IPSC, safety or no safety on pistol

D

draftstone

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Hi!

I will soon take my classes for restricted firearms and after that IPSC (I attended a couple of competitions and it seems really fun!) and I read in the rules from the range command and procedures section (http://www.ipsc.org/ipsc/handgun.php) that you have to show the official that you apply the safety on your pistol after loading the first round.

My question is, is it mandatory to have a pistol with a mechanical switch or lever as a safety or this rule is only there for pistols that do have a mechanical safety switch and if you have a pistol that does not have any switch, you obviously don't have to do this?

I am asking this because I am looking at some "beginner" pistols (I am looking at the Glock 17 and the Smith and Wesson M&P9) with which I could learn how to shoot properly and maybe attend my IPSC classes and first matches and those 2 pistols seems to not have any mechanical safety switch or lever. All the safety are embedded in the trigger mechanism. Also, those 2 pistol models do show up in the approved pistols for the production division.

So are those pistols without any mechanical safety switch/lever OK for IPSC and are they for all divisions or some divisions require a mandatory external safety mechanism?

Thanks a lot for taking the time helping me figure this out :)
 
If it has a manual safety you have to use it if not then you dont I do beleive but im not an expert I watched a couple matches and saw everything from glocks to berettas to 1911's
 
Ipsc has a list of approved firearms, check the website for the most current list. Many Glocks are approved.
 
draftstone said:
Hi!

I will soon take my classes for restricted firearms and after that IPSC (I attended a couple of competitions and it seems really fun!) and I read in the rules from the range command and procedures section (http://www.ipsc.org/ipsc/handgun.php) that you have to show the official that you apply the safety on your pistol after loading the first round.

My question is, is it mandatory to have a pistol with a mechanical switch or lever as a safety or this rule is only there for pistols that do have a mechanical safety switch and if you have a pistol that does not have any switch, you obviously don't have to do this?

I am asking this because I am looking at some "beginner" pistols (I am looking at the Glock 17 and the Smith and Wesson M&P9) with which I could learn how to shoot properly and maybe attend my IPSC classes and first matches and those 2 pistols seems to not have any mechanical safety switch or lever. All the safety are embedded in the trigger mechanism. Also, those 2 pistol models do show up in the approved pistols for the production division.

So are those pistols without any mechanical safety switch/lever OK for IPSC and are they for all divisions or some divisions require a mandatory external safety mechanism?

Thanks a lot for taking the time helping me figure this out :)
Click to expand...

All will be adressed on your BB course:):):):):)
 
sulisa said:
Ipsc has a list of approved firearms, check the website for the most current list. Many Glocks are approved.
Click to expand...

This is misleading, ANY centre fire pistol of 9mm or greater caliber can be used, the approved list is only for Production division. 1911 based guns are not on the approved production list but by far the most popular gun in IPSC.
 
Although there are many guns that can be used in divisions other than Production, the two guns that you explicitly mention are on the approved gun list for Production Division and can be used in that Division and possibly others. The full list of guns approved for use in Production division can be found at http://www.ipsc.org/rules/proddiv.php. You can count on anything in that list being something you can shoot IPSC with.
 
draftstone said:
Exactly! Thats why I am asking, I don't want to buy a gun which I won't be able to use and required to buy a second one :)
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I would seriously look at an STI Spartan and start in Classic Division. Down the road you can upgrade, and if you switch to Standard/Limited or Open you are already familiar with the platform. In Classic you can develop the gun along with your skills without fear of being bumped to Open....unless you do something like put optics or a comp in it...lol
 
PapaHotel01 said:
I would seriously look at an STI Spartan and start in Classic Division. Down the road you can upgrade, and if you switch to Standard/Limited or Open you are already familiar with the platform. In Classic you can develop the gun along with your skills without fear of being bumped to Open....unless you do something like put optics or a comp in it...lol
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...unless your gun with inserted mag doesn't fit the box
...unless you screw position of your equipment
...unless you put more rounds in your mag then declared power factor allows
...unless number of other issues that could bump you to open

The point is, you should know the rules and apply them accordingly.

Aqualung said:
I agree. And the SA trigger on 1911s is MUCH easier to learn on than Glock or M&P triggers.
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You should also know that light trigger is also MUCH easier to acquire bad habits and even harder to unlearn them later.

Generally, for new inexperienced shooters, not having to operate safety and having 5lb trigger pull for first shot is an additional safety net.

Also, having harder trigger will either make you frustrated very quick or will teach you great trigger discipline.
 
The Spartan or most 1911's usually come from the factory with a 4.5-5lb+ trigger with a safety. Any trigger with a safety that needs to be manually switched off is always going to be safer than one without. And unlike Production where you are stuck with a 5lb first pull, once you have progressed past being a novice you can adjust it. In fact pretty much everything on the gun can be adjusted as long as it fits in the box (just like Standard) light triggers, Bomar type sights machined into the slide, skateboard tape wherever you want it, you can add serrations, engraving, refinish, non factory parts, almost anything goes. Yup, you can't move holster too far forward or out (just like standard and production) you have to fit in the box (just like standard) and you have to be aware of mag cap rules (like production outside of Canada) and you can't lighten the slide with slide lightening cuts or run a thumb ledge, or a slide racker, but that's the only real prohibited mods besides comps and optics, anything else goes.
 
for the OP. if your intentions are to shoot IPSC then i would suggest you talk to either local IPSC Shooters or a Black Badge Instructor to make sure you get the right gear. Most local IPSC Shooters will not only be willing to give you advice but can probably arrange for you to try a few guns to see what you like. If you are close to an IPSC club odds are they will have some sort of league or practice night and most will welcome new shooters.

Drop me a PM telling me where you are and i can probably put you in touch with people in your area.
 
If you own a handgun now: use that for the Black Badge course.

If you do not own a handgun now: buy one, and learn how to use it for a while (6 months? a year?) so that you can "walk before you run". Pat is correct that Spartan is a good starting point, as would be a Glock. Both of them won't cost a fortune, have accessories available, and retain their value, should you decide for some other gun after taking the BB course.

-ivan-
 
skoal said:
If it has a manual safety you have to use it if not then you dont I do beleive but im not an expert I watched a couple matches and saw everything from glocks to berettas to 1911's
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not true about the manual saftey having to be used, shadows have a manual saftey but in production you start hammer down and dont need to start with the saftey on (not that you could anyways, since it cant be engaged with the hammer down but if it could you still wouldnt need to)
 
PapaHotel01 said:
The Spartan or most 1911's usually come from the factory with a 4.5-5lb+ trigger with a safety. Any trigger with a safety that needs to be manually switched off is always going to be safer than one without.
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Arguably. We have seen people shooting themselves in the foot after switching that safety off before bringing gun up... It will require more effort with production gun. Unless you're trying to holster gun with your finger on the trigger. :)

PapaHotel01 said:
And unlike Production where you are stuck with a 5lb first pull, once you have progressed past being a novice you can adjust it. In fact pretty much everything on the gun can be adjusted as long as it fits in the box (just like Standard) light triggers, Bomar type sights machined into the slide, skateboard tape wherever you want it, you can add serrations, engraving, refinish, non factory parts, almost anything goes...
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Sure, you can do all that with your gun, or you can just learn how to shoot.
 
I have to question the advice that PapaHotel01 is giving.
Newbie with 7 posts.???

Not sure if you really know anything.
:)
 
euxx said:
Arguably. We have seen people shooting themselves in the foot after switching that safety off before bringing gun up... It will require more effort with production gun. Unless you're trying to holster gun with your finger on the trigger. :)



Sure, you can do all that with your gun, or you can just learn how to shoot.
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Not sure how you can argue a 5lb trigger with no safety would be safer than a 5lb trigger with a safety....
And once you have gotten past being a newb, who wants to shoot a slug of a gun with a 5lb trigger?
Sure you can have fun in IPSC with one, but you're not racing until you are running a trigger that is capable of going below 2lbs. :D
 
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