Ideal sks scope mount

PECHENEG

PECHENEG

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Hi guys,

Do you know anybody who can manufacture something like a combo of extended choate scope mount rail or similar and a front piece from a KWIK rail, which will attach via rear sight screw/pin ...
you may even combine the Magwedge gen 2.0 rail (except it has to be elevated to allow cleaning of the bolt), the front/ middle piece of it (which allows stripper clips) AND choate rail style in the rear.

Such rail will have two advantages:
1. will hold zero forever as the rear piece will be tapped. no matter what you tell me about magwedge/ kwik rail,,, sooner or later it wont hold zero 'coz that pin in the rear will become loose
2. it will be elevated like choate mount, which will make cleaning an easy task, w/o any mounts to be removed.. again, choate mount is nice coz it allows you bolt cleaning w/o removal of the rail


forget me my crazy drawing, something like this:
sks_rail.jpg



I don't care about anti-drill and tape ppl
 
rail maybe removable just like below, but has a long length and the front piece has to be stabilized to the former rear sight pin/ screw

MkEzRUIxNUE3RTI0RjEyODVCRkY6NDJlYjc4YjNhNGU0MTQyYmY4NTc3OGM3ZTJhNWE1NzM6Ojo6OjA=


no matter how good is the metal the front piece in such construction will always bounce unless you stabilize it with an additional mount point like it is used in kwik rail/ magwedge rail
 
PECHENEG said:
Hi guys,

Do you know anybody who can manufacture something like a combo of extended choate scope mount rail or similar and a front piece from a KWIK rail, which will attach via rear sight screw/pin ...
you may even combine the Magwedge gen 2.0 rail (except it has to be elevated to allow cleaning of the bolt), the front/ middle piece of it (which allows stripper clips) AND choate rail style in the rear.

Such rail will have two advantages:
1. will hold zero forever as the rear piece will be tapped. no matter what you tell me about magwedge/ kwik rail,,, sooner or later it wont hold zero 'coz that pin in the rear will become loose
Click to expand...

I have never understood how you think that pin at the back comes loose, as its tagged straight into the receiver

now there may be some very slight movement because of the hole dimension being slightly over sized, but all this would do is slightly open up your groups, and not cause a loss of zero

as to not caring about anti drill and tap people, it seems to me consistent with the design of the SKS rifle to avoid drill and tap ... the rifle is not a precision rig, its a quick and dirty shooter with an emphasis on convenience of maintenance and use

it is also a milsurp and in many a milsurp owner beats the heart of a collector who hates to modify his/her rifles permanently

when I set out to create the flip style rail system (magwedge kwik rails) I had the following criteria in mind:

1. must hold zero
2. must not interfere with convenience of use/cleaning
3. must allow versatility in choice of optics (full length rail)
4. must be a drop in install with a minimum effort required
5. it must be reasonable to use and not place the shooter in ridiculous shooting positions (mount too high for ex, or scope hanging near the back end of the rifle)

I suppose I sit firmly in the anti D&T camp as I believe it typically violates criteria 2, 4 and 5 above
 
MagWedge Industries said:
I have never understood how you think that pin at the back comes loose, as its tagged straight into the receiver

now there may be some very slight movement because of the hole dimension being slightly over sized, but all this would do is slightly open up your groups, and not cause a loss of zero

as to not caring about anti drill and tap people, it seems to me consistent with the design of the SKS rifle to avoid drill and tap ... the rifle is not a precision rig, its a quick and dirty shooter with an emphasis on convenience of maintenance and use

it is also a milsurp and in many a milsurp owner beats the heart of a collector who hates to modify his/her rifles permanently

when I set out to create the flip style rail system (magwedge kwik rails) I had the following criteria in mind:

1. must hold zero
2. must not interfere with convenience of use/cleaning
3. must allow versatility in choice of optics (full length rail)
4. must be a drop in install with a minimum effort required
5. it must be reasonable to use and not place the shooter in ridiculous shooting positions (mount too high for ex, or scope hanging near the back end of the rifle)

I suppose I sit firmly in the anti D&T camp as I believe it typically violates criteria 2, 4 and 5 above
Click to expand...

1. my friend had your rail and after 10 cleanings the screw became a bit loose and the thread for the allan key was almost gone...with mechanical friction anything will become loose.. sure some ppl take 10 cleanings, some 1000.. but it will happen.. it is inevitable physics of living on this PLANET: if you take pin/ screw out to clean repetitively it will become loose eventually.. it is suboptimal compared to red lock tight forever screw-no argue about that... unless we are not talking EARTH
2. Besides, I don't like the idea of moving my scope up/ down every time I have to clean the rifle
3. Again, minimal effort-minimal results, non-removable screws will be never comparable to removable screws/pins, big time. I don't mind basic drill+tap. Some ppl like to keep the rifle as original as possible and those ppl mind anything you do to the rifle, if you install something, even it is reversible, you are not a collector type guy, you may sacrifice 270$ and all you are looking is drop and play thing without any drilling... if those ppl were more or less proficient with basic skills, they would drill... otherwise.. they are looking for an easy way of rifle mod, those ppl don't shoot a lot and they are your market. If you go through 1000 rounds per month removing the rear pin/ screw becomes not only annoying, but crazy and potentially affects optics... this is mechanics-see above

that's it, I am not here to argue with you, I am here to ask if somebody will make a better rail. your rail is OK, but not good to me because:
1. see above re: repetitive cleaning etc etc etc
2. to clean I have to remove your rail with scope/ sights on it not being integrated with the receiver-I don't like that idea

Some people like your rail-sure and they are your market. I just described what type of ppl they are.
I see weakness to this type of rail and want the rail I described in OP.
 
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let me clarify about magwedge rail again:

IT IS ONE OF THE BEST RAILS-NO DOUBT, but it has weak points see above

Typical users who choose magwedge rail are one of the following:
1. quick and easy ppl
2. quick and easy ppl who have no basic skills or whose hands grow from the as.s
3. ppl who just OK with it
4. ppl who do not shoot a lot/ clean rifle a lot
5. ppl who want to keep their changes reversible
6. lazy ppl
7. ppl who do not understand the mechanics on planet EARTH
 
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PECHENEG said:
1. my friend had your rail and after 10 cleanings the screw became a bit loose and the thread for the allan key was almost gone...with mechanical friction anything will become loose.. sure some ppl take 10 cleanings, some 1000.. but it will happen.. it is inevitable physics of living on this PLANET: if you take pin/ screw out to clean repetitively it will become loose eventually.. it is suboptimal compared to red lock tight forever screw-no argue about that... unless we are not talking EARTH
Click to expand...

I don't see a problem with changing out worn out parts such as screws.

Obviously I cannot speak to your friends experience but if a screw wears out extremely quickly it is either defective or perhaps there is some operator error.

Either way he is welcome to contact me for a replacement.
 
I see nothing wrong with replacing a worn screw either, no different than having to clean the rifle , just basic maintenance .
very happy with my mag wedge rail but would like to hear a real life report from someone that has that crazy ivan mount also.

Any mount for an SKS is going to be some sort of compromise , pick your battles
 
I bought an SKS that had already been modified and was not eligible for restoration back to original so no good milsurps were harmed in the making of this build. I decided to tweak it to suit my needs so I did a home made, drill & tap scope mount out of a piece of steel angle iron, mounted a good rail, rings, and scope. Sure, I have to remove the whole thing for a strip-down cleaning, but since I reload with good clean powder and commercial bullets, it doesn't get fouled like the corrosive stuff will. Added bonus is (so far) before I remove the scope/mount assembly I mark the screw heads as to location on the receiver. When I go to reassemble the rifle, I tighten the screws back to original location and it seems to go back to zero just fine. After a shoot, I clean the gas system and the bore and do a full cleaning after hunting season and I've had no problems with corrosion. It shoots a 2" group at 100 yds. so it's acceptable for a deer rifle where we hunt. As was mentioned, almost everything is a compromise and has it's good points and it's drawbacks. At the end of the day, it's the owners choice how he/she decides what route to go.
 
My personal experience with those style of mounts is the same as OP. Yes the pin fits tight in the receiver. BUT the mount doesn't fit tight around the pin lol. The moment the bolts come loose at the back, the rail in most cases has about 1/16" of up and down play. If u keep the bolts tight, I noticed after considerable use, the mounts aluminum gets slowly chewed away buy the bolt heads.
 
Yes, there is no an ideal mount.
Again, the more you disturb something, the more moving parts and especially repetitively moving parts, the worse it is.
If you don't use corrosive ammo and use scope on SKS... then sure the magwedge rail should be just fine... if you use SKS the way it was designed-tactical storm/ CQC / battle rifle and you design it to be used with any ammo/ SHTF, then magwedge rail is suboptimal BIG TIME

As nobody is willing to manufacture the one I want, I guess, I will go for choate (rear sight + red dot) + scout (front sight), cut the barrel to 18.5" or cut the barrel and restore the front sight and no need to choate and back-up sights to be elevated to picatinny's

By the way the rail from Crazy Ivan: https://nebula.wsimg.com/obj/MkEzRU...4YjNhNGU0MTQyYmY4NTc3OGM3ZTJhNWE1NzM6Ojo6OjA= is too low and you have to take it out to clean your rifle... they just wrote to me today satting this significant limitation. that's why i don't consider it anymore. there are of course POSP style slide in side mounts, but they are quite expensive
 
That's because the best mounts are already made.... The choate drill tap mount, the promag drill tap mount, or the Russian molot style to attach a side rail or optic.

If u want stripper clip usage.... Mount the mount back further to allow room. But don't expect to use a scope.

If u want to use a scope without stripper clip usage, mount the mount more forward. If u what the option for both, get the Russian side mount.
 
ComradeVlad said:
That's because the best mounts are already made.... The choate drill tap mount, the promag drill tap mount, or the Russian molot style to attach a side rail or optic.

If u want stripper clip usage.... Mount the mount back further to allow room. But don't expect to use a scope.

If u want to use a scope without stripper clip usage, mount the mount more forward. If u what the option for both, get the Russian side mount.
Click to expand...

I already have three installed-Russian original mounts, which choate/ promag copied
now I am thinking about creating a shorter version 18.5" sks, but then the question comes how to recover the back-up sights:
option A is to take the rear sight off and mount a flip-up front sight there and the rear sight will go all the way to the back of the newly installed rail
option B is to recover the front sight and remount it somehow, closer to the gas tube, but then the sighting distance, between front and rear sights may be shorter than in option A
 
For you guys that have used a drill & tap mount, do you think tech sights would still be useable?
I love my tech sight and want to retain it but would be interested in a scope or red dot for fun.
 
I had a quick rail (not sure if it was the magwedge brand) and it held zero nearly perfectly, even after cleaning. if you have some slop in it, you can shim it so it stays tight. mine fit perfectly tho.
 
JVFriday13th said:
For you guys that have used a drill & tap mount, do you think tech sights would still be useable?
I love my tech sight and want to retain it but would be interested in a scope or red dot for fun.
Click to expand...

Cant see why it wouldnt work... just depends on how far back or forward you decide to drill & tap the mount at.
 
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