I hate shotguns ....... and my new 870

JACKSMYDOG

JACKSMYDOG

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Long winded ramblings of how I do not like shotguns, but own 3, and just built a pretty well rounded home defense gun. Skip to the bottom for pics, and avoid the nonsense ;)

So I've never been a fan. I do not hunt, I think there are other platforms that serve my home or bush defense needs better. I think they are slow to load and slow to cycle, ammo is big and bulky, ammo is tough to carry ‘ready to load’ and secure, and ammo is target and range specific. Semi-autos and box magazines help, but still big heavy mags and limited carry ability with 5 round mags. With that said I know pumps are extremely reliable, and 12G can be devastatingly effective for defense.

Tangent ~ My nephew got into shooting sports for about 5 minutes, so his parents had my buy him a 20G 870 for his birthday, while waiting for his PAL. I bought it kept it at my house, but it was his to build, and take once his PAL came though. While waiting for parts to come in, he lost interest and I was left with a box of parts, and him with no PAL. I bought it from him (paid too much for a box of parts) finished it all off, and hung it on the wall. The more I saw it the more I liked the look, and had grown on me so much I set it up as my HD gun, and then really wanted to do a 12G build.

So tube magazine, pump action, 3" chamber, 6 round capacity, 18-20 inch bead sight smooth bore, likely to get MAGPUL SGA stock and MOE forend. I also wanted an 6 shell magazine, not a 4 shell with +2 extension. I only found the long magazine on Police models, which was great for a better built gun, but new they are approaching $1K, plus a Mapul SGA stock and MOE forend. Add all the other bits and it's over $2K before it long, for a 870? Even after getting my head around that, I couldn't find a long tube model in Canada... SON-OF-A!!!!

Then, BAM, this comes along and the only thing it's missing is "Police" instead of "Express Tactical". Now, I'm looking at $650 for the Express with stock and forend installed, way less than the Police (which I couldn't find anyway) and it's in stock ready to go.

http://www.bullseyelondon.com/remington-870-express-tactical-magpul-pump-action-shotgun-12-gauge-18-5-barrel-3-chamber-6-rounds-black-magpul-sga-stock-and-m-lok-forend-matte-blued-81192.html

BIG kudos out to Bullseye Sports. I called the order in at 10:30am Tuesday morning, it arrived by Canada Post 11:30am Wednesday morning, with free shipping!!! Pleasure to deal with BULLSEYE SPORTS!!!

Remington 870 Express Tactical Magpul Edition comes with;
SGA Stock
MOE forend

I added;
-SGA single point loop
-M-lok single rail section, left side forend for tac-light
-Streamlight TLR-1s
-Mesa Tactical full saddle, with 6 pack side carrier.
-Vortex Sparc
-Forward sling point/extension brace and rear QD point on SGA stock.
-Hi-viz aluminum low drag follower on route.
-Still need a 3 point sling too.

After installing the Mesa saddle, I’m not sure about it. Maybe after some tuning it will tighten up enough, but I definitely have a little wiggle right now. Functionally, it is great. The low mount Sparc is very usable, and if it fails, the bead sight can be used through the channel under the rail. Awesome… if it can be adequately tightened and stay that way. I know there are also complaints on the side saddle with the rubber wearing out, or shrinking and loosing grip as the temperature drops. I have a few ideas for alternate shell retention, if I have problems, again, I’ll have to see how things evolve. I got the saddle in a box lot I bought, and essentially it was free. Hopefully it works out, I like the use, and look of it.

Although I would have preferred a Police model, I think I can live with this, for all the use it will get. I think the gun looks great, and has all the bells and whistles I could think of. I guess a tritium bead and maybe a black on black cerakote job, then hang it on the wall un-fired, because I still don’t like shotguns. I also don't have any shells for it, north of 40,000 rounds here, and not a single 12G shell?

Did I mention ramblings ;)

Anyway here is my Remington 870 Express Tactical Magpul Edition with extras, and already scratches on the barrel and magazine cap (because I am like animal).

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Like you I started out with the Express, but I longed for the Police Model only for emotional reasons and the hype, and the LCF, looks cool factor. Hahahahaha

I went through a couple of Express guns and found 14” Remmy factory barrels for them and as time went by, my boys obtained their PALS and now they live in BC and carry said bear protection rigs.

I just love my simple 18” sighted slug barrel along with a 21” turkey barrel with screw in chokes and I’m ready for most 12 gauge fun. :cool:

Enjoy the 870 addiction! :wave:

Cheers, Barney
 
Greenhorse six said:
Nice set up , only thing I'd change would be to drop the receiver single point sling point and go with a QD point on the stock along with a magpul sling that'll change from 2 point to 1 point , the one point being more for weapon retention , rather then carry , just saying .
Click to expand...

Greenhorse six said:
Nice set up , only thing I'd change would be to drop the receiver single point sling point and go with a QD point on the stock along with a magpul sling that'll change from 2 point to 1 point , the one point being more for weapon retention , rather then carry , just saying .
Click to expand...

So my thinking with the slings is;

On tactical guns I like the versatility of traditional sling hooks (take your choice of which variety) over QD points. I have standard sling loops on all my other guns, which I do not want to convert, and then need to replace 3 slings as well. So I'm sticking with non-QD for now.

The magpul foreward sling point loop is on the right side of this gun. The SGA stock is getting a QD point installed once it arrives, and a simple push button D-loop. Then I can carry from the right side of the shotgun using my current slings.

Right side
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A traditional 3 point sling can be used single point mode on the left side with magpul single point lloop for in-use retention.

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Also on the left there is a QD point built in to the Magpul Forward sling mount. I can install the D-ring there when switching from carry to in-use, and be able to convert the 3 point sling back to 2 point using the forward D-ring in a pinch.

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The D-loop is getting updated with a more compact version.
http://www.nordicmarksman.com/Recessed-Plunger-HD-D-Loop-Push-Button-Swivels.html

The draw back to right side carry is, transition from carry to in-use will likely loose a second. And then a few more to bring the sling over if needed. Otherwise I think it allows for better carry without the shell carrier and light as factors.

Am I nuckin futs?
 
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I don't see a 3 point sling there, and using a 3 point sling on a pump action gun is pretty much begging to fail - they're tough enough not to screw yourself with when used on an AR, never mind trying to pump a shotgun slide. Note also that given the weight and length of these shotguns, you will nut yourself with a single point, if you want to use your hands for something other than holding the gun.
 
I've had 3 870 wingmasters. First one was bought at cabelas for $275. It qas a 28" 1974(?)wingmaster with an awesome corncov forend. Smooth as silk but I had to sell it. I miss it though.

Second was another wingmaster which I was told was a police model. Paid $325. It had a black finish but was beat up pretty good. Came with 18.5" bbl and light wood police furniture. Also had to sell to fund another toy.

Now I have this. View attachment 214778
Another wingmaster (1972?). With an 18.5" bbl from an express. Got a choate stock with a small corn cob forend. Got a +2 extension from tacord which is my favorite extension so far. This one is the keeper. Very solid. Its a budget build, but more than adequate. I'm not a shotgun guy but I had to have one of decent quality and in a "tactical" configuration to make me complete.

I paid $300 for the shotgun including aboht 130 rds of ammo (buck and target shot), sold the stock set it came in to pay for the choate stock and broke even there. + 2 ext was about $100. So altogether $400 including the ammo that I still havent used up. Could not be happier and dont feel like i needed to spend more. Old Wingmasters are where its at.
 
I think your trying to turn your shotgun into a rifle... it’s not a rifle. So use it like a shotgun.

A sling on a shotgun is for carry. That’s it. There is no other real world application. Single points are used with breachers for retention (so it’s not dropped) as they are holstered. A basic two point is the way to go.

Pull the red-dot off and get rid of the rail, use the bead sight and practice. A bead sight isn’t “tacticool” it’s just “tactical” on a shotgun... A red dot is only good for slug hunting.

If you want a real tactical shotgun look at how the military sets them up. Basic as possible because... it’s a shotgun!
 
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If it's for defense in close quarters Sir, NOTHING will terminally f**k up ANYTHING like a single trigger pull of 12ga 00 buck...
I only own one shotgun (20" open bore old school model 12) and that is the single only reason I own it.
Within 20 Meters nothing can surpass the effectiveness of a shotgun firing buck shot in terms of immediate stopping power and hit probability with one single round fired.
Aside from that I have zero use for them and would agree with you but that's why I only own one lol
 
enefgee said:
I don't see a 3 point sling there, and using a 3 point sling on a pump action gun is pretty much begging to fail - they're tough enough not to screw yourself with when used on an AR, never mind trying to pump a shotgun slide. Note also that given the weight and length of these shotguns, you will nut yourself with a single point, if you want to use your hands for something other than holding the gun.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry not a 3 point sling, convertible sling from single to 2 point. Using single point for retention, 2 point for carry.
 
JACKSMYDOG said:
I'm sorry not a 3 point sling, convertible sling from single to 2 point. Using single point for retention, 2 point for carry.
Click to expand...

problem with using a convertible is that the 1 point setup is too close to the middle of the firearm, while with a 2 point having it setup reawards on the stock means the rifle doesnt swing too low when you drop it to use your pistol.
 
I'm rarely in this forum (tactical shotguns) but I take a peek in here once in a while. I am sincerely puzzled by the thread starter, and the OP's goals. Build-up an 870 Express with a ton of add-ons then not shoot it? Yes, it would be a somewhat intimidating-looking wall hanger, just a massive departure from how I see/use shotguns myself. Were I being asked for advice on the matter, I'd say slow down...strip the gun down to the essentials...shoot it a WHOLE lot...then decide what add-ons make the most sense. Not carrying? Forget the sling. Not shooting slugs? Lose the optics. No likelihood of being in a gun battle? Lose the shell carrier.

Goes without saying, but I'll say it anyway~in all but a few cases/applications (slugs+hunting) you kind of point shotguns..not aim them. Getting good/fast at loading, shouldering, pointing and getting a shot-off will not be an easier task without extra weight and clunky add-ons. I've never been in the situation of having to defend myself with a firearm (and hope I never do) but do have strong sense of how fast I can load/shoot, and how likely I am to hit my targets. Over 3 decades of shooting clays, and dozens of days hunting with them certainly plays into that. I might add, when you buy a shotgun and shoot it allot, you not only get better...but the gun itself changes personalities a bit. Runs smoother, feels lighter (=muscle memory?) you notice recoil less, etc. In other words, an untouched....uncessarily-heavy/bulky shotgun you don't have any experience shooting will not be a huge asset if the chips are down. At least, I can't imagine it would be.

Shotguns are a blast, for everything they are...and for what they're not. They do a great job of rearranging close range targets, so at least buy a case of target loads..round-up some reactive targets, and get to know that thing. I often can't go a week without shooting one shotgun or another. I love almost everything about them. Current favorite fun gun is a Mossberg 500 Persuader, 7+1, parkerized, bead sight, and nothing else. Contemplating a decent light for it...but I've been contemplating a light on a shotgun for over 10 years and still haven't put one on. lol

As for add-ons/what I'd do with that gun? (not that anyone cares) Upgrade the extractor, polish the chamber, lose the shell carrier and optic, thread the barrel for choke tubes, and shoot the heck out of it. Maybe consider shooting some clays, a discipline like skeet where you need to be good at shooting while swinging, following-through, etc. Unlikely to score well with a short barrel shotgun and you experience level, but it would be fun. Might have more success with trap. I'd suggest a standard buttstock and something like a Surefire forend if budget allows...but those come from not being a huge fan of the MagPul stuff.

I like 870s, and have had a number of them over the years. Including an 870P (all stock/no add-ons) I like them, they're reliable and super easy to work on. I hope you take these comments in the spirit they were offered.

Cheers!
 
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