is the goal, and there are many instances where these so called match bullets have killed faster than many hunting type bullets from what I have seen over the years .
Cat
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Lmao and totally agree.
Division actually originates a ton from marketing. In days before where we didn’t know what we didn’t know and ran low sd cup and cores from slow twist stuff we struggled with penetration, and to solve for it we had to make things tougher, or run the heaviest for caliber choices of the narrow band of choices given.
So we battle many decades of pretty mushroom delayed controlled expansion marketing and the dogma handed down.
That’s all this is.
The choice to know is ours now. 1000x more and real info is available now so it’s just the old institutions crumbling in light of more knowledge and experience that shatters all things ‘marketing’...marketing is to sell, for dollars, nothing more.
Good news is there’s more choices now for the drt to eat to the hole crowds than ever before. Whatever you prefer you can buy it off the shelf or reload it. Times are good.
Just remember, a bullet is the engine and does the work, it does not care what is written on the box or how it is sold. It just does it’s business. People quickly find out if they work for matches, or killing, or both...faster than ever now.
What Kodiak said. Just the new cup and cores are often marketed as match because they are more streamlined to fight atmospherics and make easier to go further on a grain of powder. That’s the only difference. Modern cup core vs old cup core. Match marketing vs corelokt or power shok marketing lol.
“Because I said so” has never really worked on me. YMMV.
The Amax was originally sold as a medium game/target bullet. About the time that Hornady started getting M/LE contracts that had to follow the Hague Convention that stipulated hunting bullets couldn’t be used for warfare they stopped labeling the Amax as a hunting bullet.
I personally had spectacular results from the Amax on animals so tried the ELD m since it was the replacement bullet for the Amax. Same wonderful results. I applied some critical thinking and deduced that the ELD m would work just fine, even though it didn’t resemble a magazine picture that seemed to be all the rage for marketing.
I reached out to Hornady to ask a couple of questions about the 88gr ELD m specifically and my results with them on moose, and the tech replied with “Thats great, but you should be using the 80 ELD x on game. Thats our hunting bullet.” When pressed on actual results, the only reply was “but it’s our hunting bullet.”
I have no reason to use a bullet that has many people reporting less than desired results, versus a bullet that has great reported results, which mirror what I see.
Other companies do it the opposite way, Berger went “hey, lots of people are using our bullets for critters, lets explore that” and then they recommended that people use the thinner jacketed bullet for game and renamed it a hunting bullet because some people get hung up on labels, and recommend the thicker jacket bullet for targets. Go figure.
As to your ethics comment, I prefer animals to die as fast as possible. ELD m’s are without peer in that regard.
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sorry sweety, but i don't want to go steady.We’re just getting warmed up brother
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bearkilr
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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- Nowhere, ......just past the middle
The Hague Convention stipulates that expanding bullets can't be used by the military, the AMax still falls under that category, regardless of what it's labeled as.
Law enforcement agencies don't have to follow that aspect of the Hague Convention so they can use expanding bullets.
Well Kodiakhntr, Im so relieved to know that your on such great terms with the folks at Hornady to be privey to all the juicy info. It must be due to you informing them that they dont know how to make bullets or test them and theyre so grateful for staightening them out. Im foreshadowing a job offer in the near future. Maybe jobs for all three of you. I surely hope the rest of our members appreciate all that youve repeatedly educated us on. Forever in your debt for the enlightenment. I think however Ill just keep shooting Trophy Bonded and Accubonds. I dont seem to have the big trailing jobs that youve encountered! I also get to eat more meat without sorting thru the red Jello and trimming till the sun comes up. Been there and done that with the early Nosler Ballistic tip grenades that blew melon sized holes in game. YEP died rite there but what a FUXCKING MESS AND WASTE. Thanks again
Hand Skills
CGN Regular
- Location
- In the 'heartland', southern SK
It's been done
The ELD-X has additional hollow point behind the tip to 'aid' in expansion.
Just because something sounds like a good idea doesn't mean it is a good one.
*some* people think can result in erratic tip ejection, which might explain inconsistent terminal performance MANY users have reported.
I'll take ELD-M over ELD-X as a hunting bullet myself.
Soooooo thats a no then? You haven’t used the ELD m’s on game?
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