I'm holding an interresting shotgun right now

hitch.bd

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A friend asked me to give his shotgun a "once over" and tell him if it's worth using for going camping with.
I immediately said to myself,upon seeing it, no way!
It is like nothing I have ever seen before.

on the reciever it says "P BANNERMAN MANUFACTURER, NEW YORK, USA"
MODEL 1896

on the barrel it says "SPENCER RPTG. SHOT GUN PAT. APL. 1882

It is a Dimascius barrel
It is a pump action but the breach block is kind of like a rolling block.
The only serial # is on the curl behind the trigger guard and that looks as if it was hand stamped with number punchs. in this case 539*(it's not mine thus the * in place of the last diget)
One day I'll figure out how to post pictures but not today!
Any info on this firearm would be helpful.
regards, Hitch
 
Do not use it if it has a Damascus barrel

http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=195644

DSC_0584.jpg


http://www.antiquearmsinc.com/spencer-shotgun.htm

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]This Spencer was the very first successful pump action shotgun to hit the market back in the year 1882. It was invented by Christopher Spencer, the same man who designed the Spencer rifle and carbine used in the Civil War. Spencer's design of a repeating shotgun was so advanced that it was more than a decade before Winchester or Marlin had a similar design to put on the market. This new design signaled the end to the dominance of the double barrel shotgun but due to financial troubles, Spencer sold his company in 1890. Still his shotgun was produced for another 17 years by Francis Bannerman. Over the years, we've found that the earliest examples made by Spencer are of considerably higher quality than those produced in later years. No doubt, he made these early guns with the intentions of competing directly with fine grade double barrels. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]This particular gun happens to be one of those early examples, possibly even a salesman or dealer sample given the workmanship and quality. Its a 12 gauge with a 30" barrel. The serial number is in the low 300 range and features fine scroll engraving and checkered walnut. Today, we think of modern pump shotguns as a lower quality mass-produced item, however this gun is built much more along the lines of a fine grade double barrel shotgun. While it was a vast improvement over the double barrel shotgun, it's constructed of the same materials and quality of workmanship as a high grade double barrel shotgun would have been during the 1880's. [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]For starters, the barrel is a fine pattern damascus steel similar to a Parker or Colt Double barrel. You can still see all of the pattern in the barrel. If that wasn't enough, the magazine tube is laminated twist steel as well....just incredible as it shows nearly all the original browning intact...I've never seen anything on a pump shotgun like this. This shotgun has the earliest style forend, about half as long as what Spencer later introduced....most of these early small forewood guns by Spencer were made of Gutta Percha, a 19th century product that is much like plastic...however this gun has a very nice checkered walnut forend. This is the first time I've ever seen a Spencer shotgun with the small forewood actually made of wood. I'm sure this was so costly to build, that they quickly realized that materials would have to be cheapened in order to turn a profit. Both stock and forewood are in VG+ to Fine condition retaining most of their original varnish along with a few handling marks and dings on the stock...no chips or cracks. Checkered Hard rubber/gutta percha buttplate is solid with no chips or cracks. The frame is case colored which 120 years laters are more light mottled colors that have mostly turned to silver in the most exposed areas while the more protected places still show bright colors, especially the loading block The receiver features fine scroll engraving is in the English style of tightly wound scroll floral vignettes with the company logo "Spencer Arms Co" engraved on the right side of the receiver in the middle. The left side features an engraved scene of a bird standing in front of a thicket. Fine floral patterns surround most of the screws, triggerguard, and borderline areas. The action arm cover still retains 75% original fire blue with traces of fire blue on a few of the screws. Screws overall are in very good condition. The action functions just like new...tight and precise like a finely tuned watch with an excellent bright shiny bore. For a gun built in the 1880's this old Spencer is in remarkably nice shape considering many of the ones you find nowadays are often complete wrecks showing decades of hard use and severe neglect. Given the high quality of workanship and materials found on an early production gun, the fine engraving, and the high condition, this is a truly unique example of the world's earliest pump shotgun.[/FONT]

11. 1882 Spencer Pump Action Shotgun

The Spencer was one of the first repeating
shotguns produced. This gun was first produced
1882 and a second model was introduced in 1896.
This gun both loaded and ejected shells from the
top.

Spencer-420x269.jpg
 
Thanks Can Am. That was what I immediately thought, dimascus= no shoot. I know you can't say without seeing it but do you think it would be worth anything? I ask because I know that will likely be the first question he asks me. Is there any way or place that I can find out how old it is as well? thanks again, Brad
 
I would estimate $400 as a selling price. But it is a rarish gun, with seemingly little collector interest, so it is really up to the buyer.

They stopped making them in 1902, so you have a narrow window of manuf. dates.
 
I've been happily(and safely) shooting damascus barreled shotguns for years, I use them for clay shooting and reload bismuth for duck and goose hunting. The Spencer would be a fine old pumpgun to use with properly loaded Black Powder shotshells, once you determine chamber length.
 
Bannerman of New York

It is possible that this shotgun was sold by the Bannerman Company, of New York City. Francis Bannerman bought huge amounts of surplus government equipment after the American Civil War, everything from knapsacks to cannon. After the Spanish-American War, he bought 90% of the captured Spanish guns. Eventually, he outgrew his storage facilities, and bought Polopel Island, in the Hudson River, near New York City. He erected huge signs on both sides of the Island, stating "Bannerman's Island Arsenal", where passing ship traffic could see them.

Bannerman had so much equipment for sale that he could equip an Army. He once offered to provide the Japanese complete equipment, from uniforms, boots, and arms for 100,000 men, plus the artillery to go along too. The U.S. Navy wanted to purchase some 6 inch guns from him, (they had sold them to him as surplus), and he provided them 30, including 2 free ones (for a price, of course.) He also provided $20,000 to mount them.

Bannerman's Island is now a State Park, public access denied. It still has the ruins of an old Castle that Frank Bannerman built to resemble those of his Scottish ancestry.

Bannerman published several catalogs, reprints of which are available from Internet sources. Very interesting pictures and advertising.

Bannerman's was in business until sometime in the 1960s.
 
There are the two schools of thought about shooting welded barrel guns.
Both points of view have been expressed. I tend to side with Ben.
Bannerman acquired the company's assets, and assembled and sold off the leftover guns.
These are interesting guns, have some collector interest, and would be a very poor choice for a gun to take camping.
Sell it to someone who would appreciate it.
Do not sell it to some CAS type with a hacksaw.
 
I'm waiting to find out what he wants to do with it. I'll keep you guys in the know as soon as I am. I told him today at work how old it is and that it is a gun to be respected not tossed into the trailer when going camping. He said that if he can't do that he has no use for it. I asked what he wanted me to do with it... he said hold on to it for now and he'd let his wife decide what she figured he should do with it. Unfortunately...it sounds like she has that hoarders thing where he can't even get rid of old news papers without, she puts up a big stink about it.
 
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