I meant as in minor time and effort to do.Triggers usually only take a few minutes to adjust,and taking off the pressure pad in the stock doesn't take much longer.Most rifles did well without having to glass bed the action,but I did bed some.I consider glass bedding more of a major change.
Inconsitency in Remington 700 CDL?
- Thread starter Slipery
- Start date
I meant as in minor time and effort to do.Triggers usually only take a few minutes to adjust,and taking off the pressure pad in the stock doesn't take much longer.Most rifles did well without having to glass bed the action,but I did bed some.I consider glass bedding more of a major change.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
I don't know what you previous shooting experience is, but lets walk through this and see if we can isolate whether it’s a gun problem or a marksmanship problem.
The first step is to ensure all screws are tight; this includes the base mount screws, the screws in the rings, and the action screws that hold the stock to the barreled action. It sounds as if you have the style of mount that can be adjusted for windage at the rear of the mount and the ring locks in the front of the base mount in a dovetail. If this is the style of mount you have, do not turn the ring into the dovetail with the scope; it must be done with a wrench. If you turned the mount into the dovetail with the scope tube it is possible you damaged the scope. If you turned the front ring into the dovetail with the scope tube, you should get a bore sighter with a grid like the Bushnell, and see if the scope adjustments move the cross hairs the correct amount. If not the scope will have to be repaired.
Next we want to set the scope for it's mechanical center. To do this, adjust the windage as far as the adjustments will allow and count the clicks as far as the adjustments can be moved. Now, divide the number of clicks by 2 and come back to that point and that is the scope's mechanical center.
Using the bore sighter, or bore sight by peering through the bore at a distant object, the more distant the better, and adjust the windage in the mount until the cross hair comes in line with the object you are bore sighted on. The rifle will have to be set in a gun cradle, either a commercial one or make one from a cardboard box that will hold the rifle snugly without allowing movement when you adjust the scope. Double check the object through the bore frequently to make sure nothing has moved. Don't worry about elevation right now, windage is the important thing.
Before you begin to live fire, try dry firing the rifle. At this time you will be able to determine if the scope is the coitrrect distance from your eye. You should be able to see a full sight picture without any shadows, and you should not have to slide you head around on the stock to get that full field of view. When you dry fire, watch the cross hair against the target and see if it moves off the target when the firing pin drops. If it moves even a hair, you need to work on your trigger control, breathing and follow through. It is possible that the trigger needs adjustment, either to lighten it, to reduce creep, or to reduce over travel. A good dry firing drill is to place a quarter on the top of the barrel near the muzzle and attempt to dry fire without disturbing the coin. When you can do that, you are ready to begin live fire.
Starting at 25 yards as you did was correct. This time, set the forend of the rifle on a sandbag, and put a second sandbag under the butt. A sock filled with sand works well under the butt. Because the rifle is a sporter, you will have to hold the rifle firmly when you fire, or it will throw the shots wide. Keep your support hand between the sandbag and the forend. You firing hand should have a firm, but not death grip on the pistol grip, and the first pad of your trigger finger, just below the fingertip, should engage the trigger. Take a couple of deep breaths, relax, place the cross hair on the bull, hold your breath at the natural pause between inhaling and exhaling and press the trigger. If the shot does not break within 5 seconds, stop and begin again. When the shot goes it should surprise you, but stay on the rifle and regain your sight picture. This is called follow through. Without getting out of position, work the bolt, moving your head just enough to prevent being hit by the bolt, then fire a second shot following these same steps, then a third. Check your target, and you should only have to make an elevation adjustment and perhaps a very minor windage adjustment. Leave the windage adjustment until you fire a 100 yard group. The bullet holes at 25 yards should form a single ragged hole.
Go back to 100 yards and fire another 3 shot group. Adjust the scope as required. Your group should be 2.5" or less. If possible fire a group at 200 yards and zero the scope to hit point of aim at that range.
The next time you go to the raqnge, check to see if the rifle shoots to the same point of aim. If not, was it becasue of anenvironmental change, (wind or temperature) or did something change with the rifle. If it was the rifle, that is a problem that should be addressed.
Now get off the bench, and begin shooting from field positions.
The first step is to ensure all screws are tight; this includes the base mount screws, the screws in the rings, and the action screws that hold the stock to the barreled action. It sounds as if you have the style of mount that can be adjusted for windage at the rear of the mount and the ring locks in the front of the base mount in a dovetail. If this is the style of mount you have, do not turn the ring into the dovetail with the scope; it must be done with a wrench. If you turned the mount into the dovetail with the scope tube it is possible you damaged the scope. If you turned the front ring into the dovetail with the scope tube, you should get a bore sighter with a grid like the Bushnell, and see if the scope adjustments move the cross hairs the correct amount. If not the scope will have to be repaired.
Next we want to set the scope for it's mechanical center. To do this, adjust the windage as far as the adjustments will allow and count the clicks as far as the adjustments can be moved. Now, divide the number of clicks by 2 and come back to that point and that is the scope's mechanical center.
Using the bore sighter, or bore sight by peering through the bore at a distant object, the more distant the better, and adjust the windage in the mount until the cross hair comes in line with the object you are bore sighted on. The rifle will have to be set in a gun cradle, either a commercial one or make one from a cardboard box that will hold the rifle snugly without allowing movement when you adjust the scope. Double check the object through the bore frequently to make sure nothing has moved. Don't worry about elevation right now, windage is the important thing.
Before you begin to live fire, try dry firing the rifle. At this time you will be able to determine if the scope is the coitrrect distance from your eye. You should be able to see a full sight picture without any shadows, and you should not have to slide you head around on the stock to get that full field of view. When you dry fire, watch the cross hair against the target and see if it moves off the target when the firing pin drops. If it moves even a hair, you need to work on your trigger control, breathing and follow through. It is possible that the trigger needs adjustment, either to lighten it, to reduce creep, or to reduce over travel. A good dry firing drill is to place a quarter on the top of the barrel near the muzzle and attempt to dry fire without disturbing the coin. When you can do that, you are ready to begin live fire.
Starting at 25 yards as you did was correct. This time, set the forend of the rifle on a sandbag, and put a second sandbag under the butt. A sock filled with sand works well under the butt. Because the rifle is a sporter, you will have to hold the rifle firmly when you fire, or it will throw the shots wide. Keep your support hand between the sandbag and the forend. You firing hand should have a firm, but not death grip on the pistol grip, and the first pad of your trigger finger, just below the fingertip, should engage the trigger. Take a couple of deep breaths, relax, place the cross hair on the bull, hold your breath at the natural pause between inhaling and exhaling and press the trigger. If the shot does not break within 5 seconds, stop and begin again. When the shot goes it should surprise you, but stay on the rifle and regain your sight picture. This is called follow through. Without getting out of position, work the bolt, moving your head just enough to prevent being hit by the bolt, then fire a second shot following these same steps, then a third. Check your target, and you should only have to make an elevation adjustment and perhaps a very minor windage adjustment. Leave the windage adjustment until you fire a 100 yard group. The bullet holes at 25 yards should form a single ragged hole.
Go back to 100 yards and fire another 3 shot group. Adjust the scope as required. Your group should be 2.5" or less. If possible fire a group at 200 yards and zero the scope to hit point of aim at that range.
The next time you go to the raqnge, check to see if the rifle shoots to the same point of aim. If not, was it becasue of anenvironmental change, (wind or temperature) or did something change with the rifle. If it was the rifle, that is a problem that should be addressed.
Now get off the bench, and begin shooting from field positions.
Thank you very much for that Boomer...
I find that sighting in at 100 yards is difficult enough with my 3-9x, so I am not looking forward to making out the bullseye at 200..
I will go through all of those steps when I next sight in..
Demonical, is RepublicofAlberta a friend, or someone who would be able to do this for me as well? a gunsmith?
I find that sighting in at 100 yards is difficult enough with my 3-9x, so I am not looking forward to making out the bullseye at 200..
I will go through all of those steps when I next sight in..
Demonical, is RepublicofAlberta a friend, or someone who would be able to do this for me as well? a gunsmith?
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
I agree. Military high power competition is shot out to 1000 yards with iron sights. The bullseye size increases with distance and appears to be the same size in relation to the width of the front sight at each range. The center of the aiming point does not change, the center is always the center. On a deer sized animal the aiming point is about 12". A 12" bullseye would be visible out to 300 yards, and through a 9X scope out to 1000 yards. A 12" bullseye is a good size for the hunter to train on because at close range it teaches him to find the center of the target area. By the way, if you are hunting with a 3-9X power scope, carry the rifle with the scope set at 3X. If you see a game animal at close range you will never find it in the glass set at 9X, and you won't have time to turn it down. A long range shot normally gives you time to increase the power ring, and if it doesn't you were probably better to pass up the shot.
One often hears the advice to sight your rifle a couple of inches high at 100 yards and you'll be zeroed for 200. Sometimes this is true, but the only way to be sure you are zeroed for 200 is to shoot at 200. More importantly is that you can now go back to 25, 50, 100, and 150 and see what effect that sighting has at those ranges. Why a 200 yard zero? Because with the majority of modern big game cartridges a 200 yard zero gives you the best long range trajectory. This of course is dependent on the bullet you choose and the powder load behind that bullet, so your best practical range might be 180 yards or it might be 225 yards, and in some cases 250 yards. Regardless of how flat your trajectory though, an 8" group is the limit of your practical marksmanship range on game. Once the bullet strikes more than 4" away from your point of aim you no longer have a reasonable expectation of making a killing shot. So once you shoot an 8" group, that is your maximum range on game.
By the way, that 8" maximum should be shot from a field position, prone, sitting, kneeling, or standing; there are no bench rests in the field. It will become apparent very quickly that you can shoot better prone than you can standing. In the field however, the prone position is seldom available to us due to stuff getting in the way and blocking our sight of the target. The rule is if you can get closer, then get closer and if you can get lower, then get lower. The fact of the matter is that there are many people who never practice shooting from field positions, and have no idea if they can hit anything beyond 100 yards.
Do I shoot between heart beats? I suppose I do. If my heart beat bumps the reticle or front sight off the target, when it settles back onto the target I increase the pressure on the trigger, then hold again when it is bumped off. That is not to say that I release pressure on the trigger, that would cause me to have to start over each time, so what I do is increase pressure each time the reticle settles back into the bull. This is called an interrupted trigger squeeze. An uninterrupted trigger squeeze is when you add continuous pressure to the trigger until it breaks, with no pause. The only time I find that I use the interrupted method is when I shoot off hand. The sight wobbles around the bull, and I add pressure to the trigger, but I stop adding pressure if my heart beat or a gust of wind pushes me off target. Once the sight falls back onto the target I again increase pressure on the trigger. The sight will always fall back onto the target without fighting the rifle because I am using my natural point of aim. All this means is that my position relative to the target is such that when I totally relax the sight is on the target. If you work at finding your natural point of aim while on the range, it will feel natural when you are in the field. If the trigger does break when I'm off target, I am able to call my shot based on what I saw the instant before the trigger broke. From a slung up supported field position (prone, kneeling, sitting) I find that there is not much wobble, so I am able to press the trigger, uninterrupted, until it breaks once I am aligned on the target.
One often hears the advice to sight your rifle a couple of inches high at 100 yards and you'll be zeroed for 200. Sometimes this is true, but the only way to be sure you are zeroed for 200 is to shoot at 200. More importantly is that you can now go back to 25, 50, 100, and 150 and see what effect that sighting has at those ranges. Why a 200 yard zero? Because with the majority of modern big game cartridges a 200 yard zero gives you the best long range trajectory. This of course is dependent on the bullet you choose and the powder load behind that bullet, so your best practical range might be 180 yards or it might be 225 yards, and in some cases 250 yards. Regardless of how flat your trajectory though, an 8" group is the limit of your practical marksmanship range on game. Once the bullet strikes more than 4" away from your point of aim you no longer have a reasonable expectation of making a killing shot. So once you shoot an 8" group, that is your maximum range on game.
By the way, that 8" maximum should be shot from a field position, prone, sitting, kneeling, or standing; there are no bench rests in the field. It will become apparent very quickly that you can shoot better prone than you can standing. In the field however, the prone position is seldom available to us due to stuff getting in the way and blocking our sight of the target. The rule is if you can get closer, then get closer and if you can get lower, then get lower. The fact of the matter is that there are many people who never practice shooting from field positions, and have no idea if they can hit anything beyond 100 yards.
Do I shoot between heart beats? I suppose I do. If my heart beat bumps the reticle or front sight off the target, when it settles back onto the target I increase the pressure on the trigger, then hold again when it is bumped off. That is not to say that I release pressure on the trigger, that would cause me to have to start over each time, so what I do is increase pressure each time the reticle settles back into the bull. This is called an interrupted trigger squeeze. An uninterrupted trigger squeeze is when you add continuous pressure to the trigger until it breaks, with no pause. The only time I find that I use the interrupted method is when I shoot off hand. The sight wobbles around the bull, and I add pressure to the trigger, but I stop adding pressure if my heart beat or a gust of wind pushes me off target. Once the sight falls back onto the target I again increase pressure on the trigger. The sight will always fall back onto the target without fighting the rifle because I am using my natural point of aim. All this means is that my position relative to the target is such that when I totally relax the sight is on the target. If you work at finding your natural point of aim while on the range, it will feel natural when you are in the field. If the trigger does break when I'm off target, I am able to call my shot based on what I saw the instant before the trigger broke. From a slung up supported field position (prone, kneeling, sitting) I find that there is not much wobble, so I am able to press the trigger, uninterrupted, until it breaks once I am aligned on the target.
Slipery,
try this.
Clean the rifle with brand new bronze brush best you can, make sure you do not damage the barrel doing this.
Then take rifle to the range with someone who shoots well.
Let him shoot three shots first to foul the barrel.
Then, cool down the barrel but don't clean it.
After 20-30min, tell him to shoot three more rounds but for group.
Make sure the rifle has a good bench rest from the front and from the rear of the rifle.
Also, the trigger pull, I like mine at 3lbs MAX for my hunting rifles.
Good Luck
try this.
Clean the rifle with brand new bronze brush best you can, make sure you do not damage the barrel doing this.
Then take rifle to the range with someone who shoots well.
Let him shoot three shots first to foul the barrel.
Then, cool down the barrel but don't clean it.
After 20-30min, tell him to shoot three more rounds but for group.
Make sure the rifle has a good bench rest from the front and from the rear of the rifle.
Also, the trigger pull, I like mine at 3lbs MAX for my hunting rifles.
Good Luck
X2.
Check rests from Stoney Point, Hoppes, Caldwell. I use an old Hoppes front rest, which is a heavy tripod base with flat sand bag strapped to the top and use a Stoney Point front sandbag for the rear. Keeps the rifle nice and high on the bench. This helps keep me in good body alignment. I also place the front rest as far forward on the forearm as I can, to allow me room to hold the forearm where I would for normal field positions. Firm grip on the rifle and settled in to the bags.
You should find a club/range that has scheduled shooting times. That way you can go out meet other shooters, and will at the very least, learn a lot through osmosis.
A clue!
I shoot benchrest at 100yd with severe myopia, always shoot wearing my reading glasses, and my 3-9x is set to 9x. I can see every bullet hole. Clearly. (also a fly that sometimes sits on the paper)
I bet your scope is not properly focussed. Read the manufacturer's instructions for focus, (in the box) then do it.
Re sandbag rest; I use plastic foodstore bags with a shovel full of sand on pieces of wood the right height.
Not elegant, but it works & the price is right.
